Would you go into a mens toilet for the Gender Critical cause?

[Isheabastard]

I am Gender critical.

I have a lot of sympathy for people with true gender dysphoria. Any one who has had bottom surgery (penis removal) would be welcome in my private spaces. However I admit it’s not always easy to separate who’s who.

I also believe that most people underestimate the lengths predators will go to to have access to women and children.

It has occurred to me that if ‘men’ are able to go into womens loos, then women should be able to go into mens loos. Especially when the womens loos have become ‘mixed’, but the mens has been left untouched.

I know most women would say “Yuck that’s just not something we want to do”, but hear me out. I am an older overweight grey haired woman. If I put on a mannish jacket and tie, popped on a man’s hat and a ludicrous fake beard or moustache, went into the mens loos, went past the men at the urinals and into a cubicle, do you think the men would feel the same discomfiture as women feel when the opposite happens?

I think as long as the woman was way past being attractive she would probably be safe enough, especially if safeguards were used. Suggestions gratefully received.

A bit of me wants to do this to ‘take one for the team’, but honestly I’m too much of a coward.

Is there anyone out there who thinks like me, and even more important anyone out there that thinks they could actually do this?

Or am I being a mad as a box of frogs, post menopausal crazy cat lady?

I would feel threatened in the men's toilets. That's why I want single sex spaces. If I went into the mens, I feel like that would undermine the point that I need single sex toilets. Sorry.

Once there was a man in the ladies then I would feel safer in the men's than the ladies

And I'd like men to understand how uncomfortable it can be

Nope. I won't use men's spaces for many of the same reasons that I dont want men using women's.

1. Men are entitled to same sex privacy and dignity. My poor father would be appalled and would self-exclude from a men's room if he thought women would be in there.
2. Men who have had "bottom surgery" or consented to castration.... are still men. So, no, not welcome in my female spaces.
3. " if ‘men’ are able to go into womens loos, then women should be able to go into mens loos "... false equivalency. Men have always had access to public toilets- women not. Access to single-sex toilets in schools, workplace, public places, is an important factor in enabling women to take part in public life like : education, government, work, healthcare etc.
4. " do you think the men would feel the same discomfiture as women feel when the opposite happens "... if they cop that you are a lady, then I expect that they will feel equivalent levels of discomfiture. What they won't feel is fear, nor are they likely to be triggered.
5. " as long as the woman was way past being attractive she would probably be safe enough " .... could not be further from reality.

So, yes, mad as a box of frogs or disingenuous.

What is your goal, and how will this action help you achieve it? The men's toilet might be empty. The men in there might just want to mind their own business and resent any attempt by you to try to talk to them abut something they see as a women's rights issue.

Man Friday was successful because they had a goal in mind, and communicated to people about what they were doing and why.
www.networkforgood.com/resource/successful-campaign-planning/

If I see more and more men using women's toilets when out I think I may start using the men's....if they complain I'll tell them that we have men in our female toilets and that I fear for my safety, dignity and all that when in there. For me those men in women spaces know they shouldn't be there and are not welcome, what does that say about them when they ignore our feelings? Does it suggest they are trustworthy? I think not. I've never wanted uni-sex toilets unless its those single rooms with proper doors etc but if men are already in our safe spaces then that's what they are already. It's a disgrace what's happening. If we women have to put up with men in our spaces then men will have to put up with us in theres. If they don't like it then they need to speak up and defend us and themselves against this sh*t.

Men deserve to have same sex spaces as well as women having them - privacy and dignity works both ways.

The men using the men's facilities are not the ones invading our spaces and trampling our boundaries.

Yes men deserve their privacy and dignity along with women but women haven't got that anymore, so why should we leave it like that? Men getting their privacy and dignity but ours taken away, where is the fairness?? Oh yes, poor men as always. Men first.

A toilet is a toilet, @Isheabastard

What a bizarre post. As I said - the men minding their business in the men's loos are NOT the men invading our spaces and causing issues. And you may disagree with me that both men and women deserve the privacy and dignity of single sex spaces but I think that they do.

