Australian detransitioner suing psychiatrist over (lack of) care.

[NitroNine]

As the thread title says, really - Jay Langadinos is suing the psychiatrist who facilitated her transition; claiming that he failed to provide an adequate standard of care. All affirmation no exploration is a scandal; & the refusal by TRAs to even consider the children & young people whose lives are ruined by said approach is inexcusable.

Sydney Morning Herald

Surely the doctors should be sued? They are the ones who actually prescribed the hormones and performed surgery.

The gynaecologists who do these surgeries usually require a psychiatrist to sign off on it. The defence from the gynaecologists is that the patient said she wanted it and they assume that a rigorous psychiatric assessment has taken place to confirm the reasoning, otherwise why would the psychiatrist sign off on it?

I can see a case for suing the psychiatrist, who clearly made the wrong judgement, but like ZombieMumEB I'm also surprised that she's not suing the surgeon(s). Maybe it's to do with the way things work in Australia.

Everyone to blame except themselves.

What happened to personal responsibility?

There's a link to another article, which is a little old, which is interesting and contain a reference to Maya's case in the closing paragraphs. It's by an Australian psychiatrist questioning the 'affirmation only' of rogd teens and young adults::

www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/now-i-m-hopeful-we-can-we-talk-about-teens-and-gender-20211031-p594q6.html

This person was 19 and everyone around her was affirming she was in the wrong body. The specialist said she would need a thorough assessment and then at the next visit approved a double mastectomy. That is lack of care and I don't blame her for feeling she's been let down

This is a heartbreaking read. All the similarities to what the other detransitioners and clinicians have been saying.

I would say that the psych had the sign off and there is the first line of responsibility. Particularly as it seems Toohey noted she hadn’t sought the additional care he’d recommended in the first place. He also seemed to have understood she had comorbidities even from the start.

I am glad she is now seeing Dr Roberto D’Angelo as she has some support. And that she has Slater and Gordon who I know have done major cases of discrimination and won.

Disgusting response.
This is a young woman who has had her life wrecked by so-called professionals who should have known better. There were so many red flags as to why this woman needed psychological support, and yet instead she was led down a path of medicalisation and life changing surgeries instead.
If an anorexic young woman decides she would only be happy if doctors allowed her to stop eating completely, would you still say it’s her choice? Or a young man who wants to throw himself off a motorway bridge? Or cut his arms daily until he bleeds?
Your comprehension of mental illness leaves a lot to be desired. This woman was lied to by professionals and by society. ‘It’s fine, you can become a boy if you take these hormones, have your breasts removed, have your ovaries removed.’ Well no, it’s NOT fine, because you CANNOT change your sex!

The feeling grew in her mid-teens when she realised she was attracted to other girls. At 17, she searched for answers on the internet and “discovered transgender”.

“And because of the definition of dysphoria, I thought, ‘That’s what I have.’ I decided that I must be transgender because of my discomfort that I had in my body,” she said.

She had hoped transitioning would bring her greater happiness and self-assurance. Instead, each surgery plunged her further into depression.

“As my unhappiness grew, I felt the cause of my unhappiness was because I was not male, so the answer was to change my body even more,” she said.

“I had a breakdown, couldn’t function for an entire year. I couldn’t get out of bed. I wish at the time I knew how much I was hurting and why.”

The order of events isn't clear from this. Did she have a breakdown after all the physical treatment or before? Was she signed off for more physical treatment after the breakdown? That does seem negligent.

Also note that homophobes on the internet told her that being attracted to other girls meant she was transgender.

Goodness, I hope this opens the floodgates.

But I have difficulty completely blaming the physiciatrist in these scenarios - what happens to medical professionals speaking up about their concerns? Dr David Bell here found it hard enough, subject to disciplinary proceedings, only felt able to speak up because he was near the end of his career anyway - in Australia, aren't there strict laws that reframed any type of concern as conversion therapy?

So what were the doctors in charge of her care supposed to do? Refuse to refer her, her accused of conversion therapy, lose their licences?

The people who are really complicit, who really should be held to account, are those who pushed this ideology in the first place and allowed no dissent. Those who threatened, reported, called us transphobes and fascists with their political platforms, those who screamed in our faces 'TWAW, NO DEBATE!!!' - and those politicians, organisations, law enforcement that allowed them to do so with impunity.

But I suspect the real architects of this misogynistic, homophobic, brutal scandal will never be held to account.

The people who are really complicit, who really should be held to account, are those who pushed this ideology in the first place and allowed no dissent. Those who threatened, reported, called us transphobes and fascists with their political platforms, those who screamed in our faces 'TWAW, NO DEBATE!!!'

And who are now saying things like:

Everyone to blame except themselves.
What happened to personal responsibility?

That’s the number one most read article on the SMH website today. I’ve just come back from a trip to Sydney and it was noticeable that all the friends I met up with mentioned issues around teens identifying as transgender, pronouns, body discomfort and they knew about the Tavistock. This was all types of political groups - green voters, full on free speech libertarians, labour voters, small ‘l’ liberals. I have a broad range of friends.

