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Where is the Labour Party
173

ChristinaXYZ · 31/07/2022 11:45

In the light of the several significant things that have happened over the last few days re women's rights where is the Labour Party. They are the official opposition. Where is the statement demanding an enquiry into how the Tavistock mess could have taken so many years to uncover and address? where is the statement on women's rights in the work place post Alliosn Bailey's success? Where is the statement about women's safety in sports such as rugby?

Zip, zilch, nothing...

On the other hand they have refused Labour Women's Declaration a stand at the Labour party conference

twitter.com/soniasodha/status/1553654729011601411

Not only are the wrong on the subject of women's rights and misogynistic in their repeated lack of support for women MPs like Rosie Duffield and Luciana Berger and but they are also completely gutless.

Either too gutless to admit they are wrong and start addressing the way women's rights have been squeezed

or

too gutless to continue with their previous line on the subject thereby throwing their version of trans rights under the bus as well.

Meanwhile we have right wingers like Michael Gove praising Kemi Badenoch for her stance on the Tavistock.

The Tories have been in power a long time* and should have done something earlier but at least they have done something and can see and name the problem. They have been slow rather than hypocrites or gutless. If you cannot see and name the problem then you can and will do nothing, just like Labour.

I am so angry with them.

And whose likely to be the next leader Nandy, Creasy or Rayner? (assuming Labour capable of electing a woman) or changes-his-mind-to-suit-the-weather Wes Streeting?

On the plus side at least a few (very few) Labour MPs have signed that letter in the Guardian.

*admitted more like a series of governments rather than one Tory government

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Sunfriedegg · 31/07/2022 11:52

After this misogynistic weak show from labour, I don’t know how anyone can think that left wing is on the side of ordinary people. Being a labour voter is no longer a way to virtue signal.

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Xoxoxoxoxoxox · 31/07/2022 11:55

I agree, it feels like trying to turn a tanker around.
It feels like this generation of Labour women are a lost cause.

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PronounssheRa · 31/07/2022 11:56

Hiding in a cupboard utterly terrified of the social media activists.

They may as well not exist

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MangyInseam · 31/07/2022 11:56

I imagine they are suffering some kind of cognitive meltdown.

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TooBigForMyBoots · 31/07/2022 11:57

The Tories did do something earlier, they proposed Self ID. They have given you Britain's first Trans MP. Conservative MPs have reported people to the police for Hate Speech. Oh and we nearly got Penny TWAW Mordaunt as our next PM. She may well be the one after Truss, she's very popular with MPs and party members.

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MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2022 11:58

I think they’re hiding generally over the strike issue, MPs disagreeing with Starmer

on this probably more of the same

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MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2022 11:59

Penny Mordaunt was a flash in the pan in the end wasn’t she

All that polling and now zip. Tg

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mrshoho · 31/07/2022 12:00

Scratching their arses. It's a crying shame what has become of Labour.

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MrsOvertonsWindow · 31/07/2022 12:02

They're either having secret discussions with the trans extremists promising that if they get into power they'll re open GIDs and put Mermaids in charge to continue the experiments on children or they're gibbering in a basement working on the Lammy formula for growing a cervix in a man.

Completely useless.

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Floisme · 31/07/2022 12:04

I don't believe we're safe with either party but yes, Labour has been abysmal and, rather than rethinking, shows every sign of doubling down.
Starmer's failure to even acknowledge that the Labour Women's Declaration have been asking to meet is a case in point.

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TeenDivided · 31/07/2022 12:05

The Tories did do something earlier, they proposed Self ID. but listened and decided not to proceed

They have given you Britain's first Trans MP. not a bad thing per se. They have also had 2 female leaders / prime ministers whereas labour is still on zero

Conservative MPs have reported people to the police for Hate Speech. agree that if reporting for non hate this is not good.

Oh and we nearly got Penny TWAW Mordaunt as our next PM. Depends on how you define nearly. She was knocked out before even going to party members, and her stance on Trans issues was part of the reason.

She may well be the one after Truss, she's very popular with MPs and party members. That is a lot of assumptions. We don't know it will be Truss, and don't know how long the next leader will last and what the political landscape will be then.

And all the above are to some extent whataboutery, since the post is about what Labour are doing, not conservatives.

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achillestoes · 31/07/2022 12:09

My MP backed Mordaunt. I wrote to her and got back some drivel about her being a great leader who has ‘had jobs outside politics’. Truss was an economist. Badenoch was in finance. They both have excellent leadership credentials and they don’t lie through their teeth.

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TeenDivided · 31/07/2022 12:27

achillestoes · 31/07/2022 12:09

My MP backed Mordaunt. I wrote to her and got back some drivel about her being a great leader who has ‘had jobs outside politics’. Truss was an economist. Badenoch was in finance. They both have excellent leadership credentials and they don’t lie through their teeth.

