Stonewall, The FA and Womens football

[respectmysex]

Apologies if I've missed this, but I've not seen a thread tackling this issue.

Stonewall and their rainbow laces campaign is pushed by The FA across the mens and womens game.

Stonewall tweeting support for every England womens football match, flogging their rainbow armbands.

And The FA Trans Inclusion policy very clearly stating:

Trans doesn't have to be medical, it includes anyone who socially transitions only, or simply identifies as a cross dresser.

Trans players can play on the team their gender identity matches.

Showers, changing rooms and toilets should be accessible based on their self identified gender.

"Some trans women may be happy to change or shower in open facilities alongside other women" "It is good practice to ask a trans person what would work best for them"

• Players aged 18 and under
The Fa allows mixed competition for players aged 18 and under, and boys and girls can play football together on the same team .
any trans person in this age range is able to play on whichever team they feel suits them best, whether that’s boys, girls or mixed .

www.thefa.com/-/media/files/pdf/the-fa-2015-16/transpeople-in-football-guide.ashx?la=en

With the next generation of girls being inspired right now to start or keep playing football, how on earth can The FA also undermine their privacy, dignity and competitiveness by forcing girls to share teams and showers with boys? (and potentially being supervised in those showers by adult male coaches).

I am just watching Channel 4 news on catch up. They are talking about women’s football now. Somehow young black girls are getting left out/finding it difficult to find a place in the game. It was better 10 years ago.

Baroness Sue Campbell is head of FA women’s football (speaking about the winning team). I wonder if she has thought about the trans inclusion policy? It might be worth writing to her.

She is saying they want equal opportunity for girls. It is ironic.

I haven’t been able to download the FActrans policy but saw this.

Perhaps it is not absolutely quite as straight forward as just joining the team you identify with (if you are over 16)? even if it is still a problem:
Ist few paragraphs from the BBC.

A Yorkshire football club which includes transgender players says an "intrusive" FA policy is preventing it from joining a bigger league.

^Under FA rules, trans people must seek special approval to play in its leagues.
The Yorkshire Terriers, who currently play in a mixed-gender league, claim the policy on transgender players is "exclusive, not inclusive".^

^The FA argues its policy helps players and ensures safety and fair play.
According to FA rules, players aged 16 and over must not play in mixed teams, while its 2014 Policy on Trans People in Football states transgender players may apply to the FA for approval to play in their "affirmed gender".^

It states that each application is considered on a "case-by-case basis", and in "most cases" applications are approved.

www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-61745572

The reason the team is all white is do with the centres of excellence that young players attended being difficult to reach from inner city areas. Classic inclusion fail for a body that bores on and on about inclusion but does nothing meaningful whatsoever.

"It is good practice to ask a trans person what would work best for them"

I suppose it is bad practice to as women what would work best for them.

@ScrollingLeaves Yes you are right. The policy to include Trans adults 19 years or older is case by case. Not open to scrutiny.

My concern is that right now the conversation is all for grassroots football and getting girls in to football, but The FA have gone with self ID and inclusion of trans identifying males in the girls game. No questions asked. The massive safeguarding risk this also represents when applied to Trans coaches beggars belief.

I heard a radio interview earlier in the week with a woman ex professional footballer who said she had played against boys as a teen to play at a higher standard.

Women and girls need to be able to play challenging, competitive football against other female teams. The FA could be developing this and showing genuine diversity, not being diverted by rainbows.

The latter isn't even 'bad practice', it's not practiced at all, it would seem. The feelings of girls and women are irrelevant.

respectmysex · Today 07:37
@ScrollingLeaves Yes you are right. The policy to include Trans adults 19 years or older is case by case. Not open to scrutiny.

My concern is that right now the conversation is all for grassroots football and getting girls in to football, but The FA have gone with self ID and inclusion of trans identifying males in the girls game. No questions asked. The massive safeguarding risk this also represents when applied to Trans coaches beggars belief

Thank you for clarifying this, Respect.
I agree, it is appalling.

Out of interest, do you know if they have as much written in their policies about racial rights and inclusivity?

The black young women I saw on Channel 4 seemed to suggest there is something very difficult and unsupportive about the set up for them to the extent that they just back out. There must be a huge pool of talent among black girls that isn’t getting a chance to shine.

123Callie · Today 00:38
The reason the team is all white is do with the centres of excellence that young players attended being difficult to reach from inner city areas. Classic inclusion fail for a body that bores on and on about inclusion but does nothing meaningful whatsoever.

That will need to change if they want the best.

As well as access, I was wondering about the written FAcpolicies regarding race in girls and women’s football, as it seemed from the girls talking on Channel 4 that the whole culture is difficult and off-putting for them.

