Has anyone else been forced to become Conservative after all of this?

[ponderingsoul]

Probably the wrong wording, but I'm curious - after always considering myself fairly left wing/ liberal and generally voting Labour (or tactically Lib Dem when I was in the SW), I no longer really consider them a valid option for me because of their gender views/ inability to take a view.

Has this happened to anyone else? Never thought I'd be a Tory, but now feel like I have no choice as this issue is so important to me.

@SammyScrounge @HathorsFigTree you're buying into the culture wars. Politicians love it if they can gain support by stirring up this kind of thing rather than having to talk about the hard stuff - care, health, education, taxation etc.

And as a Bristol resident, I get really pissed off when people are the toppling of the Colston statue as some sudden mob action. Did you know that groups had been civilly, politely, gently trying to get the statue taken down for about twenty years before that? Or even a plaque added to acknowledge Colston's role in slavery. They got nowhere. In the middle of our city there was a man who traded in human beings, including children, many of whom died in squalid conditions on slave ships. Polite action did nothing.

I don't see how acknowledging the role of slavery and empire in our past is grovelling. It's fact, we just wanted to look the other way for a long time.

Well I do think the most important thing is to vote for the person that understands science and has common sense, that's Rishi.

What the hell is wrong with people? You'd re-elect a corrupt and cruel government just because they mouth some soundbites which appeal to your dislike of trans women?

I am politically homeless. Would never vote Tory. Look how many things have gone to shit on their watch

I started a few years ago, mainly to try oust SNP, and will continue to do so - no other options. I don't see the relevance of people spoiling their votes - I don't suppose anyone reads them so why waste time going?

Spoilt votes are counted. A good agent will read them and take note. Agree there's not much to be done about the lazy ones who don't think there's anything to learn.

A spoilt vote is still a wasted vote though,” it’s not going to make any party change their stance.

I'd have more sympathy for @Squamata 's post if Labour / Greens / LibDem had not been taking refuge in culture wars for years themselves.

Not really a substitute for solid economic policies . Like a serious social housing programme or nationalising railways.

Kenan Malik wrote a great article ' Why culture wars only work for the Right' - from memory. But I can't find it now 😭

Unless tory policies on other crucial areas of life align with your views, it would be utterly ridiculous to vote tory based on one issue.

I’m a floating voter but I can confidently say there’s nothing that would ever make me vote for the conservatives.

I've moved, over a number of years from being a labour voter to being much more small c conservative in my views.

This issue has been one of reasons for that.

Many of you act as if Labours support of self id is just a separate aberration from their philosophy. It's not.

Old fashion socialism was identify politics based on economics, but at the core it's based on the idea of oppressed and oppressors. This philosophy on the left has now just shifted to different identities beyond economics as oppressed and oppressor.

If your philosophy is based around trying to identify the most oppressed identity, then you of course end up seeking out smaller and smaller groups at the fringes of society who claim to be more and more marginal than anyone else.

You throw in some pure social constructionism, 'lived experience' is everything, and you've got many new Most Oppressed groups.

Labour's support for Trans self id is a feature not a bug.

I've moved away from this thinking, as it's become clearer to me what it is, and now am more conservative, meaning: I think there is reality, I think trying to force utopia from the top down is dangerous, I think many societal structures are important and necessary even if they don't work for everyone, I think we should accommodate the fringe but not allow it to control society.

Saying all that I think the current Tory party are a waste of space. Even on this issue they've allowed it to develop and won't get on with sorting it out. I want action.

The Tories have also been infected by the belief that acceptance of everyone is the only 'kind' position and they want to avoid being the 'nasty' party and they're only just waking up from this with the likes of Badenoch and Braverman being prepared to withstand the onslaught from the left they will get if they point out reality.

This thinking is still all over this thread. It honestly baffles me how anyone can see how Labour have supported self id but then still believe they are morally superior to the Tories.
It's illogical.

I am going to vote on the Tory because of this issue and the views expressed by the local labour candidate and labour HQ. I have never voted tory before but to me this issue is the most important issue - I feel sad about this especially as I am in a marginal constituency.

Have you even read the many contributions of people who have posted here? Many of us have been spoiling our ballots for years - for the reason that democracy has to mean something; and why would anyone vote for a political party who is committed to an ideology that will, and is, resulting in the erasure of women as a sex class?

