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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Sex Education Curriculum for the Department for Education

33 replies

LookingandThinking · 11/07/2022 07:23

Sex Education Curriculum for Department for Education

Here is a curriculum, concise, easy to understand and teach, and cost effective.

Biology: Teach boys and girls to use condoms to prevent pregnancy and STDs.

Consent: Only consent to sex when you are really keen to do so. Talking with your partner helps you both decide what you want to do. Teach boys they are not entitled to another person's body. No means no. Teach girls assertiveness and to leave an uncomfortable or dangerous situation.

Homosexuality: It is fine if you are attracted to people of the same sex. There is civil partnership for homosexual adults.

Of course, there is more detail that can be added. It could be completed in 2 classes or more for a discussion, repetitive learning, such as always use a condom and how to maintain personal safety. The three main points are sufficient to what a government should advise, in safeguarding young people, physically and mentally.

Adolescents don't need a prescription of how to do sex. Sex is an experience of discovery between consenting people. It is important that the teachers or facilitators don't impose their opinions, as that could be grooming. We have overcorrected since the days of not talking about sex at all. There could be an emotional wellbeing element as well, but fundamentally, condoms and consent are the main points.

It is uncomfortable discussing sex and people have a lot of feelings around it. I don't believe it is for the government to manage peoples personal sex lives, once safeguarding is observed.

Do you think there are any other essential points that young people should know?

OP posts:
Spottybotty20 · 11/07/2022 07:29

The law and dangers of sexting / making and distributing indecent images of children. Massive problem in our schools.

Empowermenomore · 11/07/2022 07:30

There are a few other threads on this and a link to a parliamentary petition to revise content and remove gender ideology you might have seen.

just so threads are not duplicated 🙂

Iknowitisheresomewhere · 11/07/2022 07:32

Well, currently there is a requirement to teach about abortion in a non-judgemental way (I paraphrase). I would leave that bit in.

Also online and mobile phone sexual situations (sexting etc) and how to navigate that.

achillestoes · 11/07/2022 07:46

Yes, they need to hear more about the sorts of things people ‘expect’ from their sexual partners that are not actually normal or to be ‘expected by anyone: anything violent, painful, degrading, public.

They need to understand about the risks of technology - sexting, pornography, ‘buses’, and especially the narrative about kids having ‘nudes’ to send needs to be challenged.

They need to know about different forms of contraception and sexual health services.

They need to know people can be bisexual.

They need an overview of transition and gender non-conformity.

They need to know which laws protect their rights, and the rights of others.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/07/2022 08:35

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Musomama1 · 11/07/2022 09:02

Like it PP, a framework for mutual respect and boundaries and safety that you can apply to all situations.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/07/2022 09:14

Trying to remember what I said to warrant a deletion? Maybe challenging the nature of some adults involved in wanting to talk to other people's children about sex and their personal experiences?

What I did like was this:
Adolescents don't need a prescription of how to do sex. Sex is an experience of discovery between consenting people. It is important that the teachers or facilitators don't impose their opinions, as that could be grooming. We have overcorrected since the days of not talking about sex at all.

Fenlandia · 11/07/2022 09:56

MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/07/2022 09:14

Trying to remember what I said to warrant a deletion? Maybe challenging the nature of some adults involved in wanting to talk to other people's children about sex and their personal experiences?

What I did like was this:
Adolescents don't need a prescription of how to do sex. Sex is an experience of discovery between consenting people. It is important that the teachers or facilitators don't impose their opinions, as that could be grooming. We have overcorrected since the days of not talking about sex at all.

Beautifully put about overcorrection. I was a shy, self-conscious child and teenager, and would have been mortified to have to sit through some of the more extreme training I've seen discussed on this board.

antigome · 11/07/2022 10:59

I saw a review committee recently I think, lady in a floral dress speaking about the dfe and phse lessons-can't find the link to it now but she was fabulous

achillestoes · 11/07/2022 11:01

Miriam Cates and yes she is.

drhf · 11/07/2022 11:19

There is civil partnership for homosexual adults.