I have no desire to share loos with men and would not deliberately go out of my way to use a men's loo - I would feel both uncomfortable and unsafe. I also know that the decent men I know and love would be very uncomfortable with this.

We need to get men (whatever they are wearing) OUT of our spaces and back in to their own. How we do this is the hard part.

I think it could be spun so it backfires, to show that women are fine with sharing toilets with men. It might work if it was organised and no-one else was allowed to twist the narrative.

If there are any posters on this thread that haven't already, would you please consider following the link below and signing the petition to strengthen the Equality Act. Also, consider sharing it, if you can.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard/4722618-petition-to-update-the-equality-act-thread-2?page=37&reply=124396563

Thank you.

I don't like this idea at all. We are becoming as bad as them if we do this IMO. We need to stay classy.

I wouldn't. I agree with posters who say men are entitled to privacy and dignity too and I remember how self conscious my son was when he was a teenager.

Exactly. Using men’s toilet facilities (unless in extremis) is totally counterproductive. Women need women only toilet spaces. Men don’t care because we are not a threat in the same way males are to women and girls.

Hi OP, you must have missed the memo where it said that we no longer have to apologise for being GC. No need for the

I have a lot of sympathy for people with true gender dysphoria. Any one who has had bottom surgery (penis removal) would be welcome in my private spaces. However I admit it’s not always easy to separate who’s who.

I'd prefer to go into the men's with another woman or two but yes, wouldn't bother me at all. Although the stench might make me sick.

Seems pointless. If you don't feel uncomfortable or threatened by men in the men's toilets then you can hardly argue that you feel uncomfortable or threatened by transwomen in the ladies, without seeming like a transphobe surely

I wouldn't.

Lots of men are GC and although there are clearly many men happy to push the TWAW narrative and shout at women on twitter, there are just as many women doing the same (sadly). I suspect the full on TRA men are less likely to be bothered by women in the loos so you would be punishing the wrong people.

Also it would absolutely be twisted/misunderstood. Even the Man Friday protests - though I think still worth it (and hilarious), were misunderstood by many initially - if you look at the comments under the daily mail article about it there are loads of people saying "typical feminists. There would be hell to pay if men were in the women's pool" etc. Completely missing the point that there are. And that was a much more focussed protest

The only time there might be a case for it is if there were a lot of men in the women's already. I would actually prefer to be in a confined space with men who weren't trying to share the toilets with women than with those who had gone out of their way to do so.

I've been into a men's loo at events on a couple of occasions in the past - just because the queue for the women's was ridiculous. I used a cubicle. It was no big deal. I am broadly gender critical, but I think too much fuss is made about loos and unisex ones would be fine.

I have used mens toilets loads. They have had years and years of women just nipping in while them not being allowed in the girls. Communal is the way forward. Everyone should share the luxury of queuing.

Probably picking a fight with the wrong people, as most of the men will believe in protecting single sex spaces anyway.

This is it for me. I wouldn't go in the mens to make a point but I would if there were men in the women's as then I (and my small child) would be safer in the mens. Not only is the risk that any individual man in the mens is a predator lower (because they're not in a toilet clearly labelled 'women's' plus the stats) but also there's more chance of a decent bloke who could take on someone like Dolatowski (who I think is well over 6ft) if he tried to attack me or my child. And the deterrent of there being other large blokes around cannot be discounted either.

There are still a lot of decent men out there - sadly a lot of them are blind to the impact of gender id on women and children.

But it wouldn't have to be 'a lot' of men in the women's it would have to be just one. Any member of the male sex who chooses to ignore that many women for trauma, safety, religious or dignity and privacy reasons want single sex for themselves AND for their small children is not a safe man to be around.

I have, on several occasions when there was a huge queue for the ladies , but only when accompanied by DH. He went first, checked there was none at the urinals and said loudly, my wife is having to use this because of the queque.

I think Antonia Fraser once organised a mass inrush at the National Theatre, for a similar reason.

The fine young men of ManFriday did indeed do this: at the Houses of Parliament in June 2018.