I have to ask elderly patients for their gender identity

[Crabbyboot]

Please can I have some advice on this, I have been told by my boss that i have to ask our elderly patients for their gender identity when they come to see us. Without giving too much away I don't work in the UK so I am not NHS. My boss also does not agree with this but she says we need to do it as the regulators require it as part of our standards. Bearing in mind that we are a medical department I feel that this is highly unscientific. Also given the demographic of our patients it is inappropriate. I don't know if I should bother fighting this, or if it is just something I let go and accept. If I fight it I would like some help to articulate myself properly and in a way that is legal so I can't loose my job. I partly feel like just complying but insisting that everyone at work refers to me as a he/him/his just to prove how silly it is.

You can imagine the conversation with an 80 year old man.
What is your gender identity?

What's that?

Do you wear women's clothing ever?

How funny.

The assumption that you are going to explain gender identity if the patient doesn't know is interesting. This can go in any direction at all!

@Hepwo don't forget that anyone can identify as an other than themselves gender regardless of clothes, Arnold Schwarzenegger could identify as female tomorrow and remain exactly as he is.

My elderly parents, both of whom had dementia, would have found that distressing, not for ideological reasons, but because it was one more question they were being asked when they found being questioned stressful because they could not hear and were often confused about the answers because of their dementia. Unless the questions were to measure dementia or test memory we, as their carers, used to help out by answering or repeating the question or similar. I can imagine that in these situations the asker might receive some terse responses. My parents were never asked for their sex in face to face questionnaires when the interviewer was facing them because it was so bloody obvious.

How ridiculous! As if someone with dementia would want to start contemplating their gender identity.

100% agree with this is so confusing for them. We already have to ask questions about data sharing and consent which is a lot to take in for many of them.

It's a ridiculous question to have to ask, but my guess is that if they're not familiar with the term 'gender identity', they'll most likely assume it's 'gender' as a euphemism for sex and answer man or woman - maybe with some puzzlement that you can't tell.

My elderly relatives know all about ‘the issue’ and would either take the piss / give a facetious answer / subject you to a rant. Don’t assume all elderly people would find it confusing! My DF took great delight in crafting a reply to an email with a ‘she/her’ (from an old fashioned type of woman) after the name recently.

You mentioned that you are not in the UK.
It all depends on the organisation you work in and the law and regulation applicable where you are.What country are you in?

Who even cares if you ask or not? Who is actually going to be bothered to check or who is going to be bothered to complain if you don't ask. This stupid gender talk is just a phase, an embarrassing one at that, of which society will grow out of in few years, hopefully sooner rather than later!
Just don't ask

I worked in a hospital before gender identity became a big issue. What was an issue was ethnicity/nationality. I have seen rows where a receptionist asked a patient for their nationality. The patient would state their nationality was English and the receptionist told them that there was no such thing as English. The list the receptionist had to complete had British or white British as an option rather than English. The receptionist should just have ticked the British box instead of starting a row.

I sincerely hope my patients do take the piss I would happily write down their comments. I didn't mean to sound like I thought all patients would be confused, just that I work with a lot that are.

Would rather not say incase it is outing but happy to go by what the UK says to get a vague idea

Down right disrespectful but of course we have to pander to the minority

I have elderly relatives that aren't up on current gender issues and would assume their femininity / masculinity was being queried. I can just imagine them speaking to me afterwards and saying something along the lines of "isn't it obvious I'm a woman/man?".

I'd point blank refuse to facilitate this absolute bollocks

Worlds gone mad hasn’t it?

Especially as these are elderly you have to be careful
“Mrs Jones I just need to ask a few questions that we have to ask all our patients

… age/dob etc and then say “ I have to ask to ask the question what do you identify as?”

I can imagine the responses though… ‘ a teapot’ ‘ a giraffe’

I think as long as youve built up a good rapport and show in facial expressions/tone that you dont want to ask but need to

My daughter was recently seen by the community learning disabilities therapy team. She is an adult, with learning difficulties. I was with her to help support her communication.

the appointment went well enough, and then at the end there were all the demographic questions. I left the therapist to it when she started asking gender identity questions, and she literally could not simplify it enough, or explain it in clear enough terms that dd could understand. The only answer dd kept giving was ‘I don’t know what you mean’ when asked eg if she identifies with her birth sex, or if she presents as she feels internally, etc. Total bafflement, and then the therapist asked me to answer for dd, and was not pleased when I pointed out that surely that defeats the object - I can’t possibly know how dd feels internally. I think that section was left blank in the end…

WTAF.! Seriously is this the garbage the care sector have to deal with ?

What age do you class as elderly? My 85 year oold mother would have given you short shrift.
Just tick the box accordingto sex, you don’t have to ask the question.

Sadly I think most people would translate to mean you're non binary 🙄

@Fieldfly Oh pleeeease share what he said! I've had a truly crap day & have no friends/partner so I desperately need cheering up 🙏

I know this isn't relevant to the thread, but I'm curious if Scots or Welsh would have been equally unacceptable answers?

This is so mundane now it belies how astoundingly perverse it is. My elderly mother would also know what they mean and would probably take the piss (she’s a legend for showing a healthy disrespect to authority) but for those who are confused, scared or just not on the ball - what the fuck does ‘gender identity’ to them? What does it mean anyway?

I would go through the form and just say as you’re going down the questions ‘so you’re…female… tick’ (and do a big dramatic tick on the form) and take their silence as assent. I would bet my life savings that you’ll get it right each time.

then tick agender for everyone who says no? Or are they not recording sex as well?

I recently had to complete a form which asked 'something like' how do I identify- male, female, other- please specify. Then 'do you identify as the same gender you were assigned at birth?' Yes, no, other.

If you aren't working in the UK, then surely what whatever is done here is irrelevant to working practices in the country you are in???