My MP is Caroline Nokes so where that leaves me at general election time I have no idea. It will be her or Lib Dems, no one else has a hope in our constituency.

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sashagabadon · 31/07/2022 12:38

Labour are currently in all outcivil war as Keir has sacked Angela’s MP boyfriend over appearing on the picket line and lining up a number of press interviews where he waxed lyrical about labour policy ( some say in an open provocative move against Keir, actively provoking Keir to sack him, which he dutifully did)
The labour infighting leaves Liz and Rishi arguing over tax cuts now or in 2024 in the dust.
I will likely never vote labour again anyway but the idea that they are the grown people in the political room is laughable.
Also imo they genuinely agree with gender ideology too from what I can see ( some honourable exceptions)

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MangyInseam · 31/07/2022 12:39

TooBigForMyBoots · 31/07/2022 11:57

The Tories did do something earlier, they proposed Self ID. They have given you Britain's first Trans MP. Conservative MPs have reported people to the police for Hate Speech. Oh and we nearly got Penny TWAW Mordaunt as our next PM. She may well be the one after Truss, she's very popular with MPs and party members.

This is such BS and I don't know what's behind it.

Huge swaths of the population were fooled into thinking that trans issues were about a tiny group of men with sever MH issues, and that supporting them was right and good.

They were given policy advice by SW, and they also were told by doctors and psychologists that they should take certain approaches with medical aspects including with children.

All along the LP has been gung ho and quashed any concerns in the most horrible way, calling people bigots, nazis, and worse.

The CP at least allowed its members to listen, some became very active on the issue, and over time they began to see the problem, and managed to turn around a movement that had quickly become embedded in government institutions.

For some time as Tory MPs did things like say publicly that women do indeed have vaginas, and worked in their jobs listening to their constituents and dealing with legislation, the civil service, etc, and were given stick by the left and members of the LP for this, people like yourself have been saying that somehow the CP is all wrong on this, that they just want votes, they really don't care about anyone, they don't get it. Frankly with zero evidence. While the Labour Party still hasn't commented, I imagine because they are all in a meeting running around with their heads cut off. They haven't a clue what to do.

Wake up.

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TooBigForMyBoots · 31/07/2022 12:41

Penny TWAW wasn't a flash in the pan, the only reason she will not be our next PM is that Sunak "gave" Truss some of his votes because he knew he'd have a better chance against her with the membership. Penny Mordaunt is very popular with MPs and party members, she hasn't gone away and the chaos of the Tory party is such that she may still become PM before a GE.😱

We escaped by the sking of our teeth and we're not out of the woods yet.

Sorry your MP is Caroline Noakes @TeenDivided.Thanks It shows that this trans shitshow is not a definitive "party line" difference between the Conservatives and anyone else. I feel particularly gutted for any GC constituents in Bridgend who held their nose and voted Conservative because "at least they know what a woman is".Sad

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MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2022 12:41

The strike issue is a problem for Starmer

If he backs down and reversed he’s lost his ground, if he doesn’t he’s stuck with MPs speaking out against him

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MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2022 12:42

TooBig you seem to be the only person still talking about her.

I have no idea why,

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WhiteFire · 31/07/2022 12:47

I think the question that needs to be asked is where have they been on anything for at least the last three years.

As an opposition party they have been abysmal.

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sashagabadon · 31/07/2022 12:48

I listened to a pod cast with Andrea Leadsom (PM’s campaign manager) where she said that vote lending was not likely to be a thing in this race as none of the candidates actually had enough secure votes to risk “lending them” unlike when Boris was elected as he had so many MP votes he could afford to “lend” some to get Jeremy hunt as his opponent ( as he knew he would easily win against Jeremy, which he did)

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ChristinaXYZ · 31/07/2022 12:57

MangyInseam · 31/07/2022 12:39

This is such BS and I don't know what's behind it.

Huge swaths of the population were fooled into thinking that trans issues were about a tiny group of men with sever MH issues, and that supporting them was right and good.

They were given policy advice by SW, and they also were told by doctors and psychologists that they should take certain approaches with medical aspects including with children.

All along the LP has been gung ho and quashed any concerns in the most horrible way, calling people bigots, nazis, and worse.

The CP at least allowed its members to listen, some became very active on the issue, and over time they began to see the problem, and managed to turn around a movement that had quickly become embedded in government institutions.

For some time as Tory MPs did things like say publicly that women do indeed have vaginas, and worked in their jobs listening to their constituents and dealing with legislation, the civil service, etc, and were given stick by the left and members of the LP for this, people like yourself have been saying that somehow the CP is all wrong on this, that they just want votes, they really don't care about anyone, they don't get it. Frankly with zero evidence. While the Labour Party still hasn't commented, I imagine because they are all in a meeting running around with their heads cut off. They haven't a clue what to do.

Wake up.