Huh? Marriage is available both for same-sex couples and for opposite-sex couples. Both types of couples can also get a civil partnership if they prefer. Married couples should be referred to as married. Civil-partnered couples should be referred to as civil partners.

You may mean there is civil marriage for gay couples; this is also incorrect, if by this you mean that gay couples can only access civil marriage. Legally valid religious marriage is also available across the UK for gay couples, though many churches and other religions entitled to create legally binding marriages have opted not to perform these for same-sex couples (and the Church of England is legally banned from doing so).

Among the religions which will perform a legally valid wedding for a same-sex couple in England & Wales are the Methodists, the Unitarians, the Quakers, Liberal Judaism and Reform Judaism.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/07/2022 11:40

It was actually LookingandThinking who made the great comment about overcorrection Fenlandia. It chimed with my thinking.
As someone who's taught SRE lessons in a number of inner city schools, a common thread was planning for mixed experiences, understanding and needs that a group of children would have. Including the awareness that for some children this might be the first time they'd be confronted with this information. We'd agonise about those we knew had been sexually abused, those with special needs, particular religious demands and as a result the content was careful, factual and focused on consent and safety. We knew that mainstream lessons were not the place for graphic sexual content to be explored. Yet we seem to have lost this understanding and are prioritising the demands of adults over invested in talking at children about their views about sex.
And I'm sorry if my previous post was intemperate but it's time people woke up and looked closely at some of the people shouting loudest about children needing to be taught about sex / porn / gender politics by them. Because this is (as usual) about those adults and their demands and nothing to do with what children need.

Musomama1 · 11/07/2022 11:43

drhf · 11/07/2022 11:19

There is civil partnership for homosexual adults.

Huh? Marriage is available both for same-sex couples and for opposite-sex couples. Both types of couples can also get a civil partnership if they prefer. Married couples should be referred to as married. Civil-partnered couples should be referred to as civil partners.

You may mean there is civil marriage for gay couples; this is also incorrect, if by this you mean that gay couples can only access civil marriage. Legally valid religious marriage is also available across the UK for gay couples, though many churches and other religions entitled to create legally binding marriages have opted not to perform these for same-sex couples (and the Church of England is legally banned from doing so).

Among the religions which will perform a legally valid wedding for a same-sex couple in England & Wales are the Methodists, the Unitarians, the Quakers, Liberal Judaism and Reform Judaism.

CoE will now perform same sex marriages so long as one of the couple identifies as the opposite sex.

There's a current thread about this.

Mysterioso · 11/07/2022 14:30

No child needs to know that they can be hetero-, homo-, bi or a-sexual. No one needs to live by anyone else's sexual standards or labels.
Children need to understand consent and a consensual mechanism for exploring other people's bodies and knowing when something is beyond their personal comfort zone.
The rest is their discovery to make.

achillestoes · 11/07/2022 14:46

@Mysterioso

I can’t agree there. Homophobia is a serious problem in the UK (less than it once was but also on the rise again). It’s right that kids should know that some (lots of) people are gay/bi and that’s fine.

TastefulRainbowUnicorn · 11/07/2022 14:55

Isn't it usually sex and relationships education? I think kids should be taught the red flags of a potentially abusive partner. Gift of Fear. What respect actually looks like. How predatory adults behave and the kind of things they say. How to set boundaries and screen out people who don't respect their boundaries.

They should also be taught about trauma, its symptoms, and what typical coping mechanisms for trauma are. A lot of girls, especially, have been sexually abused. They should be taught that predators will try to groom them into "sex work" and the relationship between sex work and trauma.

And while I'm wishing, they should all get a pony. But I think if we lived in an even slightly less woman-hating time, this would be an eminently reasonable list. I'm not wishing for the moon, or even for abusers to stop abusing. Just for kids to be taught how to avoid abusers, and how to articulate the consequences of abuse they've already suffered (instead of turning to the Internet for terrible strategies re the latter.)

achillestoes · 11/07/2022 14:58

@TastefulRainbowUnicorn

There’s a risk of scaring the shit out of young people by teaching them that people ‘will’ try to get them involved in ‘sex work’. Teach consent. Teach them how to keep themselves safe. Don’t terrify them. And it’s being prostituted, not ‘sex work’.

