What can I do about gender neutral toilets in college?

[mightbeasillyquestion]

First off, sorry if this has already been asked but most searches seem to be about workplaces or secondary schools and I'm not sure if the legislation is the same, apologies if it is. I am in Wales if that makes it any different. I am attending an FE college and there are no single-sex bathrooms available at all. There is some downstairs where one side is male and one female but the washing area is still communal, all the others are completely mixed. Firstly, I am confused as to whether this is actually legal as most google searches seem to lead to information about secondary schools. If it is illegal then what can I actually do about it, if anything at all? I have spoken to other girls and women there and they also feel uncomfortable with this. The toilets are the kind where the cubicle door touches the floor but the washing area is communal, I am confused as to whether you just need the enclosed room or if you need the sink in there as well.

44 percent of lesbians and 61 percent of bisexual women experience rape, physical violence, or stalking by an intimate partner, compared to 35 percent of straight women
26 percent of gay men and 37 percent of bisexual men experience rape, physical violence, or stalking by an intimate partner, compared to 29 percent of straight men.

Now my arithmetic is not very good but how do the above statistics show that women don't suffer as much abuse as male LGBT people?

Sorry forgot to highlight quote.

1 in 5 women have experienced sexual assault or violence (source: Rape Crisis)

I'd like to see where that figure comes from. I've seen figures that 1 in 5 women have experienced rape, more have experienced other types of sexual assault that are easier to get away with in public.

@onelittlefrog it's completely fair enough that you are fine with using shared facilities. Lots of people are. It's one of the reasons lots of younger women are so supportive of trans/nb people sharing their spaces - they honestly are not bothered.

And some of that nonchalance is because they haven't experienced the behaviours that prompted women in the generations that went before them to fight for single sex spaces. They have no idea what their grandmothers put up with. So obviously they don't think it is a big deal!

@Ereshkigalangcleg

1 in 5 women have experienced sexual assault or violence (source: Rape Crisis)

I'd like to see where that figure comes from. I've seen figures that 1 in 5 women have experienced rape, more have experienced other types of sexual assault that are easier to get away with in public.

Yes, I have had private conversations with friends many times (especially when me too was a thing) and I would say almost all of us had experienced some form of sexual assault (so physical as opposed to just sexual harassment/catcalling). In many many cases what I think is termed "serious sexual assault" as well.

Ask where the accessible toilets are for female people who cannot enter mixed sex spaces.

Any suggestion on their part that you should disclose highly confidential, personal data in order to justify why you should have access would be against the Equality Act and highly inappropriate. There are 9 protected characteristics, not just one, and action should be proactive, not reactive after discrimination (against females who obviously will require toilet access but cannot access mixed sex provision) has happened.

If they do not have accessible toilets then is there anything in public signage or documentation that toilet facilities are intentionally not provided for x members of their population? What reasons do they give for this? What accommodations are made for said members who may need to go some way off site to find an accessible loo? And what address would they like the solicitor's letter to be sent to?

I wonder if we will ever find a solution.

Males need to be more welcoming to gender non-conforming males.

There are 600000 people in this country who have seizures. Being in the toilet is a common place to fall ill. Gaps under doors can save lives. However it is very likely girls and women would feel unsafe from men and phone cameras with a gap at the bottom of the door. Therefore single sex toilets are always the answer.

There are plenty of solutions. It's very easy indeed to have different provisions so that everyone has what they want.

The barrier, let's be honest, is male people refusing to accept or tolerate female people having any space they cannot enter at will and control access to. That's the issue. The absolute intolerance of female people being allowed to have need for spaces and resources of their own. Even after all possible TQ+ and male needs have been multiply provided for, they still will not tolerate a 'no'.

Which is where law comes in. People will not refrain from stealing your car or speeding by good chap/good will to all principles, therefore there are legal boundaries and penalties. There are female people who cannot access facilities unless they are single sex. Male people having tantrums about it is not a reason to exclude them.

@beastlyslumber I have a tutor who I could ask, thanks. A lot of my lecturers are supporters of trans ideology. The college have been giving out pronoun badges and some staff have been wearing these, I haven't seen the tutor wear one yet so hopefully she will be understanding of my concern. I already made a complaint a few months ago about sexual harassment, not in the toilets just in the college in general and it was taken pretty seriously. Although I'm not too sure on this issue as like I said the college seems to have fallen for transgender preachings. Hopefully they will take it as seriously.

@Blogblogblogblog I never thought of it in that way. That's a very good point you made though.

@maddy68 when I’m changing a tampon and get blood on my hands, I want to be able to wash the blood off in a sink without a man watching me. I don’t see what’s so difficult to understand about that.

