What should a politician say re: TWAW

[Walkingtheplank]

Lots of clips of politicians stumbling over the simple question of What is a woman or Is a transwoman a woman. It's like they're not prepared.
What do you think they should say? Even if they think it, they can't just say 'Adult Human Female' or 'No' to those questions because they'd probably get an aggressive follow up question.

How can they say the above without offending the very vocal transactivists? Is it possible? I'm not sure it is.

I things would be much better if they were worried about offending women, and therefore gave factually correct answers, such as adult human female.

They should say TWATW. Trans people deserve care and support but not at the expense of women's identity, security and fairness.

They should say that TWATW who have very specific social and health needs which are different (note different not less than) to those of women, there should be a range of policy interventions designed to safeguard and protect TW that do not come at the expense of women and girls access to single sex spaces and services.

Why don't they just say what they really think? They're grown ups in power. As long as they're respectful to both sides, the majority of the electorate will be supportive. It would be refreshing to hear what politicians really think instead of what they are told you say.

Legally, yes, and we support that. In actual literal fact, no. Women are biological adult females.

They can’t say this without offending aggressive activists, but you can rarely say anything without offending aggressive activists.

They could say 'you know, the reason you're all asking us this question is because we politicians, as a group, have been trying to avoid talking about this issue as much as possible. We took our eye off the ball and didn't pay attention. That stops now. There's a serious debate taking place now about how we ensure trans people and women all feel safe, respected and heard, and I personally am going to go all-out to take that debate seriously. So, in terms of your original question: most people think a woman is an extremely straightforward concept - that it's someone of the female sex, and that trans women who have lived long and consistently as women are also to be accepted as such in social and legal situations. But the public knows that this is really a debate about safety and fairness, not definitions, and we've ended up arguing about definitions because politicians of all parties have failed to properly engage with the conversation the public has been having.'

What do you think they should say? Even if they think it, they can't just say 'Adult Human Female' or 'No' to those questions because they'd probably get an aggressive follow up question.

Yes they can say 'adult human female'. It is normal for politicians to get aggressive follow-up questions. If they are too fragile or cowardly to tell the plain honest truth, or to face questioning over their views/policies, they shouldn't be in politics.

Pacific - that’s good.

@bellinisurge

They should say TWATW. Trans people deserve care and support but not at the expense of women's identity, security and fairness.

100% this. How it is otherwise, I have no idea.

What did politicians think was going to happen when they made laws allowing men to get female birth certificates? When they made an arse of an act that made it ambiguous at best to give women and girls space away from men?

They made the laws, they should be able to justify it without my help. Otherwise what are we paying them for?

Thanks tabby. I missed my calling as a SPAD 😂

Interesting piece by Isabel Hardman on this www.spectator.co.uk/article/labour-is-falling-into-the-tim-farron-trap-on-sex-and-gender

So in 20 minutes, various suitable responses have been provided. Why cant they and their advisors work it out? You'd think they'd come up with a stock response that empathised, was sensitive to TWs and protected women's safety. It's not that hard.

So in 20 minutes we have numerous decent responses. You have to wonder why the politicians cant do this.

They could just say 'I define 'woman' as 'adult human femnale', like the dictionary. Transwomen are transwomen: they are called transwomen because they are not women.'

Sooner or later they're just going to have to stand up to the TRAs. Might as well get it all over and done with quickly, like ripping off a plaster. First politician to do it will get a standing ovation from 51% of the population.

Because ‘sensitive to TW’ isn’t going to be enough for the PLP or the wider Labour Party.

Pacificstate, your answer is absolutely brilliant.

Bellini and Pacific have some good responses.

I'd add to it - for the braver among them - that they could say lobby groups' interpretation of the GRA and pushing of those interpretations have harmed women and children. And that the harm to women and children is unacceptable.

I'd say the law about single sex spaces needs to be made very clear and that no one must ever be afraid to apply safeguarding rules because they fear being called transphobic for doing their job.

I'd say that a free press is vital to a functioning democracy and that I've been saddened to see the press seemingly worried about reporting the truth. That plain English needs to have a comeback and that children need facts, not dogma in their education.

Finally, that pushing at edges and stretching (what's already poorly drafted law) has been bad for trans people who have had AGPs setting up camp. But I doubt any politician would go there - the expansion of the trans umbrella to include just about anything is too complicated an area to get across in an interview and the pileon would be too much.

@RestingPandaFace

They should say that TWATW who have very specific social and health needs which are different (note different not less than) to those of women, there should be a range of policy interventions designed to safeguard and protect TW that do not come at the expense of women and girls access to single sex spaces and services.

This. And women are adult human females.

@RestingPandaFace

They should say that TWATW who have very specific social and health needs which are different (note different not less than) to those of women, there should be a range of policy interventions designed to safeguard and protect TW that do not come at the expense of women and girls access to single sex spaces and services.

How can I vote for you, pls?

@PacificState

They could say 'you know, the reason you're all asking us this question is because we politicians, as a group, have been trying to avoid talking about this issue as much as possible. We took our eye off the ball and didn't pay attention. That stops now. There's a serious debate taking place now about how we ensure trans people and women all feel safe, respected and heard, and I personally am going to go all-out to take that debate seriously. So, in terms of your original question: most people think a woman is an extremely straightforward concept - that it's someone of the female sex, and that trans women who have lived long and consistently as women are also to be accepted as such in social and legal situations. But the public knows that this is really a debate about safety and fairness, not definitions, and we've ended up arguing about definitions because politicians of all parties have failed to properly engage with the conversation the public has been having.'

Will also vote for you, twice.

@bellinisurge

They should say TWATW. Trans people deserve care and support but not at the expense of women's identity, security and fairness.

THIS TWATW. It really is so simple and that is why we should be suspicious of what lies behind the unnecessary obfuscation.

Also the answer to a question about women's sex based rights is NEVER 'Trans rights blah blah blah'

They should also (if they ever want my vote again) add that they are also keen to investigate the sudden massive spike in girls and young women trying to 'identify out' of womanhood and the role played in this trend by social media immersion and online porn, something their generation did not have to contend with as teenagers.

But and this is a big but.....there is no point in stating what would be an acceptable form of words and all the voters falling for this u-turn, if they then go and pass law achieving something different such as a TW is a W so can access women's spaces.
We need to be very careful about what they really mean by what they say.

@ZuttZeVootEeeVo

What did politicians think was going to happen when they made laws allowing men to get female birth certificates? When they made an arse of an act that made it ambiguous at best to give women and girls space away from men?

They made the laws, they should be able to justify it without my help. Otherwise what are we paying them for?

I agree.

Most of the responses on this thread are doing the placating TRA bit and frankly I am sick and bloody tired of everything having to be caveated with that.

As another poster said just rip the plaster off and state clearly and unequivocally that TW are not women, those TW with a GRC have the 'legal' fiction that they are but that is all it is a legal fiction and does not and should not override biological sex and the protections that requires.

TWATW is the most diplomatic thing to say. Women are 50% of the population while trans people are 1% of the population. Assuming that TW are half of that then it's between annoying 50% or 0.5%. If you want to be in power then the choice isn't difficult- you want to keep the 50% on your side.