Stonewall founder - 'trans activists have wrecked all the good work of the gay rights charity I helped found'

[DomesticatedZombie]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10811203/Trans-activists-wrecked-good-work-Stonewall.html

Simon Fanshawe: 'I was one of the six co-founders of Stonewall in the 1980s. Along with the others, I poured all my energy into making the organisation a formidable force for gay and lesbian rights.

All that work is now in danger of being wrecked, Stonewall’s reputation discredited, and its credibility squandered, by trans activists — not all trans people, I hasten to add — who believe they can dictate what everyone is allowed to say and think.'

Ssshhh Simon, all that "same sex" stuff is old fashioned and embarrassing now.

Brilliant article. Sums it up nicely.

Did Medcalf really say that it would be OK to treat someone in their biological sex at a cervical screening service?

How transphobic! Does Medcalf not know that men can grow a cervix? I think we need to get David Lammy in to do some educating!

He's not wrong is he? Stonewall have gone from a force for good in the world to a byword for intolerance and bullying with a worrying side order of misogyny and removal of child safe guarding.

Unfortunately, I think many people have only heard about them in terms of their trans-takeover through the commonly used term 'being Stonewalled' and think that's what they have always stood for.

I'm not surprise Simon Fanshawe is hoping mad.

He's right. When all this gender and I identify as nonsense comes to a halt which it will, whose going to be blamed? The Kirrin Medcalfs of the world will slink away either into obscurity or some other 'cause'. Lesbians can't be blamed as they are the ones being severly discriminated against by all this. The guys in academia like that idiot yesterday who said women should accept a level of unfairness in sport, they will just say it was an academic argument and was never intended to cause hurt. That leaves one group, gay men and they will be the ones blamed by all the others who caused the problem first. They will be guilty by association with Stonewall, even though they are not responsible.

Here's an audio interview with him, posted yesterday

Did Medcalf really say that it would be OK to treat someone in their biological sex at a cervical screening service?

I know. If Medcalf thinks there is literally no such thing as a sexed body, how on earth does Medcalf think a doctor could even tell which biological sex a person was, in order to decide whether to give them cervical screening in the first place? Surely biological sex either exists or it doesn't. It can't wink into existence at medical appointments and then resume non-existence afterwards!

That leaves one group, gay men and they will be the ones blamed by all the others who caused the problem first.

Given that is exactly what some homophobes wanted back in the 80s, I wonder if this is all the culmination of a 30-year plan by them ? If so could we please ask them to fix the economy next ?

It is a great article, he must feel devastated that an organisation formed to fight bigotry and hatred , which it did very successfully and with a lot of support from the straight community, is now the very place spewing out bigotry and hatred towards anyone who dares to question it and is fast losing mainstream support as no one wants to be associated with ignorance and spite.

The daily mail. Grear source.

This issue is a bit complex, though. Generally speaking, it is accepted on both sides of the argument that stonewall are not the best organisation (until now, it seems).

Fwiw, trans and gay should never be in the same organisation regardless.

The first time I came across the trans and SW issue was via an article Simon Fanshawe wrote (and then followed I think by Matthew Parris) was it a couple of years ago? (Oh no! I just googled. It was almost exactly one year ago!!).

That rtiggered my interest and then I found the FWR board on MN. I have been so educated by this board and am really grateful to the MNetters on here who post.

I think SF must indeed be heartbroken at what stonewall has become. I am so glad he is speaking out. I also liked the little comparison with SW tactics and Donald Trump's tactics.

That podcast is really interesting, on a range of issues and the philosophy about difference, change, what a campaign is, the different roles of politics and identity, etc.

There maybe a misunderstanding. It's not a Mail leader. Simon Fanshawe wrote it. He's the source.

The daily mail. Grear source.The daily mail. Grear source.

@stopwaitingforpermissiontobeyou

Are you saying we shouldn't discuss the views of a towering figure in UK gay rights like Simon Fanshawe because his piece was published in the Daily Mail?

If not, what do you mean please?

Ask yourself - Would the Guardian have published it? Being wholly bought into the TWAW ideology.

(I say this as a Guardian reader, but now skip over much of the paper and quite often wonder why I still buy it.)

Personally I generally have little tolerance for the Daily Mail hate on this site. When it comes to discussing women's rights the DM has been the absolute leader out of all the papers. It will publish things and say things that others are too frightened to. The DM obviously has flaws,like any newspaper, but at least they are firm on the subject and their approach.

When it comes to discussing women's rights the DM has been the absolute leader out of all the papers.

I think that's a bit strong, but it's certainly been up there with the Times and the Telegraph, who've also been doing quite well. I'd say the Times is probably the strongest, just for being more in-depth, but I imagine the Mail has reached more people.

I can't stand the politics of the Telegraph, but on science reporting, I have always found them to be sound.

He's not been on the board of Stonewall since 1994. Its about time he stopped living off what was less than 8 years of involvement a long time ago. Ironically the housing association is a director of is listed, by Glinner, as a Stonewall Diversity Champion as well.... 😂

The last line sums it up perfectly for me.

Glad to be gay - they don’t want to be straight!

Glad to be trans? No, they want to be women.

@DisgustedofManchester Fanshawe was one of the few men and women who created Stonewall. They built it and made it what it became until 2014, when same sex marriage was achieved.

What has happened since 2015, when Stonewall adopted the "gender identity" ideology has destroyed what Fanshawe and others created.

Similarly, the women's refuge and rape crisis services were created from the 1960s by women for women. These too have been destroyed for women because of the adoption of "gender identity" ideology.

It is very easy to see why women including lesbians and also gay men understand "gender identity" ideology to be extremely destructive socially.

Seeing a lot of shoot the messenger type stuff on here recently.

When your preferred papers like the Guardian refuse to publish stuff like this, and the Daily Mail is willing to, perhaps you should change your viewpoint a bit?

How is he living off it?

His podcast is a critique of what a campaign is, where the fault lines lie between old style campaigning, the role of identity politics, an analysis of comparisons with other inequalities, how to make change, how to get buy in for change, his current work as a diversity consultant etc.

He is an interesting and informed commentator.