WIBU to tentatively say the end is nigh?

[Wouldloveanother]

Just a few things running through my head while eating dinner
Maya’s ruling (well done Maya if you read this!)
the Cass report (which seems to have spooked the trans organisations)
the fact Stonewall and Mermaids have switched off all comments - like they know public opinion has turned
sports organisations finally seeing the light

theres a way to go but can I optimistically say the end is nigh?!

Suella Bravermann (I am not a fan at all, but then I hate the Tories) has just said on Peston she will run for Tory Leader and one of her things was getting rid of the woke nonsense. That may not be her actual words, but along those lines!

I worked in one of those organisations over a decade ago - 10 years behind other workplaces, but with a great deal of public responsibility. I am terrified of what I see in terms of policy in the NHS, and would refuse any treatment that involved an overnight stay (also I’m in Wales, which is some more years behind on trying to look progressive. Emphasis on ‘look’).
I thought all along that sport would be a tipping point, men who won’t get involved usually can see the unfairness there. It sets a precedent that actually, there are biological differences, that hopefully will spread out. But the public sector, where it matters most, will be the last to sober up.

Ah bugger, forgot to mention how massive Maya’s win is. A consultant doctor friend who never usually reacts liked my social media celebration of the British Tri decision today. I think that a lot of health professionals will feel more able to express an opinion after today, thank you Maya, you absolute legend!

yup pretty much this TWATW, they may (or may not) literally believe differently but that belief doesn't give anyone a justification/permission to ignore or disrespect sex as a protected characteristic, and that belief doesn't give anyone justification/permission to ignore or disrespect the sexual orientation of other people (protected characteristic). That respecting that they have their belief and treating them 'with respect' is not the same thing as complete instant and unequivocal submission / agreement to any thing they say no matter how sexist or homophobic. Just as it's perfectly possible to get along with people who follow a different religion but you're likely to object if your company introduces compulsory acts of worship in a religion you don't follow.

I think natal women still have a long, long way to go to convince the world that the tiny percentage of transwomen amongst us are oppressing us, rather than the other way around. We need to burst into tears more, and show just how delicate we are much more forcefully. People still don't seem to grasp how much having a penis and testicles - or even once having had a penis and testicles - makes a given human so much more mighty than we mere creatures who have only had a uterus. We need to do so much more to put them straight. We need to fight to show them that, though we're inherently weak, fragile and inherently inferior, society should be nice to us and allow us be equal! :)

(If that makes sense. Which it obviously doesn't.)

Oh dear.

Another snide ‘penis and testicles’ or some derivative of those words, and fragile women post.

Still early days, but a few years ago we were pariahs who dare not tell anyone something so obvious it almost shouldn’t need saying.

The right to hold and reasonably express my belief is not the same as persuading people I am right, but it’s an essential first step.

We need people to see how regressive encouraging transitioning rather than proper support for gender dysphoric teens is so that parents can trust medical professionals with their children again.

I think the Churchill wartime quote fits well here-"This is not the end, or even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps , the end of the beginning". Lots of sunlight everywhere as the bullshit religion is exposed as being a, er, bullshit religion.

I would have agreed with you if it wasn't for the fact that the Tories are in such a mess that Labour, or a coalition may well get in at the next election and make self id law!

What do you get out of posting this?

You literally plop onto a thread, type penis and testicles a few times, then sneer at everyone and leave.

It may be the end of the beginning: the first challenge was always going to be about pointing out the conflicts of interest hidden behind those deliberately obtuse mantras. You have to know there's a problem before you can fix it.

I've been raising the safeguarding alarm inside a third sector organisation on this for the last three to four years. Its been uphill, lonely and thankless - a careful dance around defensive colleagues and a continued resistance, more broadly, to even hearing there's a problem but...the cracks are showing and where there was once an over-confidence in approach, I'm finally seeing doubt. There are still those shoving their fingers in their ears LA LA LA-ING cos isnt it so much easier to just nod along and join in? And a few are doubling down. I can't do anything about that except keep speaking the truth and calmly asking questions I know they can't answer cos the rhetoric is empty or circular. Still, seeds get sewn. And I can't not do it because: kids.

Now is about golden bridges for those who fell asleep at the wheel or thought the medicalising of children (my main concern) sounded good. Those people need to get up to speed and help steady the ship again (except those whose job it was to know better, frankly they can get in the sea). We're going to need to tackle the large organisations, government systems, regulatory bodies and EDI Aunt Lydias enforcing Stonewall law. That will take time and I suspect many more legal challenges.

I was heartened by Maya's news and to see another grassroots professional group (this time, teachers) pulling together on another thread. We all have our areas of knowledge and influence, I guess we've just got to find the like-minded in our own worlds and... puuuuuullllll.

People are talking.

Talking brings consensus and debate.

That will do for me for now.

We will see where it takes us, but extremist views tend to wane when that happens.

I can't think how many times I've seen a variation on this thread topic since 2018.

I would like to be confident that we're at the end of the beginning.

As PPs, Helen Joyce, and various policy wonks have said, it will take potentially decades to unpick the harm that's been done by the policy capture of so many mainstream organisations such as govt. depts, the NHS etc.

I agree.

I was thinking this earlier and wondering about golden bridges. About 10% of my company have pronouns in their email display name (not even signature!), how do they row back from that?
But, Maya has made me braver, and if we're braver, we'll get there quicker!

Take a look at this thread

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4584395-bristol-council-goes-for-broke?reply=118375151

we are not even close.

Still drowning up here in Scotland.

On top of world class women saying they've had enough and using the law, Tullip / Ritchie is doing something for Netflix so....

Yup.

I do think we are at the start of something.

It will take time to trickle to the masses.

Bristol will get a legal challenge

This might be the beginning of the end, but there's still a long way to go.

Nottingham City Council are fully TWAW, hopefully being sued by Bindel will have some effect. Lots still left to do.

Unfortunately political turmoil may be an issue.

Makes me wonder if javid knew it was coming and ordered the review of medical records asap

I think 'no debate' is well and truly over. That really is the legacy from Maya's push through the courts.
The pendulum analogy is spot on though..

If you compare it to the process of a country going through a pandemic we are at the stage where a vaccine has been produced, trials are looking positive but we still need to produce it in vast quantities and get it in peoples arms.
So November 2020 basically, still lots of work to do.

Think are looking up, no-debate is over, BUT...

It pains me to say this as a lifelong left-winger, but a really fear the prospect a Labour (or Lab/Lib) government right now - because they are so captured still, would definitely bring in self-ID and no-debate once in power. An potentially undo all the good work of Cass, Bailey, Bell, Forstater etc.

I hope they stay out of government for the next decade. I think they're the biggest danger as the moment.

Hopefully dodgy Boris will go soon, and the Tories will choose someone else who has the public's respect.

Never in a million years would I have thought I would ever say that - but I do.

I’m sure you’ll agree that your employer shouldn’t have the right to dismiss you based on beliefs you hold.

If a gender-critical employer decided they wanted to not renew someone’s contract based entirely on the fact the employee had gender-ideological beliefs, that would also be wrong, no? It’s exactly the same point of law.

Your straw (wo)man seems to be aimed very badly and not at the actual issue at all. Not sure why there’s any relevance to this strange point of yours about penis and testicles. It has no bearing on the legal judgment at all. Do educate yourself and do better next time!