Guide Association settles with Katie Alcock

[GrimDamnFanjo]

I thought this deserves a thread of its own.

Well done!

go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=mobile.twitter.com/wontsomeonethi2/status/1516374537126002691?t=N6mKy04rpaiNyX9jmwKM6A&s=19

That's a very clear account of this, Katie. I was horrified to read this.

The atmosphere in the meeting room, at a Lancaster hotel, was forbidding and punitive.
'I asked if I could bring a friend and was told I could, but she couldn't speak. I was told I could take notes, but not take them away with me. It was like having my crimes read out in a secret court with no right of reply.
'I said I'd follow all the trans policies as long as they didn't conflict with safeguarding. I thought I'd done the right thing in not speaking out on a public social media site and that Girlguiding would applaud me for being concerned about safety. But they objected to both those things.
'They read a letter out to me saying I was expelled and I wanted to leave the room immediately. I couldn't hold it together. I was shaking, fighting back tears

How could the people present not see this for what it was. I'm so sorry that they did this to you.

Great article. Well done Katie.

Still, look at Katie's CV, what an inspirational and brilliant woman she is. There are many women out here (I'm one) who wouldn't have the stamina and resilience to stand up the the outrageous bullying described. It's such an uneven fight - but so many of us support Katie and others with the bravery to challenge it. I wonder how many donated to Katie's crowdfunder (and Allison's and everyone else's) - I bet it was hundreds and hundreds of women, all quietly opposing this. I hope Girlguiding is looking at that - how many women and men donated. The absolute numbers of us giving 5 or 10 quid, the little we can afford, to challenge this threat to our daughters.

Those in charge at Girlguiding should be issuing a detailed apology for every single thing they did wrong and hang their heads in shame.

That meeting in Lancaster was a disgrace.

This article is currently the most prominent one on Mail Online.

The crowdfunder was probably worth it for this publicity alone. I hadn’t realised Katie was allowed unfettered freedom to speak out now - gagging clauses are so common these days. Well played, Katie.

That's fantastic article. Well done Katie 🥂

I've never been happier to see a daily mail link.

But the last sentence is
"Girlguiding is proud to be an inclusive and diverse organisation and will always remain so."
Which is basically a fuck you, as we all know "inclusive" means prioritizing penis people over women and girls.

Thank you Katie.

Girlguiding hasn't changed anything about their inclusion policy.
Adult males (who claim to be women) will still be able to sleep in tents and shower with girls aged 4-16.
It's outrageous.

I can't understand why it's taking so long for GG to clarify things. You'd think they'd just copy things over from Scouts. If it's because there are male-bodied people who insist on being treated as female, or their advocates insist, then are they having similar problems in Scouts?

Incidentally, Katie you look lovely in the Damian McFadden photo in the Mail article and I love the dinosaur blouse further down. Oh, and thank you.

The cat is out of the bag now

A good article which may make parents aware and ask more questions. Why on earth could GG have not acknowledged girls or women who might have identified as boys in their policy therefore still retaining the trans people while protecting their safety? And why can’t they now have a look at the Equality act exemptions? But the right to talk about it is valuable. Well done and thank you Katie

Thank you Katie. I'm grateful and full of admiration for fighting this fight. The resulting publicity will reach so many parents who are still in the dark and confused.

Why has the link to the mail article stopped working. I had read it but cannot go back to it now?

Try this one

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-10765045/I-outcast-shunned-like-criminal-just-wanting-Girl-Guides-safe.html

As a side note - is Katie wearing a dinosaur blouse in one of the photos in the link??! Awesome!

@IcakethereforeIam

There is the same issue in scouts, although i don't see anyone talking about it on MN as much as guiding. Scouts trans policy says that young members can use toilets, showers etc of gender they identify as.

Oh, ffs, you'd think Scouts would know better? Fool me once, etc.

@AnotherNC22 Sorry, just reread your comment, properly this time. How young?

@IcakethereforeIam sorry i mistyped - the actual policy refers to young people (not young members) but the scout website defines young people as anyone under 18. Which presumably means age 4 upwards as that is the age that Squirrel scouts starts.

Thanks for the clarification. At least it's not the leaders.

I am, I wore it for the Sunday Times photo shoot but the one in the Mail is a selfie from Twitter.

Scouting doesn't allow adults and children to share tents/toilets or changing rooms. There are always kids toilets and adults are a separate building.

I'm surprised if GC allow this as even if they were all the same sex there are safeguarding risks with having adults and children in the same private space.

Thank you @KatieAlcock. You have shown incredible resilience to carry on against such strongly held opinion. I cannot imagine what it must have been like to have people shun you and to loose friends or even have passing acquaintances make it clear that they disagreed with your stance. Thank you for staying strong and holding onto your truth, not that trans people are unwelcome in the Guiding Association but that safeguarding is paramount and that girls should not be held up against stereotypes... girls can be who ever they want to be, in the protected space that is a guiding unit. I truly hope that other leaders see the sense in what you stand for and echo it in their own units.

Really well done Alison x

Thank you, Katie.

Girlguiding has been incredibly disingenuous about its adoption of the Gender Woo - some would say dishonest - and has been utterly derelict in its duty of safeguarding.

The secrecy is the big giveaway. I'm glad parents will now know what they are signing their girls up to. I hope a lot of them are asking questions today.

This is fantastic coverage.

Does it have its own thread?!