British Cycling suspends trans and non binary policy pending review

[FemaleAndLearning]

Breaking news!
Well done to the female cyclists and supporters if women's sport.
twitter.com/BritishCycling?t=Jg6qvomNgoKgr4obHTrQ9A&s=09

Thank you MrsAvocet

The women who used to come on my Breeze rides were always nervous and often cancelled their places on rides due to anxiety. They would not have gone anywhere near a traditional cycling club so Breeze was their only option for a safe, friendly option.

Unfortunately I’ve got testimony from many women who will not attend Breeze rides now due to this policy and it’s because they don’t want to ride with males, however they identify.

Yes, that was me too Quadzilla
I'm now a Level 2 coach, race organiser and chair of a local club but without Breeze I would still be sat on the couch wondering if I dared get my bike out again. I'm very anxious in new social situations even now, and at the time I was much worse affected by anxiety. Like many Breeze newbies I'd booked and cancelled several times before I finally showed up, and the fact that I knew it was an all women thing was crucial in persuading me to try. I don't have factors like previous abuse, or religious restrictions etc to consider, but it still mattered to me to be in a group of women. For those with other considerations it's absolutely crucial. There are other mixed sex recreational programmes which in my opinion BC need to develop further anyway, so Breeze needs to stay women only.

BBC Sport has had to update its totally misleading headline which originally said all trans people were blocked from competing in anything, this is slightly more accurate "Transgender women no longer able to compete at elite female events run by British Cycling" (www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/61036110)

(Still wish these journalists would be more honest and say males)

A bet a lot of tears have been shed in the Stonewall offices in the past fortnight.

Is Emily's mum on a thread on mumsnet? Of is she being reported in the press?

I think (as a non lawyer so feel free to ignore) Emily has a case for gender reassignment discrimination over how BC handled thd whole thing, but not against the actual policy of saying tw can't compete against women, which seems to me to be plainly legal.

Emily has had bad treatment whic an athlete without the pc could not have had. She was told if she achieved a certain t level she could enter the women's race. She did that. They changed the rules. It's a cock up. But the cause of it is that BC designed an unfair (to women) policy, didn't take womens objections seriously, tried to silence them in an authoritarian way. They should have made a sensible decision before there was a specific individual at the centre.

They could end up losing any suit to Emily on that but I would love to see the actual policy tested in court.

If they had stuck with the old policy then a law suit from a woman who missed out might have happened.

She's in the press Manderlay

Bridges’ mum Sandy Sullivan tweeted the British Cycling statement and added: “Dumped by email. We’ve just received this in our inbox. We will be making a statement at some point during the next 24 hrs.”

So we will have to wait for the next statement

Though this is also being touted in the same articles

The UK Sport chief executive, Sally Munday, said Bridges would be entitled to public funding up to £27,000 a year, plus benefits, if world cycling’s governing body, the UCI, allows her to compete as a woman and praised her “incredible resilience”.

So who knows what will actually happen? Except for the airbrushing. Always with the airbrushing!

She’s also be watching this thread Manderley 👋🏼 Hi Sandy!

This is fab news. I do wonder what'll happen to women who take testosterone and call themselves "transmen" but still participate in the women's category. Would they not now have a new advantage? But they are nowhere near the testosterone level let alone sheer biology of men to be able to compete fairly. What are they to do?

@MrsJamin

This is fab news. I do wonder what'll happen to women who take testosterone and call themselves "transmen" but still participate in the women's category. Would they not now have a new advantage? But they are nowhere near the testosterone level let alone sheer biology of men to be able to compete fairly. What are they to do?

I imagine they won't be allowed because it will be considered doping. Nobody has any difficulty saying no to the wants of female people so I don't really see this becoming an issue.

Women aren't allowed to dope with testosterone. Not identifying as a woman doesn't change that. To be in the female category you have to be female and have a testosterone under 5. Anyone else can compete in the much more inclusive male/ open category.
Women need a protected category. Men don't so their category can be more open ( although in sports other than cycling other restrictions may be needed to ensure participant safety eg contact sports

To be in the female category you have to be female and have a testosterone under 5.

Citation? I'm not aware of any sports bodies that have a natural testosterone level requirement for women. They just can't be taking supplementary testosterone at all.

All the testosterone level requirements are on males - either trans or DSD - as part of a justification to admit them despite not being female.

@MrsJamin

This is fab news. I do wonder what'll happen to women who take testosterone and call themselves "transmen" but still participate in the women's category. Would they not now have a new advantage? But they are nowhere near the testosterone level let alone sheer biology of men to be able to compete fairly. What are they to do?

They’d have to get a TUE and compete in the male category?

They can’t take banned substances and compete in the female category because that would be doping.

@OvaHere

It's not really her kids career though is it? Bridges didn't make the cut to be coached for male Olympic stardom just before the transition decision was taken.

Lots of men and women are faced with coming as far as they can in sport every day. I have no doubt it feels devastating to have come very close to making it but not being quite the pinnacle to receive investment.

If goes any further than it has it will not be Bridges' career it will be a career that was stolen from a woman/women.

In the podcast mentioned elsewhere on this thread Sharron Davies very clearly makes the point about how Thomas’ wins impacted female swimmers and stole their chances .

