Texas to prosecute trans medical procedures on children as child abuse

[MalagaNights]

twitter.com/JazzShaw/status/1496853923596017673?t=yMNjFBydPEp-oFBQUrUU3w&s=19

@DomesticatedZombie but the state government is NOT. Hard to reconcile those, but I couldn’t bring myself to move to even a liberal progressive section. The covid rules, the urban environments built for cars not people (not Texas specific to be fair), not to mention people freezing to death over winter with their electricity problems, you don’t even have to get to their human rights approach (the abortion law is extremely anti women and does nothing to protect children)

“Eightiesfan

Not sure about America but here children do not get gender reassignment surgery. They are referred to a clinic like the Tavistock and they have counselling. They are expected to live as a girl/boy for at least 2 years they are permitted to be given hormones but that is it. Surgery is not permitted until they are adults.

The only time surgery is permitted is in incredibly rare situations when the baby is identified as intersex, and has both X and Y chromosomes and sometimes their genitals cannot be confirmed as being either fully make or fully female. If this was your child would you want some bible bashing politically motivated group telling you your child cannot have surgery?“

Until the recent Keira Bell court case which ruled children couldn’t give informed consent, The Tavistock was putting children on puberty blockers without apparently much in depth counselling.The decision of that court case was then over turned on the grounds children can make their own decisions because of Gillick competency, so it will probably start up again. In Scotland quite a few children have had mastectomies.

As for DSD conditions, these are purely medical and have nothing whatsoever to do with having a trans gender identity. Nothing.

While I think this is undeniably the right thing to do, I'm another person who's... conflicted that it's the Texas Government doing it. As Timeisnotaline said, their abortion law is extremely anti women and they appear to be the kind of right-wing fundamentalists GC feminists are accused of being in bed with. I'd probably be even more disturbed if I was living in the US, because I can see it's going to be another weapon in the culture war and harden the line between "red" and "blue" states. Both are pushing policies that are terrible for women in completely different ways.

A digression: most of the people pushing the "Trans kids will DIE if they don't get gender-affirming care!" line are adults. Since the whole "gender-affirming care" thing is an extremely recently development, most of them, like me, grew up in a time when no child or adolescent received it. And yet I can't recall any of my peers committing suicide, which is the threat that the "advocates" for "transkids" hold over us. Some of us had mental or emotional problems which we dealt with in various dysfunctional ways, but "gender" wasn't even a blip on our horizon. My experience tells me that "gender identity" is neither innate, universal nor overwhelming as we're being told, and I suspect that is true for a lot of us.

@Whitefire

Yes, Americans can move freely between states. To become a resident of a state one simply moves there. To establish domicile one starts paying state taxes, gets a state driver's license ( or state ID if a non-driver) registers to vote if desired, registers a car, etc. One can own real estate anywhere, but the state one spends the most time in is one's domicile. I've lived in 13 states, but been domiciled in only 10 of them.

@timeisnotaline I agree. The problem is it is Texas. Home of the right wing and Anti-Abortion laws. The intention behind the legislation is perhaps more about discrimination and prejudice against those who don't conform, 'saving the sinners' rather than actually protecting children.

Will this be retroactive as well? So a parent who did what the medical bodies etc were recommending can be prosecuted? And this is supposedly in the interests of often very vulnerable children? To have caused, albeit indirectly and with no intention, their parent to be prosecuted and separated from them.*

Is it just for extreme cases like Jazz J.?

*I disagree with hormonal and definitely surgical treatments in children, I believe that therapy should be exploratory, not affirmative etc but I believe this should be enforced by the state and medical guidelines, not to go after often desperate parents with vulnerable children who were sold a lie and were unable to see through ot.

I think it says everything about the state of women's rights today when people go nuts over this on twitter, but are silent on the (basically) total abortion ban.

Again, men's rights get people stirred up more than issues affecting females.

There was lots about the Texas abortion ban. There will be much much more in about June when Roe v Wade is probably gutted .

"it's a shame it's the right wing talking about this."

Why? Don't you want everyone to protect children?