FrancescaContini · 11/07/2022 14:59

MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/07/2022 09:14

Trying to remember what I said to warrant a deletion? Maybe challenging the nature of some adults involved in wanting to talk to other people's children about sex and their personal experiences?

What I did like was this:
Adolescents don't need a prescription of how to do sex. Sex is an experience of discovery between consenting people. It is important that the teachers or facilitators don't impose their opinions, as that could be grooming. We have overcorrected since the days of not talking about sex at all.

Absolutely agree with text in bold, especially use of “overcorrection”.

SilverLondon · 11/07/2022 15:14

Adolescents don't need a prescription of how to do sex. Sex is an experience of discovery between consenting people. It is important that the teachers or facilitators don't impose their opinions, as that could be grooming.

This is so obvious and common sense, and yet.....here we are Hmm

TastefulRainbowUnicorn · 11/07/2022 15:19

it’s being prostituted, not ‘sex work"

That's why I used quotes in my post. And I don't think that "will" is much of an exaggeration if they're on social media. OnlyFans is "sex work" too.

WarriorN · 11/07/2022 16:04

MrsOvertonsWindow · 11/07/2022 11:40

It was actually LookingandThinking who made the great comment about overcorrection Fenlandia. It chimed with my thinking.
As someone who's taught SRE lessons in a number of inner city schools, a common thread was planning for mixed experiences, understanding and needs that a group of children would have. Including the awareness that for some children this might be the first time they'd be confronted with this information. We'd agonise about those we knew had been sexually abused, those with special needs, particular religious demands and as a result the content was careful, factual and focused on consent and safety. We knew that mainstream lessons were not the place for graphic sexual content to be explored. Yet we seem to have lost this understanding and are prioritising the demands of adults over invested in talking at children about their views about sex.
And I'm sorry if my previous post was intemperate but it's time people woke up and looked closely at some of the people shouting loudest about children needing to be taught about sex / porn / gender politics by them. Because this is (as usual) about those adults and their demands and nothing to do with what children need.

Absolutely 👏

In the send setting it has to be exceptionally clear. No room for misunderstanding.

Namenic · 11/07/2022 16:29

Age of consent and why - risk of health and mental health issues with children having sex too young - therefore the teenagers should not have sexual activity with someone younger than them and below the age of consent (it is illegal for good reason and they may be charged).

pornography - it is legal for over 18s but has links with sex trafficking and may not be truly consensual. Certainly that featuring minors would constitute child sex abuse as they cannot consent (as they do not understand the implications). what is depicted may not show proper consent, so if you tried to do the same thing in real life you may find yourself charged with rape. Addiction. Sexting and it’s dangers (blackmail, revenge porn - how to seek help if you are in this position). Grooming.

places you can go for help if you feel someone may have crossed your boundaries (even if you are not sure) or have worries about contraception, STDs or pregnancy - parent, GP, school nurse. How to deal with unwanted touching. Penalties for non-consensual touching.

Mysterioso · 11/07/2022 18:24

@achillestoes I disagree with making some sex acts more special called out than others. That's how we got to homophobia in the first place.
Teaching children not to deride other people's sexual discovery, however it happens, as long as it is safe and consensual, is of more value than the label we give it. There's a fine line in there for them to recognise when their peers are being abused which is difficult to teach.
If you want to reduce homophobia, the children need to just see it as sex, not special sex for special people.

Bwix · 11/07/2022 18:43

I think children should be taught that if they move in with a partner, they don't have equal rights to the house if they are unmarried and their name isn't on the mortgage. Too many people are treated terribly by partners and they don't have the safety net that marriage provides when this happens.

Mysterioso · 11/07/2022 18:50

Hmm there is one form of sex which is not like the others. One which can lead to pregnancy and this must be taught too.

I'm wrong and there is a form of sex which must be explicitly labelled.