£1k fine for attack on a 17 year-old girl

Kanaloa · 07/04/2022 01:26

So it’s no longer illegal to attack women, it just costs 1k. Sad.

How on earth do parents try to find the balance between giving teenagers the freedom to fly, spread their wings and embrace the world vs instilling in them that they need to have their wits about them?

This is something DH and I talk about all the time in regards to dd10. She is a lovely girl, very much a mummy and daddy’s girl and a homebody, but she is very naive and trusting. Her brother is one year older and goes to the shop alone, cinema, park etc. I don’t know what I would say if she asked to go to the shop alone. I don’t know what I’ll do when she’s a teen. Hopefully in the next few years she’ll become more street smart but I hate that because her naivety isn’t a bad thing as such.

Kanaloa · 07/04/2022 01:27

But I suppose at 17 there just isn’t much you can do. I was a mum at that age to the worst possible choice of father. If it was one of my kids it would be heart rending but what can you actually do even if you know the relationship is bad and your child will get hurt? Because any strong action might push them further away.

Original poster

Furries · 07/04/2022 01:42

@Kanaloa - completely get all the points you’re making. I don’t envy being a parent.

It’s sad that you’re ok for your son to have those small amounts of freedom, but you worry about your daughter when she reaches the same age. Not blaming you at all, am sure many feel like that.

Equally, the level of male-on-male violence is high. And has always been high.

The sad thing is, the majority of violence always comes from males. Blaming bad parenting, poverty, abuse etc doesn’t seem enough to “excuse” it. Many girls grow up in the same circumstances, but do not resort to the same actions, certainly not to the same number as those carried out by males.

OP posts:

Kanaloa · 07/04/2022 02:09

Yes I suppose it is sad. I don’t think it’s as much about my son being male but my daughter is a certain type of child. Obviously we have taught her about how to be as safe as possible but she’s very soft hearted and gentle. Compared to my son who isn’t really as much like this.

But yes unfortunately I feel more worried for her than for my son as they grow in the world. I wish I didn’t but I do. Not so much with my younger kids but of course they don’t go out in the world alone at the moment.

MargaritaPie · 07/04/2022 03:21

A young woman punched a 58 year old man killing him. Her sentence was a 6 month curfew 7pm-6am.

The motive was apparently she was drunk and demanded he apologise for accidentally bumping into her friend, which he refused to do.

www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-news/baby-faced-teenager-punches-man-6900890

Maybe it's the system in general that needs looked at.

Goldenbutterflies · 07/04/2022 04:09

@MargaritaPie

A young woman punched a 58 year old man killing him. Her sentence was a 6 month curfew 7pm-6am.

The motive was apparently she was drunk and demanded he apologise for accidentally bumping into her friend, which he refused to do.

www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-news/baby-faced-teenager-punches-man-6900890

Maybe it's the system in general that needs looked at.

The facts of the cases are entirely different and in no way should they result in the same ‘punishment’ anyway, so you can’t judge the system as a whole by comparing them.

DontLikeCrumpets · 07/04/2022 04:26

@Kanaloa Given her trusting nature have you ever considered enrolling her in a self--defence course?

Kanaloa · 07/04/2022 04:31

Hmm it’s not a bad idea. However she is only 10! I think DH and I have the same worry which is that it’s unfair that she can’t just be a trusting 10yo. But then that’s life. Obviously we tell her all the things you need to know - you must never ever go with someone you don’t know, you must never ever get in anyone’s car etc. And theoretically she knows this stuff. However, in a real life situation? Say if someone seemed elderly or disabled or needed her help? I don’t think she would have the sense. But maybe that comes with age and she’ll have more of a sense when she’s in her teens. I certainly hope so although I feel sad that she will need to reconsider her gentle and trusting nature.

timeisnotaline · 07/04/2022 04:46

I assume he was under 18, which the article is very careful not to say despite being full of ‘the 17yo girl… ‘ that doesn’t make it ok but lighter sentencing for minors is certainly pretty standard.

NitroNine · 07/04/2022 05:26

Except that’s not what the article actually says @MargaritaPie - in fact it says more than once that the relevant medical experts concluded she wasn’t responsible for his death. Once using the judge’s statement O’Hara was not responsible: Judge Sophie McKone told O'Hara: "Mr Turner has since died but I make it absolutely clear that you bear no responsibility for that. There is evidence from two experts, a pathologist and a neuro-pathologist, who concluded that your actions did not contribute to his death.” O’Hara wasn’t simply randomly not charged with Turner’s manslaughter (or indeed murder, the investigation that was originally opened)/convicted of it but then given an absurdly light sentence.

The article very clearly states O'Hara was given a six-month suspended custodial sentence, a six-month 7pm to 6am curfew and 20 days' rehabilitation. Presumably the hope is to effect a behavioural change such that this remains her only offence; rather than immediately jumping to the most punitive option the justice system allows for.

Did you not read the article; or did you just hope that none of us would? Or are you imbued with such astonishing confidence you believe you know better than the neurologist, neuro-pathologist, CPS & presiding judge? (Some heady combination of the three?)