Shouldn't it be: "it's a shame the left wing aren't talking about it."??

Child protection should be everyone's business.

Many in Texas will see this as consistent with their abortion stance. They prioritise children not the ideologies of adults.

In their view this includes unborn children.

This clashes with women's rights. Just as their trans kids position is seen as clashing with trans rights. They're roundly attacked by leftists on social media for both. But persist anyway as they believe it's right.

I'd hope that if nothing else this would help people move away from tribalist thinking.

You can agree with them on trans kids, and disagree on abortion, without having to describe them as women hating or trans hating.

Thank you @MalagaNights. Excellent post. Completely agree. Glad I refreshed before attempting to write an inferior version!

The intention behind the legislation is perhaps more about discrimination and prejudice against those who don't conform, 'saving the sinners' rather than actually protecting children
We will find out I guess. It would be amazing to see money invested into mental.health care. Hopefully if this happens the affirmation only aspect will be removed from the therapy giving thentherapists the chance to actually get to the root of the problems rather than transition being the cure all.

I notice Florida are being reported as passing a law keeping LBGTQ out of primary schools. Only saw it on the BBC news site so a partisan report.

@Lovelyricepudding

I notice Florida are being reported as passing a law keeping LBGTQ out of primary schools. Only saw it on the BBC news site so a partisan report.

That's surprised me friends daughter was stuck in Miami for 18 months partly covid partly dying relative they were a bit askance at their anything goes attitude

It's fascinating that on the one hand you have activists scolding feminists for hysteria because "no one is performing surgery on children" and then completely throw their toys out of the cot and shout that it's genocide when it's made illegal to do the thing they insist isn't happening.

I read the heading as Tesco! Need reading glasses.

Isn't there a saying about adversity and strange bedfellows?

It's fascinating that on the one hand you have activists scolding feminists for hysteria because "no one is performing surgery on children" and then completely throw their toys out of the cot and shout that it's genocide when it's made illegal to do the thing they insist isn't happening.

When you dig through the first layer of hysteria, they'll say the puberty blockers they're upset about. Trans Kids(TM) need puberty blockers.

For example, this, under a tweet by Chase Strangio about the Texas thing - it was the most thoughtful TRA-side in the replies. (Most of it was total zero-brains stuff like "This is so fucked. I'm so fucking scared.")

Strangio: This is an absolute nightmare. But supporting your kid is NOT child abuse and families will be protected and defended as best we can and if we need to help you get out of Texas we will do that too. I am sorry this is the horrible world we live in.

A: I'm sure twitter won't be shy to correct me if I'm wrong, but in CA my child couldn't "officially" transition until they turned 18. Are folks advocating for medical transition before that age?

B: Not necessarily, but here’s the article from the attorney general’s website. He’s saying that even the use of PUBERTY BLOCKERS is considered abuse 🤦

A: So. Damned. Dumb.

I actually don't have any idea about the Texas thing - the law is a blunt instrument, but this is an emergency. One thing's for certain - you can't trust most of the media to report and distinguish between bad law and good law in this area...

This is being framed as a "genocide" by twitter TRAs, even going so far as for many of them to say "Why is everyone talking about the situation in Ukraine but not about the genocide of trans kids in Texas." Honestly sickening.

@ScreamingMeMe

This is being framed as a "genocide" by twitter TRAs, even going so far as for many of them to say "Why is everyone talking about the situation in Ukraine but not about the genocide of trans kids in Texas." Honestly sickening.

I know its disgusting. And it's not going to actually help gender questioning kids, it is going to terrify them.

What these adults don't seem to understand is that this is children we are talking about here. Children who are looking to the adults around them for guidance, boundaries, security - who can tell them what's best. Who cannot fully understand medicine and surgery and laws and what any of it means.

And what they are getting from these adults is 'oh my god we told you you could change sex, and all you had to do was go to the doc and they would give you some shots, a few pills, some implants, a little bit of major surgery here and then you would be happy forever, but now we are not allowed to do that because everyone hates you and that is going to make you so unhappy that you are going to want to kill yourself along with all the other kids who are trans'. It's fucked up, these people appear to know nothing about child development, cognitive understanding.