The one who missed out on being included in the Penn state team.
The one who missed out being in the last 20
The one who missed out being in the final 8
The one who missed out on a podium place
The one who missed out on a first place citation.

So in just one race 5 women were bumped from their rightful place by Thomas’ inclusion in the Penn State team. 5 women whose years of training, dedication and hunger for success were dismissed as irrelevant so a mediocre male swimmer could satisfy his male privileged ego.

Sorry, pressed too soon, so for every male athlete in a womens event, it is not just the women in the finals who miss out, there is a sad trail of broken dreams from women who have had their rightful places stolen from them.

Not sure whether it's coincidental timing or not, but this article just popped up onnmy Facebook newsfeed.
www.cyclingnews.com/blogs/rach-mcbride/rach-mcbride-blog-competing-in-a-non-binary-category-a-profound-experience/
I don't agree with everything in this blog, and the author is non binary not trans so its a bit different, but I found it very interesting to read a different perspective and to see that alternatives to the "men and everyone else" model are being explored elsewhere.

@MrsAvocet

Not sure whether it's coincidental timing or not, but this article just popped up onnmy Facebook newsfeed. www.cyclingnews.com/blogs/rach-mcbride/rach-mcbride-blog-competing-in-a-non-binary-category-a-profound-experience/ I don't agree with everything in this blog, and the author is non binary not trans so its a bit different, but I found it very interesting to read a different perspective and to see that alternatives to the "men and everyone else" model are being explored elsewhere.

The problem with a non-binary category is that almost everyone with that identity is either male or female. So the male-bodied people would probably beat the female-bodied people in all the events were undergoing male puberty matters.

In that sense it's not a solution at all. But it also demonstrates to me why basing categories on an inner identity is not ultimately meaningful as it is the body types which cause differences, not identities.

As an aside, I don't have a female gender identity, and I am concerned with the rule that everyone is now supposed to have one or to transition out of the new 'feminine' gender that 'women' seems to be turning into.

@nepeta

As an aside, I don't have a female gender identity, and I am concerned with the rule that everyone is now supposed to have one or to transition out of the new 'feminine' gender that 'women' seems to be turning into.

In my experience I don’t think many women I know feel they have to transition out of anything if they are happy in their own skin. And if you are happy in your skin then you should not need to feel you have to become something you aren’t to prove it.

The problem arises if for any reason you , or anyone, feels the need , for whatever reason , to access a single sex space. I am quite happy to demand a female only space because I am happy in my female skin . I don’t know what someone who doesn’t feel they have a female identity does.

Another shit Twitter take: “I may be looking at this incredibly cynically, but it seems exceptionally spiteful of British Cycling to scrap their transgender/non-binary policy solely because of ONE trans athlete participating in elite sport. It’s a change targeted at one specific woman.”

So if just one person participated in a competition using an unfair advantage, that’s LESS unfair (according to this) than if everyone or many people used that same advantage?

How does that work, then?

@MrsAvocet

Not sure whether it's coincidental timing or not, but this article just popped up onnmy Facebook newsfeed. www.cyclingnews.com/blogs/rach-mcbride/rach-mcbride-blog-competing-in-a-non-binary-category-a-profound-experience/ I don't agree with everything in this blog, and the author is non binary not trans so its a bit different, but I found it very interesting to read a different perspective and to see that alternatives to the "men and everyone else" model are being explored elsewhere.

"Rach McBride is a professional triathlete who will turn to the dirt in 2022 to race the Life Time Grand Prix gravel series, which boasts a $250,000, split equally between men and women. McBride is listed in the women's category but identifies as non-binary and will blog about their experience in the series for Cyclingnews."

So she's still competing as a woman, as she wouldn't see a single dollar of that $250k in a non-binary or open category. She might as well identify as a dog, as it doesn't matter what her identity is if she's biologically female and competing in the female category.

Sorry Rach, but it's just another "look at me I'm so special" validation exercise on the surface when the reality is same old same old, she fully understands the difference between sex and gender when it comes to the prize money.

Sorry, they.

Fwiw I've never felt a particular affinity to the gender side of being female either, but I'm 100% sure what my sex is. Surprise surprise you can separate your body from your feelings if you really try. Rach would only be a groundbreaker if they insisted on a NB category with equal prize money as men's and women's. But as noted by nepeta that wouldn't get Rach any prize money would it. Even the genderists who are female understand how self-defeating this is.

@Fenlandia

BBC Sport has had to update its totally misleading headline which originally said all trans people were blocked from competing in anything, this is slightly more accurate "Transgender women no longer able to compete at elite female events run by British Cycling" (www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/61036110)

(Still wish these journalists would be more honest and say males)

Yeah. The ‘trans people are BANNED’ headlines are much more click baity than ‘males asked not to participate in female sport’. Almost like one sounds mean and nasty and the other sounds entirely reasonable and non/controversial….

I don’t think we should have a non-binary category because we base categories on things that exist, like sex or weight and not made-up bollocks. Why not have a competition only open to Libras if we’re going down that road?

Yes the " trans female" label is concerning. It shows an attempt to appropriate the term "female" too, to bypass the EA maybe? Or just general theft of othe term?