SayYouDontMind · 07/04/2022 09:00

Margarita Pie this might get me banned but how fucking dare you come on this thread about this despicable crime and criminal sentencing with your shitty 'whataboutery'. Who does that?? I was absolutely despairing when I read about this case. And then to come on here and see you at it. FFS.

happydappy2 · 07/04/2022 09:34

Furries I was surprised by this ruling.But when you look at the sentencing guidelines (available online) It was a prolonged/persistent assault which caused more than minor physical harm/distress. Putting it in High culpability, category 1 harm, which carries a sentence of low level community order to 26 weeks custody. If he pleaded guilty he'll get 1/3 off his sentence-being under 25 is mitigation and he could have had no prior convictions. However it was against an intimate partner which makes it worse-we don't have all the facts but this does seem too lenient. Never forget the law was written by men, for men....men can plead all sorts of things to reduce the severity of punishment. At least he has a conviction so has lost his 'previous good character.'

Ereshkigalangcleg · 07/04/2022 09:56

Who does that?? I was absolutely despairing when I read about this case. And then to come on here and see you at it. FFS.

I think it's quite illuminating of this person's priorities, which we see in several of their areas of interest on Mumsnet.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 07/04/2022 10:09

I think it's quite illuminating of this person's priorities, which we see in several of their areas of interest on Mumsnet

Exactly.

And I wonder how long it took to wade through the litanies of cases of males torturing, killing, raping, assaulting, maiming and disfiguring females - an entrenched, cross-cultural and historical pattern to find one of the few cases where a female assaults a male.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 07/04/2022 10:30

Hmm it’s not a bad idea. However she is only 10!

This is an excellent time to get her into martial arts training.

TheWeeDonkey · 07/04/2022 10:36

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Who does that?? I was absolutely despairing when I read about this case. And then to come on here and see you at it. FFS.

I think it's quite illuminating of this person's priorities, which we see in several of their areas of interest on Mumsnet.

A person best avoided for sure.

Hoardasurass · 07/04/2022 10:39

@timeisnotaline he was 19 when he attacked her and 22 now

Original poster

Furries · 07/04/2022 10:40

@MargaritaPie

A young woman punched a 58 year old man killing him. Her sentence was a 6 month curfew 7pm-6am.

The motive was apparently she was drunk and demanded he apologise for accidentally bumping into her friend, which he refused to do.

www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-news/baby-faced-teenager-punches-man-6900890

Maybe it's the system in general that needs looked at.

Blimey - didn’t realise that your “excuses” covered such a broad range of scenarios regarding women.

Seriously, you saw those pictures and this was the “best” you could come up with in response?

At least I know for definite now that I won’t bother engaging with anything else you post anywhere on this board - not worthy of my time or energy.

OP posts:

Original poster

Furries · 07/04/2022 10:43

@happydappy2

Furries I was surprised by this ruling.But when you look at the sentencing guidelines (available online) It was a prolonged/persistent assault which caused more than minor physical harm/distress. Putting it in High culpability, category 1 harm, which carries a sentence of low level community order to 26 weeks custody. If he pleaded guilty he'll get 1/3 off his sentence-being under 25 is mitigation and he could have had no prior convictions. However it was against an intimate partner which makes it worse-we don't have all the facts but this does seem too lenient. Never forget the law was written by men, for men....men can plead all sorts of things to reduce the severity of punishment. At least he has a conviction so has lost his 'previous good character.'

I hadn’t realised how bad the guidelines were re sentencing. This board really has opened my eyes as to how shit things are.

OP posts:

Kanaloa · 07/04/2022 12:39

@EmbarrassingHadrosaurus

Hmm it’s not a bad idea. However she is only 10!

This is an excellent time to get her into martial arts training.

Yes it probably is realistically. Her big brother actually competes in a marital art and has been doing so for years - it’s just not her thing at all. Perhaps I could take her to one with me though which might make her join in.

There’s always one person who will dig through and insist that oh look women do this too. It’s the same if you mention racism, someone will scrape through and find some instance of a black person engaging in some sort of poor behaviour to a white person and say oh but look this happened.

IncompleteSenten · 07/04/2022 12:41

Every day we are shown just how little we matter.
🤬

RishiRich · 07/04/2022 12:43

Thant's disgusting. That poor girl!

FusionChefGeoff · 07/04/2022 13:14

@Kanaloa yes it sounds like DD is naturally different to DS but don't underestimate the power of female socialisation on an already trusting girl.

MrsTerryPratchett · 07/04/2022 15:24

I've reported @MargaritaPie post. Not to get it hidden because that's just cosmetic. Whatabouting the maiming of a child is one of the most clearly misogynistic things I've ever seen. Bad enough the posts about vulnerable prostituted women but not giving a shit about a scarred 17 yo?

What the fuck is wrong with you?

Kanaloa · 07/04/2022 15:32

I honestly don’t think margarita actually has any opinions on this, I think it’s just contrariness. Nobody could possibly think female on male violence is anywhere near the level that male violence to others is.

There was another poster who used to do similar. If you posted something like ‘difficult for mums in the workplace’ she would race frantically to type out how it is so much harder for men because xyz. If you posted about charities that help women in war torn countries she would be hysterically typing out how much worse it was for men etc. Just generally odd.