I completely agree with all of this @MangyInseam . It reminds me of Peter Daly's article on Linked in. Labour and its supporters think they are moral because simply they are Labour supporters, so they inoculate themselves against any kind of rigorous examination of their beliefs.

The Tories don't so this,, not because they are any more indeed nay less moral, but because they don't become tories or vote tory to virtue signal. So they think and listen and change their minds just as you describe.

the Peter DAly article is here www.linkedin.com/pulse/morality-plays-lessons-forstater-peter-daly/ . It is a long read but the key bit is below - think Labour Party of the chambers and Conservatives for the FTSE 100 firms he mentions and the situation works:

"The adoption of this zero-sum approach arises because of the way that organisations define their own identities: the way in which they view themselves and encourage others to view them. This has a moral dimension, with organisations defining themselves as moral communities. In The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided By Politics and Religion, the moral psychologist Jonathan Haidt refers (p.312) to “moral capital” (p.312) as “the resources that sustain a moral community”. He writes:

“More specifically, moral capital refers to the degree to which a community possesses interlocking sets of values, virtues, norms, practices, identities, institutions, and technologies that mesh well with evolved psychological mechanisms and thereby enable the community to suppress or regulate selfishness and make cooperation possible.”

These moral communities are overwhelmingly the locus of disputes around sex and gender. Examples include a barristers’ chambers known for its radical work against the state (claimant: Allison Bailey), Girlguiding (claimant: Katie Alcock), a Labour-run Council (claimant: Julie Bindel), the Green Party of England and Wales (three separate claimants, with potentially more to follow), and so on. In those organisations facing allegations of gender critical discrimination, there is an over-representation of organisations in the arts, academia and the third sector. In none of the gender critical cases of which I am aware is there a hardnosed, capitalist, profit-driven, corporate defendant.

I am aware of one case of a dispute between gender critical and gender theory employees in such an organisation, a FTSE-listed PLC. It was resolved quickly, effectively and without litigation.

There are two possibilities arising from this pattern. Either a string of morally-motivated organisations. with little in common other than an underlying ethos of anti-discrimination, have somehow been infiltrated by deeply immoral people and are only now recognising this fact; or the compasses used to determine morality in those organisations have gone significantly awry. Evidence and logic would suggest that the second of these is the more likely.

This pattern is emerging not because there is something inherently wrong with progressive causes or institutions, or with organisations choosing to pursue socially beneficial moral aims; or because corporate profit-driven entities are morally better than those whose purpose goes beyond the balance sheet. It is not even because there is anything wrong with the pursuit of moral capital, or with applying a moral dimension to organisations.

Instead, the problem is that many organisations that are moral communities are required, but fail, to undertake the requisite intellectual exercise to interrogate the contours of their own moral code. They fail to understand the complexities of their own particular philosophical position – be it gender identity theory or anything else – or the implications for those who do not ascribe to it or are opposed to it. Without that interrogation, an assumption is all too easily made that the reason they hold their moral code is because it is – and by extension they are - morally right. The extension of this is that anyone who doesn’t share the moral code is as. a matter of ineluctable logic, inevitably morally wrong. Such organisations avail themselves of, as Sonia Sodha terms it, “the luxury of childishly dividing the world into goodies and baddies”."

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TooBigForMyBoots · 31/07/2022 13:56

MarshaBradyo · 31/07/2022 12:42

TooBig you seem to be the only person still talking about her.

I have no idea why,

Because I believe in women's rights @MarshaBradyo. Rights that have been so degraded under the Conservative government and continue to be so.

We are taking our eyes off the ball. This is happening now. It is happening because of Conservative government and they are doing little to put the genie back in the bottle. The little they do "say" is merely faffing about the edges. They are still in government and will spin on a sixpence when it suits them. Most of them don't give a toss about the trans issue.🤷‍♀️ Penny Mordaunt reaching the final 3 in the leadership election and her popularity among party members proves it.

Sonia Sodha is correct and we do not have the luxury of dividing the world into Goodies and Baddies. It would be catastrophic for women's rights. We need to look at the damage done, the potential damage that can be done before the next GE and those who can fix it. Now.

Not in a theoretical 2 years time.

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SallyLockheart · 31/07/2022 14:01

Toobig. are you on the right thread? you seem to have got lost?

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TooBigForMyBoots · 31/07/2022 14:07

While I agree with you that having Britain's first trans MP may not be a "bad thing per se" @TeenDivided it could turn out to be very bad thing indeed.🤔

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Time2act · 31/07/2022 14:11

Completely agree Labour’s silence means they will continue to lose votes and lose women’s trust.

Meanwhile Stella Creasy continues to post tweets like this…

twitter.com/stellacreasy/status/1553475966198071302?s=21&t=sxfkOnEtunRmIs0NLjN5vA

twitter.com/stellacreasy/status/1551961285394309120?s=21&t=sxfkOnEtunRmIs0NLjN5vA

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