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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Irvine Welsh's New Book

48 replies

Igneococcus · 27/08/2022 20:13

Has not one, but three trans characters. It will be interesting how this is going to be received. Article in the Times Scotland:
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/380397f8-2624-11ed-bf78-57ebd2e3e25c?shareToken=c41adc535b125cbd0f6429627b5d9f27

OP posts:
Plasmodesmata · 27/08/2022 20:16

From the interview:
"Welsh was concerned about using a single trans character and decided to have at least three to reflect a wider experience of human nature and character."

But guess what?

Cavvies · 27/08/2022 20:18

Oh let me guess - are they all transwomen?

BlueBrush · 27/08/2022 20:18

All trans women?

Cavvies · 27/08/2022 20:20

Bingo

Igneococcus · 27/08/2022 20:20

Yes, of course they are all transwomen.

OP posts:
BlueBrush · 27/08/2022 20:22

Ah, wider human experience.

It's almost like there's some mechanism by which the lives and concerns of trans men are invisible compared to trans women. What do you call that, now?....

tobee · 27/08/2022 20:29

BlueBrush · 27/08/2022 20:22

Ah, wider human experience.

It's almost like there's some mechanism by which the lives and concerns of trans men are invisible compared to trans women. What do you call that, now?....

🤔

NecessaryScene · 27/08/2022 20:31

Amazing.

Theundertaker · 27/08/2022 20:35

Yes, was just about to say this. He got some crap on twitter for that, I think.

Igneococcus · 27/08/2022 20:42

I think it will be interesting to see how the characters are portrayed. He says this in the interview "You want to show them as real characters as well. Just because you are trans, or a women, or black or gay, you can still be a bad bastard."

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 27/08/2022 20:50

'guided — wait for it — by a ‘sensitivity reader’'

Fenlandia · 27/08/2022 20:50

I don't have high hopes Igneo, based on this paragraph from the Times article

Then there is Gary/Gayle, an aggressive student advocate of no platforming: “What appears to be a brawny young man of around six foot four in a blue dress … bulldozes in, a charged storm of bristling rage.” When Gayle stares down Lennox, the detective ponders: “For his transitioning to be regarded as successful, Lennox considers it would require a massive societal readjustment as to what constitutes femininity.”

But it's not about stereotypes ever is it

ArabellaScott · 27/08/2022 20:53

'“For his transitioning to be regarded as successful, Lennox considers it would require a massive societal readjustment as to what constitutes femininity.”'

Confused
Igneococcus · 27/08/2022 20:54

I agree @Fenlandia this made me roll my eyes too, but I also don't think it will be a complete fawn-fest.

OP posts:
Ereshkigalangcleg · 27/08/2022 21:02

Can we have Trainspotting etc re-released after editing by a "sensitivity reader"? Grin

LavenderfortheBees · 27/08/2022 21:08

To me that character doesn't sound like we are meant to be sympathetic. Lennox sounds like he is thinking such a societal readjustment would be impossible.

AlexandriasWindmill · 27/08/2022 21:10

I think it will make TRAs very unhappy. Irvine doesn't tend to pander and he's clever. Even the paragraph quoted above, yy it could be read as reinforcing stereotypes or as the character pointing out that transwomen are not female and are never seen as such.
It will be interesting to see how much grief the TRAs give him and his response. Generally he doesn't seem to be someone who capitulates.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 27/08/2022 21:14

Yes, reading the article it doesn't sound like the trans characters are going to get any special treatment.

AlexandriasWindmill · 27/08/2022 21:19

Interesting that he also seems to be making the point that bad actors can say they're trans.
Using a sensitivity reader is the icing on the cake because it's the one demand bandied about all the time by certain activists in literary circles who are unhappy about books, prizes, shortlists, etc. He's pre-empted that criticism - although, of course, it won't stop TRAs being unhappy.
We may be about to see if Irvine is as brave as JK.

EamesBird · 27/08/2022 21:23

ArabellaScott · 27/08/2022 20:53

'“For his transitioning to be regarded as successful, Lennox considers it would require a massive societal readjustment as to what constitutes femininity.”'

Confused

I actually think this is a genius sentence.

Welsh did a good tv show on censoring and the rise of cancel culture a couple of years ago. He was really pushing the importance of causing offence, that art should make people uncomfortable and that no platforming is foolishness. He went through a bit of Trainspotting and Filth to show that they wouldn't even be considered for publication now, there would be no book left by the time all of the offensive text was removed.

Even since that show aired things have eased up societally I think, long may it continue.

I first read Irvine Welsh as a teenager, Trainspotting was passed under the desks at school and was an underground cult classic. This was before the movie which was also excellent but vastly different. I went to see Trainspotting the play, Ewen Bremner was playing Rents. I have never to this day seen a more shocking and frightening play, teenage me was utterly stunned and I left the theatre knowing I would never touch heroin no matter what. That play likely kept me alive through the following years and I have no doubt Irvine Welsh is the reason I made it to adulthood in one piece. We don't live in a cotton wool world.

AlexandriasWindmill · 27/08/2022 21:31

YY I think the BTL comments on The Times are missing the point. Although I think in some cases, it's deliberate. A few of those BTLers are vocally anti-Scottish independence and Welsh is very pro. That might be clouding their ability to read the nuance in the article.

inkjet · 27/08/2022 21:34

I wonder if there’ll be any threats of walkouts at his publishers.

EamesBird · 27/08/2022 21:40

"I wonder if there’ll be any threats of walkouts at his publishers" aye or rape / death threats and stalkers outside his house! Maybe the actors from his films will disparage and shun him in the press...

FiveDollarMilkshake · 27/08/2022 21:47

he was interviewed for that crappy free Waitrose weekend paper and said something along the lines that Jo (Rowling) was not transphobic and that women’s rights to privacy/single sex spaces was not to be conflated with “trans rights” or something to that effect.

This was after being asked about touching upon the “trans issue” in his new book.