Because some men want to be called women, it means that women have to be referred to as 'cis'; and because some women don't want to be called women, it means that the words woman, girls, mother are effectively censured and replaced by insulting and redictive 'neutral' language.

When Eddie Izzard would potentially be counted as a female member of parliament; and when men win awards that were meant to celebrate women - what would you call that? And why would you vote for this if you fundamentally cared about women as a distinct group of human being?

Do you care about the women in prison forced to share a shower with a man who uses the opportunity to intimidate her? Do you care about the girls forced to use a mixed sex toilet at school? Do you care about the women who will be excluded should males be permitted into their single sex swimming sessions?

I'm not sure how long is it have you been involved with women's issues
but If you care about women how can you ignore their concerns, their dignity or their erasure?

I have fuck all patience for people who think that if I prioritise one thing then I must have no interest or concern for anything else. Women's rights and self ID are the hill I'm prepared to die on. Vote according to your own conscience and fuck off judging others.

This!

When have the Conservatives said they are going to restrict abortion access?

Individual MPs have their own private beliefs - and so, for example, Labour MP Frank Field, who is a catholic, is opposed to abortion, as Is Jacob Rees Mogg, as was the former Lib Dem leader.....A lot was made of SNP Katie Forbes personal religious commitment but she never made a public issue of it, nor de she suggest she would be repealing any laws should she be leader. Meanwhile Humza Yousaf is a Muslim and as such is opposed to gay marriage and abortion but that didn't stop him being elected as leader of the SNP.

People are entitled to their own beliefs - but the issue of abortion in Britain is settled. I wish people would stop adopting U.S political positions.

No because I’m more concerned about other issues/policies.

Nope. I'm politically homeless. Used to be a Labour/Lib Dem voter, but I would never even consider voting Conservative.

I'm a lifelong green/Labour voter however as a female and mum of girls, my number 1 is retaining womens rights and their ability to have safe spaces and protections. So I am probably going to vote Tory for the first time ever, as whilst NHS is important, I want to be able to request a woman for a smear, or a rape kit, or an intimate exam and know I am getting a woman with the same body as me, not one with a penis 🙄
I care that women from ethnic minority or different religious backgrounds can access things like public toilets, gyms, etc.
Everything else pales if I can't even define myself and risk being fired for stating obvious biological truths.

I want the indoctrination out of our schools. I want the mInstreaming of kink and perversion to be out of schools. I want it ok for lesbians to say they are attracted to women and that doesn't include Penis.
I want paedophilia back in its box and well away from my kids.
I see labour, lib dem and greens doing nothing for women except working to strip them of all rights.

It seems a bit rich for people who are actively engaged in pushing certain cultural narratives to be so dismissive of those that question them.

No I’m not a Conservative and find it insulting if anyone suggests that believing in women and girls rights means you must be right wing.

I’m not sure who I’ll vote for but it won’t be for the Torys. I may spoil my ballot.

I was learning about slavery and 'the triangular trade' in my junior school in the 1970's. And Alex Haley's 'Roots' was one of the most watched TV series at around the same time.There has been a slavery museum in Liverpool since 2007 and there had been black history months for many years before that. Liverpool decided it didn't need to topple statues and that education was a better way forward.

It is U.S political culture thatis now pushing this narrative along with the adoption of U.S created critical race theory. That some people push back against this group identity style politics does not make them manipulated by 'right wing media'.

In fact the slavery museum in Liverpool has been existence since the 1980's but in 2007 developed its distinct identity as separate from the Maritime Museum.

Yes, the people of Bristol want to topple the statue while still enjoying living in the properties he built. Hypocrites.

How about you tear down everything he built, do a deep dive into everything he gave to Bristol and wreck them, instead of continuing to enjoying it all while you try to disassociate from this beneficiary of the city and how that wealth was gained?

Hypocrites. That statue belongs as a reminder that your nice stuff has a dark past.

The Conservatives have not said they are going to restrict abortion. You can obviously pick Tory MPs whose personal views are anti-abortion but you can do that for other parties. When Stella Creasey was campaigning re NI abortion rights it was a cross party group which had the support of Andrea Ledsome and Sir Peter Bottomly.

I think it's actually down to a lot more than purely that. I think what the tories have come to represent for particular demographics who feel threatened by the force of societal change and how it risks upending everything they felt was 'normal' is a very real thing.