Radio 4 PM - “culture wars”

[MathSage]

Evan Davies briefly mentioned Kemi Badenoch before getting onto whether Penny Mordaunt has changed tack:

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0019461

Davies interviewed firstly Luke Tryl from More in Common which did a recent survey claiming that voters weren’t interested in the trans issue. Tryl was formerly Head of Education for Stonewall.

Secondly Sue Pascoe who is introduced as “a woman with a trans history” and is Area Chairman of North and East Yorkshire Conservative Women’s Organisation ( conservativewomen.uk/articles/about-sue/ ). The bio states that Pascoe was AMAB, seemingly with a variation of sexual development which was dealt with surgically to produce male functionality. Pascoe then married a woman and they had two children. Pascoe was unhappy about the surgery and living outwardly as a male from a young age and eventually transitioned once the children were grown up.

So no balance at all as no one with a gender critical viewpoint was asked for their point of view. Who is it supposed to be a culture war between, BBC?

Also interesting to see the phrase “woman with a trans history” which both emphasises the word woman and throws a screen over what the person is if you don’t know what that trans history is.

Sue Pascoe - who tweeted this claim about the WPUK and a report to the UK Prevent police terrorism unit (further discussion in that thread)?

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3361150-Dr-Nicola-Williams-on-BBC2-at-10-15-Victoria-Live?page=7&reply=80912436

Search engine string: site:mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights "sue pascoe"

Pascoe is awful.

We heard that on the drive home, it made me furious.

When they said 'woman with a trans history' I was expecting a detransioned ex transman.

That would be an actual woman who had been trans in her history. Not a man, (who sounds very much like a man), who has had surgery.

Evan does not appear to be impartial on this subject whenever it comes up

As usual men get the only voice on women's rights. It's the radio, do they think we don't hear?

I did wonder what the bloody hell Evan Davis was doing on LBC in Eddie Mairs spot. Thought it must have been holiday cover or something.

One of the kids must have fiddled with the radio it turns out!

Pascoe outright lied about the law and the gender recognition act.

no wonder Penny Mordaunt if flirting with a reverse ferret if that is the support she is relying on.

oh dear I feel another complaint to the BBC coming along. The usual way they do impartiality is having people from either side of the debate, but ED seems to not play by this. Meanwhile, I heard Emma Barnett sigh about wanting to discuss something - was sport I think but was only half listening - but she couldn’t get someone from the other side of the debate. She basically pleaded for an interviewee to get in touch

Urgh this made me so angry too. Three obviously biased men talking about women’s rights and as for Luke Tryl saying it’s only an issue for 2% of voters, how dare he? Sue Pascoe lying through Sue’s teeth also, I’ve had a few run ins with that person on Twitter and they is a very misogynistic unpleasant person.
I’m so sick of the lack of airtime given to actual women with pro-woman opinion viewpoints.

Woman with a trans history? Is this the new 'assigned x at birth'? Linguistic fiction again.

A TW has a trans history and a trans present. TW always will, trans is the keyword. This term suggests that the TW has become a woman, so it's like another way of saying TWAW.

It's not like Pinocchio and the good fairy, they haven't become a 'real girl'.

Just bizarre that they insist on interviewing people with the most partisan minority views to insist that people aren’t interested in what they consider to be partisan minority views.

I’ve written in to complain. Again. I fear I am turning into a female version of Victor Meldrew ……

This Sue Pascoe?

Surely the only "women with a trans history" are female detransitioners?

Yes, exactly. I'm getting so tired of men telling us what to think, and feel, and say.

I agree with you about Evan.

That Pascoe is a fine figure of a ... (I wasn't going to say woman). It is a bit silly if a daddy starts telling people that they are really not a male. Maybe you'd be a bit sillier to find it credible.

In many cases, there seems to be quite a lot of invented history around how and why men are really women.

I've just listened. Luke Tryl talked about concern on the doorstep being around the ability to earn a living. Well quite. However, how about all of the people who have to lie to themselves and to others in order to be able to earn their crust, avoid disciplinary action through not adhering to compelled speech (pronouns essentially). This issue is foundational to that for many -- I say it preceeds. I left my job rather than have to lie. I earn perhaps half of what I originally made. Could sure do with that money now. My OH wont discuss this issue with me for fear that it will impact on the managerial job he has to do. He can't afford to give it the headspace, quite literally. This is how thought control seeps in. People need to eat - if they need to not engage in wrong think in order to do that, well so be it!! Would love Evan Davis to discuss this.

I complained to the BBC. It is very biased. There should be a range of views, not just pushing one perspective. Why didn’t they explore Kemi Badenoch’s take with suitable supportive interviewees?

It seemed an excuse to use the Conservative leadership campaign to get this article in.

My go to news is now sky news rather than bbc news. There is lots of good stuff on radio 4 but the pro trans viewpoint is entrenched sadly

This Sue?

My 14 year old daughter just said exactly this. It is so disingenuous.

Penny’s face in that photo. Her mouth says TWAW, her face does something else entirely.

'It's funny, I'm 55, I am very hormonal, I am going through puberty again which means that I am just getting to my teenage girl years - so watch out world.'

Funnny how being diagnosed with GD seems to erase both any variation of sexual development and the mother of the boys. 🤔

He could not have had children could he unless he was a man?

The DSD must have been one that did not change that. Isn’t there one relatively wide definition, including fairly common conditions like polycystic ovaries condition like Victoria Beckham had? What if she became a trans man after her children were born, and then imply she’d had a DSD and really been a man all along?

Something doesn’t sound right (I lack knowledge about DSD conditions though.)

But worst of all, if it was a DSD Evan did wrong to introduce that into a discussion about trans gender people.

DSD families have specifically said that they do not want this conflation. Even Stonewall states under ‘Intersex’ that, following discussion with the people concerned, this no longer comes under their sphere.

Watch out world indeed.

I was actually trying to find where the DSD community/org (can't remember now) had the statement about wanting to be kept out of the trans debate. Was beginning to think I'd imagined it. Does anyone have a link?

Y’a think??

he is so bloody partial he cannot walk straight.

He really annoys me with his “let’s be ultra reasonable but let me be so one sided as to have only one side but hey - reasonable tone”.

The worst type of gaslighting - “reasonable, engaged, smart, on one side but let’s not pretend.., “