Also to the person who said that some young women are accepting of transwomen in their spaces, are they really? I know of a few people who claim to believe TWAW at no cost but when it comes down to it they are not. One of my friends who is a staunch TWAW, lesbians can have penis and like penis, people are who they say they are, etc doesn't actually believe this. As in, I have asked her if she felt comfortable with the toilets, before knowing how extreme her views were, and she said no and that she avoids using them. I think a lot of women who say TWAW and let them into our spaces are saying it for brownie points and to look accepting, including the younger ones. I think there's very few who genuinely believe it and aren't just trying to be nice to them as a lot of women are taught. But women's safety should be above being nice. Sorry for the rant.

@jellyfrizz

I wonder if we will ever find a solution.

Males need to be more welcoming to gender non-conforming males.

@jellyfrizz you’re spot on. The transgender activists went in completely the wrong direction with their anger. They attack and invade women’s spaces, when what they should have been doing is challenging the toxic masculinity that refuses to recognise that some men may wish to wear a skirt and make up.

It was such a lost opportunity to challenge gender stereotypes. Instead they embraced them.

Are you having a bath in a college bathroom? Surely you're just washing your hands/face?

With regards to the college taking sexual assaults seriously, ask them to do a risk assessment about mixed sex toilets. Give them this information about schools (which was a few years old) which shows at least 1 rape a day inside school premises.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-36071502

Actually this one is better source. 600 rapes reported over 3 years inside school premises. With 190-195 days in school a year, that’s a lot.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-34138287

@Ereshkigalangcleg

1 in 5 women have experienced sexual assault or violence (source: Rape Crisis)

I'd like to see where that figure comes from. I've seen figures that 1 in 5 women have experienced rape, more have experienced other types of sexual assault that are easier to get away with in public.

Not to mention that the number who have been on the receiving end of sexual harassment in any form is as high as 97%.

@jellyfrizz

I wonder if we will ever find a solution.

Males need to be more welcoming to gender non-conforming males.

I'm still waiting for any evidence that there is hostility to non-conforming males using male toilets.

@wordsmeansomething

Are you having a bath in a college bathroom? Surely you're just washing your hands/face?

There is always one, isn't there?

It's such a shame that this is such a difficult conversation to have without people firing accusations at one another. I wonder if we will ever find a solution.

But it’s not difficult or complicated, Cookiemonster! Just put all toilets back the way they were. One set for men, the other for women.

Nobody complained about that, until a tiny number of trans activists wanted males to be allowed into women’s facilities. Now single-sex facilities have been removed without any consultation. I want them back.

@wordsmeansomething

Are you having a bath in a college bathroom? Surely you're just washing your hands/face?

What might they be washing off of their hands? How about blood from a period-related mishap? Just as stated a few posts above yours. Why wouldn't you want them to have privacy and dignity?

[quote mightbeasillyquestion]@beastlyslumber I have a tutor who I could ask, thanks. A lot of my lecturers are supporters of trans ideology. The college have been giving out pronoun badges and some staff have been wearing these, I haven't seen the tutor wear one yet so hopefully she will be understanding of my concern. I already made a complaint a few months ago about sexual harassment, not in the toilets just in the college in general and it was taken pretty seriously. Although I'm not too sure on this issue as like I said the college seems to have fallen for transgender preachings. Hopefully they will take it as seriously.

@Blogblogblogblog I never thought of it in that way. That's a very good point you made though.[/quote]
That sucks, sorry to hear that.

My advice would be to not frame it as a trans issue at all, but about access to education. Things the college will be concerned about is the retention and achievement of students, so if you can raise a question about students not coming to college because of the lack of facilities, that would be good. They will also care about equal opportunities for all students, so I would make a big deal about how this affects Muslim students. If you raise the trans issue you may well not get anywhere, so I would avoid framing it like that. You can explain that you have no objection to mixed sex toilets but by law they also have to provide single sex spaces.

If you feel up to it, I would also make the point that the person who sexually harrassed you will now be able to share a toilet space with you.

Sorry to hear your lecturers have fallen for this. I guess just keep looking for the ones who don't wear the pronoun badges!

@Ereshkigalangcleg

1 in 5 women have experienced sexual assault or violence (source: Rape Crisis)

I'd like to see where that figure comes from. I've seen figures that 1 in 5 women have experienced rape, more have experienced other types of sexual assault that are easier to get away with in public.

I was startled that Rape Crisis gave such a low figure, and I too would like to see the original document. I’d believe 1 in 5 women (at least) have been raped and/ or assaulted. As others have pointed out, most women have experienced sexual harassment.

There was never any need to remove single-sex facilities. Just add a third space for those who don’t want to use their own.

@Masdintle

Mixed sex and unisex are different things though. Unisex is, I believe, completely self contained facilities to be used by one person at a time with a lockable door, whereas mixed sex means several people can use the facilities at one time - perhaps separate cubicles (of course) but communal sinks.

Nope, I've seen cubicle style womens changed into gender neutral by way of a sign. That makes them mixed sex but some people use weasley words like gender neutral to hide the nature of the change. Plus I've yet to see the mens which is better set up for mixed sex to be renamed. Only ever the womens, up to now anyway.