Out of interest, do you know if they have as much written in their policies about racial rights and inclusivity?

The black young women I saw on Channel 4 seemed to suggest there is something very difficult and unsupportive about the set up for them to the extent that they just back out. There must be a huge pool of talent among black girls that isn’t getting a chance to shine.

Especially jarring when you look at the French team and the number of black women players on their team.

Time for coverage on this ( and non inclusion of black players) on Woman’s Hour , where practically every day there have been discussions and (rightly) praise for the team.

Is there an overlap with the MN-originated public spaces and girls item?

makespaceforgirls.co.uk/

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4181054-Teenage-girls-and-public-space-facilities-an-update

@ScrollingLeaves "As well as access, I was wondering about the written FAcpolicies regarding race in girls and women’s football, as it seemed from the girls talking on Channel 4 that the whole culture is difficult and off-putting for them."

I believe the FA have a very clear cut anti racism policy at every level of the game for players and supporters. It includes a protocol for players to walk off the pitch if experiencing racist abuse. As a family we have used the policy for fans reporting racism on a match day and it was dealt with very quickly and professionally.

In fairness to the FA, it's probably an unintended consequence of moving the focus of talent development outside inner cities because in the past, black or mixed race footballers were well represented in the women's game. There has been a tail-off.

Ramblingnamechanger · Today 10:40
Time for coverage on this ( and non inclusion of black players) on Woman’s Hour , where practically every day there have been discussions and (rightly) praise for the team.

Good idea. Will you write and ask by any chance?

respectmysex · Today 13:52
@ScrollingLeaves "As well as access, I was wondering about the written FAcpolicies regarding race in girls and women’s football, as it seemed from the girls talking on Channel 4 that the whole culture is difficult and off-putting for them.

I believe the FA have a very clear cut anti racism policy at every level of the game for players and supporters. It includes a protocol for players to walk off the pitch if experiencing racist abuse. As a family we have used the policy for fans reporting racism on a match day and it was dealt with very quickly and professionally

That’s good to hear. I wonder what factors are holding black girls back, apart from the training grounds being in accessible?

That's a shame. And it is exactly what Stonewall wants - girls and women out of sports They are the Taliban of the west .
But there is hope yet - Rugby authorities have just banned biological
men from playing on or against the women,:s teams. After watching the Lionesses battle to the final of the European Cup, FIFA must surely follow.

I have read the odd interview with women footballers who talk about having to play with and against boys in order to get a competitive game. Missy Bo Kearns is one who I remember has broken her leg while playing in a mixed team. I've seen it mentioned in other interviews with other women as well, broken legs that is.

And one of the current mens Wales players, Neco Williams, his 11 yr old sister plays in a predominantly male league and broke her leg on the pitch too.

If girls are going to develop in to world class players they need competitive games, but not against boys and men who can cause career ending injuries before their talents have even been recognised.

Homosexuality is technically punishable by death under Sharia law in Qatar, but yes work with the FA to get some rainbow laces on the pitch, that'll show em.

I am increasingly seeing males playing in the lower level women's leagues. They're usually easy to spot by being several inches taller than the women, so not I'm sure what criteria they're using to assess them on a case-by-case basis.

The FA trans inclusion guidance is a complete car crash for women's football. I believe India Willoughby had some input to it. It very much reads like something that was snuck in a few years ago before people really realised the implications. I think it will be reviewed in the near future off the back of the changes in rugby and swimming etc.

I play competitive women's football and I play mixed sex social football. I am very aware of the difference in physiques and how I adapt my playing to each sex. I'd far rather play open mixed sex where the men are aware of their advantages and moderate their playing, than women's football where a male thinks he is entitled to play at full pelt because he is a woman.

I was just wondering the other day how long it'll be till the men target the England women's team. They've been getting a lot of (deserved) attention, and it's got to be a low hanging fruit for some third-rate male footballers who quite fancy trying life in girl mode.

So Congratulations FA. The way to get girls involved in football is the let men in. I hope this policy is published far and wide so you can rightly have all the praise delivered straight to you.

The Women have just won FA - that's fight they have WON without any men in the team, men are not required, if you destroy women's dreams and the inspiration that this team have brought to the fore then there is a special circle of hell awaiting you. LEAVE GIRLS AND WOMEN'S SPORT FOR GIRLS AND WOMEN ONLY, not men or boys who can't make the grade against their own sex.

Well now is the time the highlight the policy and get it overturned. Never be a better time. Following on from swimming, rugby union, rugby league and cycling. And having just won the Euros.

Yes it is, time to make a lot of noise.

Agreed. Hopefully some enterprising journalists will start asking questions.