Kelly Holmes changes her mind on trans inclusion in women's sports?

[HootyMcboob76]

"Equally, the vast majority of sport is played on a local playing field where taking part and inclusion, as well as physical and mental health benefits are perhaps more important than winning.’"
www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/dame-kelly-holmes-admits-she-was-previously-ignorant-about-trans-athletes/ar-AA16qIej?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=669f524540e644eeb669ce51f43b9e00

I read this as her saying that women should just be grateful to be playing, never mind if a biological male beats them! In other words, be kind, shut up, and be prepared to lose out on a medal, as long as the special male athlete gets to participate.

She is now a proud member of the special community so apparently a gay woman cannot continue to fight for women's sports being for women?

Other gay female athletes (e.g. Martina Navratilova) have still been able to say that natal males should not be included in women's sports.

Does anyone read this article differently?

Trans athletes can compete with their own sex - it’s not hard! If men aren’t accommodating TW in sort that is not women’s problem to solve

deeply disappointed in dame Kelly but then she no longer competes and she’s got her medals so no skin off her nose to chuck women & girls sorting aspirations under the bus as unimportant.

Kelly’s just been on holiday with Linda Riley, editor of Diva. She’s also got a younger girlfriend, she’s been re-educated. If she truly cared about non elite sport she’d acknowledge her time at park run when she completes one when she doesn’t go fast to prove that it’s the taking part which counts.

I read that report from the ice hockey match and found the account from the injured player so odd. The video evidence clearly showed the opponent causing the clash. Why is she a) down playing the injury and b) blaming it on the way she fell? Anyone would think she'd been given an incentive of some kind??

@gogohmm your relative would do well to read up on the research by Dr Elisabeth Williams at Swansea University on concussion in female rugby players.

Her work is based on females playing against other females. The effects noted and studied will be greater in a biological female playing against males.

rugby is a strange example because of the safety implications. eg a couple of weekends ago my son's junior football team wouldn't let their best player take the field until someone could rustle up a pair of shinpads for him, the reason being that the club's insurance (paid for out of fairly modest team subs), which in extremis will cover a parent's lost wages if they have to stay at home looking after a kid with a newly broken leg, wouldn't pay out if they knew a player had got injured whilst not wearing skin shin pads. would insurance really pay out if a female player had been knocked into next week by a male player?

Sportswomen need to start litigating. Sue the trans person, sue the coaches, sue the league, sue the governing body for putting biological women in harms way on ideological grounds. Failure to protect women from physical harm and injury by enrolling them in mixed-sex sports by stealth.

Once these people find themselves in court, they might not want to be so kind.

This is only going to get worse. As more trans people appear openly in society, more people will want to play on opposite sex teams and the potential for injuries increases massively.

Didn't see this before I posted. This is my husband's argument - we don't need to worry, money will fix it. Clubs will be told by insurance providers that if they field a trans player, they won't be insured. Club can't risk it. Trans player quietly asked to step aside.

I think this is the wrong approach - it's discrimination by stealth. Trans players need to understand the issues and agree to compete in birth sex categories.

Kelly Holmes fastest 800m :1 .56

mens fastest 800m : 1.40

Kelly Holmes fastest 1500m :3.57

mens fastest 1500m : 3.26

I don’t think you would have got much public recognition for those times Kelly if you were competing against biological men.

Be thankful you managed to squeeze in an amazing career doing what you love before this madness hit. So sorry you feel it’s now time for denying future female athletes the same opportunity.

Does THIS look like the face of a person who is "just happy to be taking part" or does it look like the face of a woman who just won a gold medal and was incredibly proud that her years of training had paid off and that she WON against other females on a level playing field?

Seriously, she can take her "nuance" and shove it where the sun don't shine.

Yep. Depriving women at all levels of the joy and sense of achievement at winning.

Anyone would think she'd been given an incentive of some kind??

The incentive would be that if she were to even hint at the suggestion there might be a problem with males competing against females she'd be spurned as a transphobic bigot by the people she's decided to associate with.

Anyone that uses that weird phrase 'trans siblings' to means trans people in general, not one's own relatives, has probably been re-educated. No-one talks like that in the real world.

Disappointing.

Kelly’s best 800m time of 1.56.21 ranks 2nd in the U.K. and joint 34th in the world - all-time list.

last year alone in just the U.K. that time was beaten by 352 men. The global figure would likely be several thousand.

As PPs have pointed out here, part of the fun in sports is competing. If you haven’t a chance of winning because you’re females and competing against a male, it’s pointless. You have no right to tell women they should give up that enjoyment.

If winning isn't the point don't count goals or points, don't record times. You'd still be taking part in the activity.

Makes most team games pretty futile, mind.

It's beyond disappointing. Is it more important that a man gets to play women's sports, at the risk of women's health? I guess it is. Poor little man can't be discriminated against, can he, even if all the women playing against him are at risk of serious injury. Thanks for reminding women that they're second-class citizens and their health and safety is secondary to men's feelings Kelly.

No. No...

People just want to go for a run or kick a ball with no spirit of competition, don't you all know! People just having a fun match with other people and ALL those involved agree. Because, when asked, they ALL agree! No pressure, no feeling like they need to agree. They just do. Honest!

You do usually see this argument from someone who does not play sport and it is sometimes from people who shunned sport because of their own issue with sport.

As has been mentioned many times now on social media, on MN, everywhere. If trans people don't want to win, just compete, why don't they still play with their sex?

Or, is somebody deviating from 'not one trans person denies their sex'! Did someone not get the memo?

The arguments fail the logic test when it is scrutinised.

If it is 'just' about participation, then develop mixed sex versions of contact sports where needed, and have mixed sex teams. Oh wait.... those are quite often available... why aren't those males in those mixed sex teams...

I no longer do competitive sport, but when i did i had one goal in mind: winning. As did all my competitors. Sure we looked at things like PB, but to misquote Kate Moss "Nothing tastes as good as winning feels"

There is a reason that so many footballers take off their runners up medal when they have left the podium. People who do sports want to win.
And sure, when kids are small, or you know they're not brilliant and so on, it is absolutely valid and good to assure participants that taking part is the main thing. It really isn't when you get to the top reaches.

Anyone who ever said to me "oh but it's the taking part that counts" when i hadn't won? i would have probably nutted them.

Plus, of course, there’s the getting undressed/showering together aspect to look forward to In the female changing room afterwards.

mrshoho · Today 10:36

I read that report from the ice hockey match and found the account from the injured player so odd. The video evidence clearly showed the opponent causing the clash. Why is she a) down playing the injury and b) blaming it on the way she fell? Anyone would think she'd been given an incentive of some kind??

I was beaten to it, but I suspect it was more stick than carrot: "Say what we tell you and you can carry on playing."

Looking at it charitably, concussion often goes along with amnesia about the event that caused it.

Could always watch the video as an aide-memoire.

Oh. That explains it. For a lesbian, Riley sure hates other women.

Coward bowing to the male mob

Very very disappointed

I’m really sad about this. Every time sometime seemingly relatable and likeable in the public eye betrays women it’s awful.

Kelly Holmes you have thrown women under the bus. You have bowed down to male rule and betrayed women everywhere.