I was expecting this to be a no-go area and didn’t bring it up myself (because I expected everyone to have been pretty much persuaded to ‘be kind’) so it was quite a relief to hear Australians discussing this. As a problem that needs working through, as an issue that people across the board are concerned about, as a dangerous moment for teens, and as homophobic.

So what were the doctors in charge of her care supposed to do? Refuse to refer her, her accused of conversion therapy, lose their licences?

If I remember correctly, this was pre ‘conversion’ therapy bills.

Maybe someone from NSW can tell us if this bill has been brought before parliament yet and voted on. I am not sure whether NSW has followed other states on ‘conversion’ therapy. Considering the research that a NSW team produced that detailed the degree of confounding influences in diagnosis due to outside influence, I am not sure the therapy ban will be as easy as it was in Victoria and QLD.

amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/mar/18/bill-to-ban-gay-conversion-and-reform-discrimination-laws-could-help-decide-next-nsw-government-mp

It's hard to point one finger at who is to blame, because this is a social movement that has convinced various people (including HCPs) of its validity and encouraged groupthink that makes these terrible decisions.

What matters is that everyone wakes up and sees the massive, glaring problems with an ideology that suggests 'transitioning' is going to be the go-to solution for someone with dysphoria, that suggests that any attempt to unpack other potential issues or co-morbidities is 'conversion therapy', and that has knee-capped its own ability to self regulate by claiming any questions or requests for evidence are 'transphobic'.

Everyone to blame except themselves.
What happened to personal responsibility?

How does that work with an affirmation-only, no debate, any wider exploration is ‘conversion therapy’ mandate? And a drive to put all that into law?

You can’t have it both ways.

They've turned off or restricted comments under the article on twitter.

Exactly.

There is no personal responsibility if you have been led to believe a whopping great fucking medical lie.

Toohey agreed Langadinos suffered from gender dysphoria – a misalignment between a person’s sex and gender identity

As though that is a diagnosis. Mental health issues repackaged as a 'gender identity'. What psychiatrist sees gender dysphoria as anything other than a symptom?

If someone goes to the doctors with an allergy and can't stop sneezing, the doctor doesn't recommend they have their nose removed.

– and found she was suitable for hormone therapy, in this case testosterone, which encourages the development of male secondary sexual characteristics.

Hormone treatment, followed by horrific, radical and irreversible surgeries creating early menopause, because she has mental health issues. One of which was social phobia. ffs.

Solicitor Anna Kerr, of NSW’s Feminist Legal Clinic, who referred Langadinos’ case to legal firm Slater and Gordon, believes the legal action is “likely to be the tip of the iceberg”.

“We can expect to see extensive litigation in future years related to gender-affirming cross-sex hormones and surgeries,” she said.

I really hope so, it appears to be the only way to stop this madness.

And as for the 'it's their own fault' crowd - many of the people involved are distressed teenagers who are suffering, and looking for an answer. They go to medical professionals, who should have said no, who should have explored alternatives. Who should have done their job properly and listened to 'first do no harm'.

The responsibility lies with the adults in our society to protect children from endangering themselves.

If you can't make someone trans and you cant stop someone being trans then why is everyone so afraid of therapy?

That fact that even talking about anything is deemed transphobic and conversion therapy shows that even those pushing the agenda have no faith in the ideologies ability to withstand any questions.

How this one very clear detail is overlooked in every branch/department of medical bodies is beyond me.

No other medical condition could undergo such a dramatic shift in who it affects and why and not have any investigation as to why.

a misalignment between a person’s sex and gender identity

Let's just quickly unpick that - 'a feeling that they did not want to perform the sex stereotypes arbitrarily assigned to them because of their sex'.

Perhaps if gender dysphoria was regarded as a psychological illness initially and treated as such, this kind of case wouldn't proceed to sexual mutilation. There are genuine cases but too many are down to teenage confusion. A single session is not enough to unravel the complex factors at work. Hopefully things now change a proper longer assessments are carried out.

I would also encourage people to donate to Anna Kerr. Her website is Feminist Legal Clinic. I won’t link in case it gets deleted for crowdfunding reasons. She does amazing pro bono work for women in all situations. She was kicked out of her premises because of “anti-trans” links ie pro women:

https://amp.smh.com.au/national/nsw/feminist-legal-clinic-evicted-for-posting-anti-trans-website-links-20210723-p58cfu.html

There was a thread on it here but I can’t seem to find it right now. But I’m sure she would appreciate some gardening.

I wonder if cases like this might turn the tide of social contagion, both in the patients and the medical professionals. It is a brave step to take, puts me in mind of the reports that victims of cons are often so humiliated they will not seek redress. Women, in particular, are also conditioned to blame themselves for things that aren't their fault.

I hope high profile cases or, even better, wins will encourage others to come forward or rethink the path they're on.

I do wonder what could be the potential impact of DSM–5 being updated in 2013* to state explicitly that gender non-conformity is not in itself a mental disorder in terms of people wanting to make a claim for damages against a clinician.

* an early canary in the coalmine?