Boris Johnson just stated that biology dictates what is a man / woman

[NoWordForFluffy]

Just now on PMQs.

Has he ever come out and said that before?

@Iwassonaive thank you. I should read Kathleen Stock’s book.

@Bancha

Would someone be able to explain to me, if the Tories are the only party to acknowledge biological reality, how is it that male prisoners can identify into female prison estates, and male patients have the opportunity to sexually assault female patients in hospital? Not at all trying to be goady. I care very deeply about this issue - came for the babies, stayed for the feminism.

Johnson has only been power two and a half years. Nearly all of that time has been pandemic.

Before Johnson, it was May, Greening and others supporting GRA reform.

The Tories are divided on this issue. Johnson seems to have elevated people who (although, like him, have no desire to marginalise anyone and are committed to equal rights for trans people) are openly (even if only occasionally) GC.

So Javid, Truss, Raab, Dowden, Badenoch, Maclean, Quince have all made statements against self-ID/gender neutralisation in public policy. But it takes time. The Lia Thomas scandal/Forstater case came together at a good time for Johnson to make his position clear.

And yes, they needed to undo the capture of the EHRC. Stonewall have also been cut down to size (more to do there).

I think freeing up the NHS will be the next big fight.

@Bancha

Would someone be able to explain to me, if the Tories are the only party to acknowledge biological reality, how is it that male prisoners can identify into female prison estates, and male patients have the opportunity to sexually assault female patients in hospital? Not at all trying to be goady. I care very deeply about this issue - came for the babies, stayed for the feminism.

I think because this current iteration of a Tory government having been doing the minimum expected of them to hold the line on future insanity re legislation. Which is still better than the other parties who are itching to go full SNP.

However they've been very slow to tackle much of the historical legislation and policy that's led to the things you mention. Some of which happened under previous Tory watch and some under the last Labour government.

The question really is will they, under the leadership of BJ, tackle it meaningfully or will they mostly use it to attack Labour as election fodder?

Whilst I welcome what Johnson said today, I will never vote conservative, I just can’t. However I also won’t vote for anyone who doesn’t know what a woman is, so I’ll spoil my ballot paper.

@OvaHere @tabbycatstripy thank you both

This thread has made it on to Guido…

order-order.com/2022/03/25/mumsnet-becomes-tory-turf/

Just maybe, if you're on the same side as Bozo and Putin, it might be worth reconsidering...

@HannibalHeyes

Just maybe, if you're on the same side as Bozo and Putin, it might be worth reconsidering...

Well, JKR has just criticised Putin in very strong terms, so all the blue-haired legions are going to have to be pro-Putin now.

Soz. I don't make the rules etc etc etc.

But Putin supports JKR...

@HannibalHeyes

But Putin supports JKR...

Putin was making a point about unthinking baying mobs being easily led into cancel culture. And whaddaya know...

He's an evil cunt but it's a beautiful bit of trolling.

@HannibalHeyes

Just maybe, if you're on the same side as Bozo and Putin, it might be worth reconsidering...

It's not being on the same side. Bozo and Putin don't promote women's rights, we do. But they happen to need a name for the female biological sex to keep it down, whereas we need to have that name to stop the female biological sex from being kept subjugated. We need the terminology to understand what is happening to women and girls in Afghanistan. Their plight has nothing to do with gender identity, and everything to do with sex-based oppression.

So no, the sides are, in fact, diametrically opposite. But it's a bit like two duelers planning to shoot each other both needing to have pistols. In other words, the same vocabulary is necessary.

If it makes you happy to think so

And of course, nice uncle Vlad means every word he says and it's in no way shape or form linked to JKR pledging £1 million of her own money to Ukraine...

Honestly, it's depressing to see how little actual thinking the wokey mob do. It's all just reflex and fucking mantras.

@HannibalHeyes

Just maybe, if you're on the same side as Bozo and Putin, it might be worth reconsidering...

What is your stance?

The opposite to JKR?

