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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

They have turned the toilets at my daughter's school mixed sex

114 replies

dumpling23 · 06/09/2022 23:30

Yup - that's it really. On a local women's rights group I'm on, I've heard that another school in our town has also done just the same thing. I'll be writing to complain. I imagine others who look at this forum might hear that the the same change has been introduced at their children's school over the next few days, so here is a copy of my letter. If anybody else is in this situation, feel free to use/adapt this template. Corrections also welcome.

I am writing to register my concerns about the changes to the ** School toilets that have been reported to me by my child. I have been informed that the single sex provision at the English Block and the Canteen Corridor have been converted into mixed sex provision, with further conversions underway. In this letter I am requesting further information in order to better understand the situation, as the only information I have received at present comes from a child.

I will state at the outset that I consider removing single-sex toilet provision and replacing it with mixed-sex provision, as appears to be the case here, to be detrimental to female pupils. It also risks breaking the law. The guidance in the Schools Premises Regulations (2012) is very clear. It states that schools must provide separate sex provision for children over eight. In June 2018, the Department of Education reissued guidance from the Department of Education on the responsibilities of school in relation to ‘gender separation’. Paragraph 13 clearly states:

It is permissible for toilet and boarding accommodation facilities to be separate as they are captured under existing statutory exceptions. Separate toilet and washing facilities must be provided for boys and girls aged 8 years and over pursuant to Regulation 4 of the School Premises (England) Regulations 2012, which falls within the exemption provided for in Schedule 22 of the Equality Act 2010.

Furthermore, as you will no doubt have noticed, the Attorney General, Suella Braverman provided further guidance to schools about toilets in her speech of 10 August 2022. She said: ‘Further, in law, there is a duty to provide separate single sex toilets, a breach of which would be unlawful under the School premises (England) Regulations 2012 and the Education (Independent School Standards) Regulations 2014.

In order that I can better understand the School’s actions and assess how it fits within the UK’s legal framework, I would be grateful if you could provide answers to the following questions:

  1. What is the toilet provision in the school and is it in line with the School Premises Regulations (2012) as outlined in the Department of Education guidance?
  2. Did the school consult with students, staff and parents about the proposed change?
  3. Did the school carry out an impact assessment (especially in relation to the protected characteristics of sex and religion) on the change as is required under the Equality Act?

If the school did carry out a consultation exercise and Impact Assessment, I would be grateful if you could share the documentation around these processes.

I look forward to hearing from you at your earliest convenience.

OP posts:
ImherewithBoudica · 13/09/2022 19:55

How fun for girls to now get to play hunt the accessible toilet!

FemaleAndLearning · 13/09/2022 20:49

Pitchforks? I didn't get the memo I still have my broomstick.

Great update OP.

IStandWithMaya · 13/09/2022 20:58

Poor girls. They really need us to speak up for single sex provision.

DdraigGoch · 13/09/2022 21:08

Boreded · 13/09/2022 14:40

So there are single sex and mixed sex provisions…just as I suspected.

thanks for the tag @Sazzasez

they have given three options and so won’t be contravening any laws or gov guidance…if they were then they wouldn’t have done it.

op you should go see the toilets, see what they are really like, rather than what you’ve made them to be in your mind.

The OP's daughter is avoiding going to the toilet because the few remaining single-sex ones are not easy enough to access. This will have consequences for her health.

dumpling23 · 13/09/2022 22:01

To those of you whose children are facing the same thing, why not send them a copy of my letter? You can tone it down, make it politer, make it appropriate to your school's situation etc - more in the spirit of, 'umm.... I'm just politely wondering, but where are the single sex toilets, as mandated by the law? etc etc'

I have a son and a daughter at this school, but I didn't decide to write just because I have a daughter effected by the policy. Of course, that is a concern but I still would have written because I think all the girls in the school deserve easy access to a girls-only toilet during their school day.

To those few who are trying to minimise and dismiss what's going on here.... This thread is for people who believe there is a problem, care about it, and want to take action or support others to take action. If that's not you - fine, but please try not to derail.

OP posts:
FemaleAndLearning · 13/09/2022 22:17

If we have kids at school we should all be checking their policies and toilets. If girls have to accept boys in their vicinity whilst using toilets what we are going is saying your boundaries do not matter, your dignity does not matter, your privacy does not matter and we do not respect you. It also tells girls that when they use toilets in public they will have to accept men and boys them. Schools are getting this wrong and it's a shame it is down to parents to force them to get it right.

WalrusSubmarine · 13/09/2022 23:04

Next step - mixed changing rooms. Mixed sport. Mixed dorms. Because they can now say “we’ve mixed toilets and nobody minds and it’s all working perfectly and everyone is happy and only horrible people complain blah blah blah.”

Excellent letter op. Thank you for doing this.

Plus my employer has already changed our toilets to all be gender identity based not sex based and these are the separated by partition type with massive gaps at the top and floor. We also have shower rooms and changing rooms - not that I’d use them
now. To those saying this isn’t happening - This IS already happening.

bythere · 13/09/2022 23:21

This is totally inappropriate, it isn't right for children say much older than nursery or reception to have mixed sex facilities.

ImherewithBoudica · 14/09/2022 08:14

Next step - mixed changing rooms. Mixed sport. Mixed dorms. Because they can now say “we’ve mixed toilets and nobody minds and it’s all working perfectly and everyone is happy and only horrible people complain blah blah blah.”

Quite.

Hence Whittle openly stating in the public domain that the plan was to go after women's prisons first. Because once you successfully got males in there, the door had been slammed wide and it would be hard to stop getting males in any other female only space.

And yes, it relies on useful (or intentionally acting) idiots to stand around saying calm down dear, it's not REALLY happening, it's not really that bad, no one really minds, it's not really a problem is it...

which is how we now have women being sexually assaulted by males in prison in the name of social justice. Which is actually male supremacism, but there you go, it's dressed up very naicely. And no one really minds cos its only women.

DameHelena · 14/09/2022 08:53

I wonder where the Equality Act comes in here? I ask because my fully TWAW DP (male) insists that scenarios like this, and rape support groups for women allowing transwomen in etc, can be mitigated against by the Equality Act, but I'm not sure of the details as to how/why.

FernPotts · 14/09/2022 15:44

op you should go see the toilets, see what they are really like

Her daughter is the one using them, and finds them offputting. That's not a good outcome.

Boreded · 15/09/2022 18:54

dumpling23 · 13/09/2022 22:01

To those of you whose children are facing the same thing, why not send them a copy of my letter? You can tone it down, make it politer, make it appropriate to your school's situation etc - more in the spirit of, 'umm.... I'm just politely wondering, but where are the single sex toilets, as mandated by the law? etc etc'

I have a son and a daughter at this school, but I didn't decide to write just because I have a daughter effected by the policy. Of course, that is a concern but I still would have written because I think all the girls in the school deserve easy access to a girls-only toilet during their school day.

To those few who are trying to minimise and dismiss what's going on here.... This thread is for people who believe there is a problem, care about it, and want to take action or support others to take action. If that's not you - fine, but please try not to derail.

Have you talked with the school anymore? Got any further with it?

LuftBalloons · 15/09/2022 20:24

Brilliant letter @dumpling23 !

Let us know what happens.

Boreded · 13/10/2022 00:21

Blown out of proportion then? Presumably since nobody came back with an update lol

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