Times article - It’s immoral to deny trans athletes a sporting chance

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www.thetimes.co.uk/article/df7f374a-b2c4-11ec-9af1-7ee554784c95?shareToken=6018c1397fc9d126ddc8c038ababb035

Apart from cheating, what category-based solutions have such 'athletes' come up with?

Immoral ?? Is that all they've got?
I'll take my chances with hell, thank you very much.

That’s not a sporting chance, though.

I saw an article today to suggest of cause trans athletes can continue to compete. In a newly formed trans category. That seems to be the fairest solution all round.

But, but, but Michael Phelps has famously large feet…

Fuck off.

So someone with no clue and a stated lack of interest in sport feels they are an authority above a professional sportswoman who knows the ins and outs of athletics to the highest level?

Get in the bin. Some opinions are less valid than others. Specifically poorly informed ones.

Yes sport does discriminate against people who are crap at sport

I am a member of that community. I have suffered - feel my pain.

But it should not discriminate against females by giving males more opportunities to win

There is a word for that

The word is sexism

big hands ... big hands ...

Competitive sport discriminates in so many ways - adults are not allowed to participate in the junior category, heavy weights can't compete against feather weights, able bodied athletes can't compete in the Paralympics so when are they going to make all those things 'inclusive'.

She's having her arse handed to her in the comments though, so that's heartening.

A sporting chance ?

What is sporting about letting males play in the female category ?

I always thought a Sporting chance is where a stronger opponent deliberately handicaps themselves - play left handed for example - to make the game more balanced

No one is saying they cannot compete or participate in sports. They are perfectly welcome to compete on the sports categories relevant to their sex.

Well I'm sorry if I offend but the paralympics has separate categories for different degrees of disabilty, they are not just all lumped together en masse.
Why can't trans people have their own category. I can't understand it they clearly have an advantage over us.

Should it therefore not stand that it is 'immoral to deny women athletes a sporting chance'?

And what is this 'sporting chance'? To compete or to win?

Because there is no barrier to trans women competing in their own sex category is there. Nobody is stopping Lia or Emily from competing in the male class of their sport.

The thing is it's not immoral to insist that sports should be sex segregated it doesn't prevent trans women from competing it just means that they have to compete with other males instead of giving them the massive advantages that they have when competing against women.
Personally I think that its immoral and a type of cheating when you allow men (however they identify) to compete in women's events

Transpeople are not stopped from taking part in sports.

It is, however, immoral to deny women a sporting chance.

My son is disabled. Is it immoral to deny him the chance to participate in mainstream sports? Or immoral to deny his brother the chance to participate in the Paralympics?

What a pointless argument.

@Shehasadiamondinthesky

Well I'm sorry if I offend but the paralympics has separate categories for different degrees of disabilty, they are not just all lumped together en masse. Why can't trans people have their own category. I can't understand it they clearly have an advantage over us.

I had the same thought but there are a lot of points that don’t work equally for trans women and trans men I think and where do they compete? In their biological sex category recognising that as their disability or their trans category recognising that their new gender is a disadvantage in sport? I’m tying myself up a bit but ultimately I don’t think there’s an appetite to recognise anything more than ‘I am what I say I am’.

I would’ve thought being born as the wrong sex would be considered a disability but I suspect that’s a very unpopular stance.

Does anyone else feel like there's a groundswell in our favour at the moment? This article feels desperate.

I can't see the comments any more in the Times articles. Gutted, they are the best part

@McDuffy

Does anyone else feel like there's a groundswell in our favour at the moment? This article feels desperate.

Yes I've noticed that recently too. And the TRAs are sounding more desperate.

Owen Jones and Nancy Kelley in particular.

The author lost me at “cisgender”. Zzzzzzz.

Sporting = not cheating to get into the wrong category to get an unfair advantage

But there are real people at the centre of this, people whose lives are made infinitely more difficult, not to mention dangerous, every time we decide that their human rights are up for debate
Yes Louise there are. But not necessarily the people you are worried about. The women and girls who miss out on scholarships that might lift them into a different life for example.

Is anybody anywhere actually denying human rights to transpeople? Anyone saying that transpeople's human rights are up for debate?

I have only seen people saying that they should not be granted privileges.

Human Rights have always been debated

They weren't delivered cast into stone by Moses