Poor Jazz Jennings - Jazz's parents told them that going to the doctors and doing everything the doctor says and accepting everything the doctor did would be the path for happiness. And now that is clearly not the case, you can see in the latest episodes that Jazz's parents are getting increasingly exasperated with the fact that Jazz isn't turning out the be the 'completely fulfilled, well adjusted and full of happiness' poster child that they were promised. Meanwhile Jazz, who clearly still has cognitive development issues and lacks maturity, just mostly appears confused that this ultimate happiness just isn't materialising for them.

And apart from anything else, again the huge 'trans kids' paradox comes into sharp relief: Being trans is not a mental illness, how dare you suggest such a thing, its just like being gay you know. However, if you do not allow us to inject our children with drugs to halt the growth their perfectly normally developing bodies, or allow us to cut off their healthy body parts, then they are going to kill themselves and this will be a genocide and their blood will be on your hands.

Completely agree, Hh, great post.

Wonderful post Hasselhoffsheadband

The cynical weaponising of vulnerable children by this adult male led ideology is completely unforgivable.

I'm actually surprised to see the majority of people cheering this law, which I think is terrible and belongs in a dustbin alongside the new Florida law that allow teachers to be sued for discussing homosexuality at primary school.

The purpose of this law is absolutely not to take a step back and consider whether any "gender affirmation" healthcare is in the best interests of children. It is a law developed by anti- LGBT evangelicals and the purpose is to stoke a cultural war that has been brewing in the US for decades. It is another side of the coin of the law effectively banning abortion in Texas.

Both not surprisingly have a 'tell on your neighbour' component where members of the public are encouraged to report to the law that someone had an abortion or teenager appears to be transitioning.

How do you think the latter will work? Do you think that it's obvious when a child is receiving gender-related medical care? I think in many cases no, so this is going to be used to harass and intimidate children who appear to be trans or gender non-conforming in conservative districts. Boy wearing a dress? Call the cops. Girl cutting her hair very short and wearing overalls? Call the cops.

And we are talking about some of the most conservative areas in one of the most conservative states in the US, so this isn't the Hampshire police ringing to ask if you'll come in for a chat. It would be a Trump-voting cop showing up at your door with a gun to say that someone reported your 13-year-old for looking weird. I have lived in the United States and spent a lot of time in Texas, and don't think I'm exaggerating at all about what the logical fallout of this decision will be.

This is a law by people who are no friend to women, no friend to feminists, no friend to equality or gay rights or womens' rights, and I find no reason to support it at all.

Your post implies there's a new law in Texas exceptmeandmymonkey.

If that's what you're saying then you haven't been reading about what's happening and you don't understand it.

What's happening in Texas is about existing laws.

Surely that's splitting hairs--whether it's a new law or increased enforcement of existing laws, bottom line is that I agree that unfortunately it's probably not about "let's find a better way to support gender-nonconforming kids (that incidentally doesn't lead to stupid and unnecessary medical treatments)" but rather about stoking the culture war and shoring up enforcement of Christan right "morals." Which probably won't include being supportive of gay people.

I hope the outcome of this will be positive and I'm thrilled if money-grubbing doctors and pharmaceutical companies are prevented from pushing their "treatments" onto vulnerable families. But I fear it will just Stoke further division in the end, and any (slightly more) liberal successor in state government won't be able to take any sort of sensible middle ground position, but will have to swing all the way to the opposite side.

If someone is trying to convince me of their arguments, that's not going to work if their facts are invented.

One of the mothers is using this as a way to campaign for a government seat. Sit down and be in a calm place before reading this:
mobile.twitter.com/mrsbriggle/status/1384213478110425093

I don't know whether to pity her or assume she's got some kind of Munchausen by Proxy thing going on.

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20220226043546/www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/02/25/texas-mother-trans-son-health-care-not-child-abuse/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20220226043546/www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/02/25/texas-mother-trans-son-health-care-not-child-abuse/