Drop the Queer

[pattihews]

Census results indicate that only 15,000 people in the UK identify as Queer. That's 0.02% of the population. In 2021 179, 000 people identified as Jedi Knights. There's room for 90,000 people in Wembley Stadium.

Stonewall's definition of Queer is:
Queer is a term used by those wanting to reject specific labels of romantic orientation, sexual orientation and/or gender identity. It can also be a way of rejecting the perceived norms of the LGBT community (racism, sizeism, ableism etc)
which rather confirms that Queer means anything anyone wants it to mean.

Why are Stonewall and other groups putting so much time into a tiny number of people who could have very little in common with each other?

15,000 people who are "queer" and I'd bet my bottom dollar at least 10,000 of those are straight...

It can also be a way of rejecting the perceived norms of the LGBT community (racism, sizeism, ableism etc)

Are they perceived norms of the LGBT community?

So Stonewall can make more money by shoving as many people under the queer umbrella, now that boring gays and lesbians have the same rights as everyone.

Yes, that's a bit blood insulting, isn't it — suggesting that racism, ableism and sizeism are endemic in LGB communities. I think lesbians accept women of all shapes and sizes, despite the current trend among the 30-45 brigade to look very straight. I think in certain sections of the gay community there's pressure to be slim and muscular, but then there's the bear brigade. I'd say the LGB community reflects wider society generally.

And I'd bet mine that they use the term "Queer" because (1) they think it makes them special and (2) they have no personalities of their own so they have to have an identity.

I hate the word, it was an insult when I was a child and should be left in the past IMO.

More important than any of this, why should anyone be lobbying for special rights for such a tiny, disparate group of people who've gathered under a meaningless banner?

Not to mention that many L & G people have repeatedly asked for it not to be used as it's a slur with a lot of history to many who aren't bright exciting young things and remember actual oppression.

But the TQ+ politics as per usual have no interest in lived experience or deeply held feelings or language choices of others, only ever of themselves.

I wince when I hear that word - what an insult to all those in the 70's, 80's and 90's who were insulted and assulted by those using it. including my poor friend Andy who was set upon and kicked half to death.
Shame on Stonewall.

I had the impression ‘Queer’ was now the fashionable, arty way to say homosexual.

yes, you don't get to 'reclaim' queer unless you have actually had it said to you as an insult

If you're a female homosexual the TQ+ political lobby would prefer you to say that you're 'queer'. Saying that you're 'lesbian' if you're female implies that you're one of those stroppy exclusionary cows who won't open their legs on command for males. When I say prefer, this request can come with rape and death threats.

The thing is, often reaching out to that 0.02% entails alienating a whole separate chunk of people.

A while back I was on an online moderated support chat room for people with one of a particular group of sexual orientations, and having a particular issue, and the staff facilitator in the chat room was very surprised when I reacted with upset and offence to him referring to me specifically as queer, when I'd used entirely different words to refer to myself.

The facilitator seemed shocked, as though it was entirely unexpected for me to feel upset when I go somewhere for support, and the staff member refers to me, in front of me, using a "reclaimed" historic term of homophobic abuse, without asking me.

I'm not even that old, but for me "queer" is a term of abuse first and foremost when applied directly to an individual, and its use by activists through the twentieth century has mostly rested on that shock value.

I can also see the value of reclaimed words within a community between individuals who know the others are on board with that use (though I have a feeling that many of the people who have "reclaimed" the word are not of the group who would've been targeted with it in the past).

I don't expect a paid support professional to call me queer.

I've never been back, or to any other similar support services, because I don't know now whether I'll get sudden unexpected homophobic slurs thrown at me — these things can be more upsetting when you're expecting an atmosphere of open acceptance, kind of like you're not braced against the possibility.

sorry that happened to you...have you made a complaint? people like that need feedback

The census only allowed respondents to select one option, didn't it? Many gay and lesbian people are quite happy with the broader identity queer but would select gay / lesbian out of precision in this scenario.

Similar to how respondents selecting Welsh/ Scottish/ English as an identity might also identify with being British, but if not given the option of selecting more than one choice might, for precision, go for those options.

You will also see that 7.47% respondents did not answer and it is thought that lesbian, gay and queer identifying respondents are overrepresented in this figure due to historic discrimination by authorities against them and unwillingness to declare.

Oh it was ages ago, I don't even remember which specific service; I just avoid it all now. I'm not part of "the community", I'm just not straight. I just wanted to show my own example of how it can alienate some of us, even people like me who know all the stuff about insider language and reclaiming, who know about queer theory, who are young enough never to have had it said to them as an intended insult, and who have been around plenty of people who don't mind using it about themselves.

Did Stonewall seriously claim this about the community they are meant to be representing and champion?!

I have seen some US politicians use the term 'queer' for the whole alphabet list, which suggests that their woke advisors use it that way. But then also Latinx gets used, despite the majority of Hispanic people not liking it.

Completely agree. Sadly I am widely perceived to be a part of the 'Queer' set by those who actually are 😡

I honestly find the replies disgusting and degrading. Even if there was only one queer person in the whole country, we should still support that person.
15,000 is a large number - and do you know why they need support as queer people?
Take a guess. It's because of blatant homophobia like this which makes this country a hostile place to live in
Educate yourself and grow up.

There's a lot of homosexual people finding it offensive. There are people right on this thread who are homosexual finding it offensive.

Why is it never one of them and their support that matters?

Educate yourself on LG people for a change. The world is not all and only about TQ+ people.

So perhaps you can answer the question. What is Queer? How would anyone know they're Queer?

Lots of Queer people are straight. I've sat on committees with Queer men and Queer women who've gone home with their straight partners at the end of the day. What makes straight people Queer? I'm lesbian, by the way. The lesbian women I know who call themselves Queer are lesbians who, for whatever reason, don't like using the word lesbian. I know quite a few gay men, many of them a lot younger than me, and none of them call themselves Queer. So what is Queer?

I'm a Lesbian and loathe it.
But them I'm a cranky 2nd wave Lesbian who isn't attracted to men in dresses.

I'm curious whether if you reject the term 'queer' you get accusations of wrongthink?