TWAW - Biological sex can change etc…

@teawamutu

And of course, nice uncle Vlad means every word he says and it's in no way shape or form linked to JKR pledging £1 million of her own money to Ukraine...

Honestly, it's depressing to see how little actual thinking the wokey mob do. It's all just reflex and fucking mantras.

It is not just them though certainly very clear in that context.

Much of political Twitter, in general, makes for depressing reading where tribal membership is more important than discussing issues and #nodebate is not seen as at all wrong.

This is the same Boris Johnson who said no rules had been broken over No.10 parties during lockdown, right?

@HannibalHeyes

Just maybe, if you're on the same side as Bozo and Putin, it might be worth reconsidering...

I keep seeing variations on this brainless comment being posted, and it bugs me that anyone can seriously consider it a debating point.

My politics are very different from Putin's and Johnson's. But like me, they recognise that humans cannot change sex. I'm sure they also agree with most of us here that the Earth orbits the sun, and the Moon landings weren't faked in a Hollywood studio.

@FemaleAndLearning

I've never voted Conservative but will at the next election to prevent Labour from getting into number 10 though I am in a fairly sage Labour seat. Hopefully Labour can use the next term if office to realise they need the votes of half the population. Starmer is a coward and thinks we are thick (think back to his statement about preserving women's space but TWAW).

Because in a lot of ways this is an emergent issue, and the PM and MPs are often not the ones directly making the decisions in these institutions.

As for the former, we know that all the parties initially seemed to be bamboozled by the whole gender movement and seemed to think it was good and benign. It's dawned on them at the same pace it's dawned on a lot of people that there is far more going on and more serious implications than had been realized by many.

The latter, activists were very careful in trying not to make waves and capture institutions. Look at all the government organizations that were paying for the Stonewall protection scheme - everyone thought they were a great organization, no one would have questioned it - if they had, five years ago, what would have been the public response? But these organizations have quietly been spreading their views to the people who make the decisions at the organizational level.

@Talipesmum

Got to say, though I also think this is true, it is not at all helpful to have boris saying it too cos (a) him saying something has no bearing whatsoever on whether he actually believes it or not, and (2) is he saying this cos he’s hideously conservative and wants women to stay in their place, as opposed to thinking women can and should do or think whatever they like, with their only thing in common their biology?

BJ isn't hideously conservative. In political/economic terms he is a bit on the right, but mostly an economic liberal. He's also not especially socially conservative.

What makes you think he wants women to stay in their place? I've never seen anything that suggests that. He clearly quite likes women as sexual partners but that doesn't mean he thinks they should be barefoot in the kitchen.

@Greencoatblue

Of course Boris knows what a woman is, he's had enough of them!

😂😂

@HannibalHeyes

If it makes you happy to think so

Oh? How much money has he donated to the current appeal to help children in Ukrainian orphanages run by, er, Lumos, JK Rowling's children's charity?

How often has he expressed support for gay rights? As in gay men and lesbians? How often has he spoken against domestic violence, and donated to charities that support single mothers?

While you're pondering that, I have the deeds to London Bridge to sell you for the knock-down price of £499,999. All proceeds go to charity!

I mean it's a crazy comparison. JKR is a nice lefty Scottish writer who likes to do charitable works and happens to have one opinion on a point that has really divided a lot of people in society.

VP is a totalitarian dictator ex-KGB murderer whose opinions are hard to pin down in a lot of ways but generally are not what you'd call open-minded.

Murderer, children's writer. Same same?

I think this is such a fundamental issue for our species. It doesn't surmounts politics. What is more important than that the human race is divided principally and fundamentally into men and women and that this difference is dictated by biology.

Your mind and your body develop together and their development is intrinsically, irrevocably linked. It is impossible to be born in the wrong body unless you believe that actually we all start as disembodied brains in vats which are then placed into separately grown bodies. That is the only way such an error could occur.

How your feelings about yourself develop throughout your life are dependent upon the social influences your brain and your body come into contact with. Again, this is something both are subject to and both are influenced by. I would like a neurologist to explain how these could have divergent influences upon an individual.

It surmounts mere politics. (obvs )