Cheryle: Karen White prison sexual assault

[pombear]

I don't think this has been posted yet, but will delete if iI'm duplicating.

Cheryle has waived her anonymity to talk about the sexual assault she experienced in prison by Karen White. I'm sorry this happened to you Cheryle.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10406351/I-sexually-assaulted-transgender-rapist-womens-jail.html

A female prisoner has described her ordeal at the hands of a transgender woman who sexually molested inmates at a women's jail during a three-month reign of terror.

Waiving her anonymity in an interview with The Mail on Sunday, Cheryle Kempton is the first victim to speak out in the hope that it prevents other women facing a similar fate.

'We felt they had protected Karen over us,' said Cheryle. 'All women in prison are vulnerable.'

The only thing I hated was the use of female pronouns for the rapist. I'm fucking angry that Cheryle is still having to pander to men's rights while describing sexual grooming and violent assault.

Bear in mind that if she'd "misgendered" White in prison, she'd probably have been disciplined. Those are the rules.

And Cheryle, if you're reading: thank you. You've done a brave thing.

for Cheryle. I hope you are getting the support you need.

Not to derail, but is Amy J still considering a civil suit against the MoJ and Sodexo for her assault by a male who was placed in her prison. As per the outcome of her JR?

Bloody good job too.

@DryHeave

TRAs seem to be very quiet on this, only a few on Maya’s Twitter thread.

really gosh I wonder why.

In all honesty, if you support transwomen being housed in women's prisons, and self ID, then you support Karen White. There is no way round it.

Thank you Cheryle for being so brave and speaking out. Sending you love and strength.

Under the current MoJ policies KW has been, and continues to be, held in a man's prison. But we are in contact with women in prison and with female former offenders who have experienced similar incidents from similar prisoners under the current policies.

I know the MoJ claims that there have been no recorded incidents of assault or sexual assault committed by prisoners of the male sex in the female estate. Key word: RECORDED. Key fact: I know women who beg to differ...

France has a trans prisoner wing in a male prison. Sounds like a good compromise to me.

@KeepPrisonsSingleSex

Thank you Cheryle for being so brave and speaking out. Sending you love and strength.

Under the current MoJ policies KW has been, and continues to be, held in a man's prison. But we are in contact with women in prison and with female former offenders who have experienced similar incidents from similar prisoners under the current policies.

I know the MoJ claims that there have been no recorded incidents of assault or sexual assault committed by prisoners of the male sex in the female estate. Key word: RECORDED. Key fact: I know women who beg to differ...

Sadly by this point, women know well how much trouble will be gone to in order to avoid anything making it into evidence that throws any barriers in the way of this male centric political lobby's best interests. As a result, no one can have the slightest faith in there being nothing officially 'on record'.

I'll repeat again: at least one woman who was a MNetter participated in a meeting with refuge managers and leaders where women tried to explain in detail why they needed access to single sex spaces and how the mixed sex provision really wasn't working for them. Many of those women were in tears by the end of the meeting and they were treated with disdain and derision by these people supposedly employed as the experts in protecting and supporting these women.

Directly after the meeting, one of those leaders went on record that no woman had ever voiced any concerns. Just bluntly lied that the meeting hadn't happened and those women didn't exist.

The behaviour of those in authority has been beyond shameful.

@TwentyFirstCenturyTricoteuse

France has a trans prisoner wing in a male prison. Sounds like a good compromise to me.

Sounds like THE ONLY option to me

@KeepPrisonsSingleSex

Thank you Cheryle for being so brave and speaking out. Sending you love and strength.

Under the current MoJ policies KW has been, and continues to be, held in a man's prison. But we are in contact with women in prison and with female former offenders who have experienced similar incidents from similar prisoners under the current policies.

I know the MoJ claims that there have been no recorded incidents of assault or sexual assault committed by prisoners of the male sex in the female estate. Key word: RECORDED. Key fact: I know women who beg to differ...

Are people born male with a GRC still counted as males?

@KeepPrisonsSingleSex

Thank you Cheryle for being so brave and speaking out. Sending you love and strength.

Under the current MoJ policies KW has been, and continues to be, held in a man's prison. But we are in contact with women in prison and with female former offenders who have experienced similar incidents from similar prisoners under the current policies.

I know the MoJ claims that there have been no recorded incidents of assault or sexual assault committed by prisoners of the male sex in the female estate. Key word: RECORDED. Key fact: I know women who beg to differ...

Gosh I wonder whether women who find themselves incarcerated have issues with reporting things to, and distrust of, people in authority? 🤔

I mean, and also that's a pretty fucking low bar anyway.

Sadly, we see posters claim that same statement made by Harwood on GB News today, there have been not recorded assaults since 2019. The new ‘safeguards’ are doing the job well, they say.

I thank you KPSS for the work you do. I am saddened greatly that it will take other traumatised women to lose their anonymity for people to take notice again.

Mind you the HoLs tactics of keeping the topic alive is getting noticed by a few new people every time. But it is not enough, of course.

So thank you.

The no reported assaults thing is ALSO whether deliberate or not, an up yours to women.

Because it's well known that across the board prison or not.

We often don't report for a variety of reasons.

I've realised recently another massive point. I mean I sort of half realised but it's really crystallised now.

Esp seen with gender > sex people. But tbh loads of things when it comes to men arguing for things they want or like or believe, which have women things they don't like.

*That statistics are vital when they support male position.

*However statistics are secondary to individual experiences when that is better for them.

*Or they present statistics that are totally unreliable, while rejecting undeniably robust stats about women.

*Or they blur the parameters of stats they like, and deliberately misrepresentat them often by omission.

*Redefining the group under consideration in order to vanish any unhelpful figures is done as well.

*Randomly raising reports etc from any other country they can find that supports their pov happens a lot.

And more I'm sure.

Examples

First insisting on term sex workers, not prostitutes. Sex workers is a v large range of people and what they do. Watering down stats about prostitution harm and risk.

Then insisting that as rape, sexual assault, coercion, trafficking etc are crimes. Anyone experiencing those things is not counted as a sex worker. They are victims of crime that's different. Thus sex work is 100% risk free.

Males in women's prisons. Current or ex inmates talking about experiences with male inmates in women's prisons are anecdotes.

Only stats matter. (Even though women often don't report, a lot of iffy behaviour is just shy of crime but has big impact. Ignores fear discomfort loss of privacy etc.). If GRC will be recorded as female. Not to say GRC holders doing whatever more, less, at all. I mean it's an issue for stats.

Meanwhile males talking about their experience must be listened to. Talk about double standards.

The other ubiquitous thing is to say look X attacks by males, hardly any compared to ones by women. Ignoring the fact very few males doing those attacks, compared to female population. Totally incorrect conclusion that less problem.

MVAWG. This is even bolder. The level of DV, and sex assaults across population against women. Are actually the same as female on male. Female on male just not reported/anyone told etc.

Anecdotes about lesbian women having same level and type of predatory sexual behaviour as males. Crass lesbophobia. And misogyny. Male centred approach that takes women who fancy women as exhibiting majority male sexuality therefore must behave like men.

It is absolutely shameful that this was allowed to happen, that Cheryle and her fellow inmates were put in this position.
It's even more shameful that they haven't done anything to put an immediate stop to this ever happening again.

That's what is so in your face fuck you about all this.

Males have been in women's prisons since at least early 80s turns out.

Even when trans morphed from transsexual to transgender it was never transparent. No hint to public. Loads in govt didn't have any knowledge happening. Etc.

No one asked women. Ever. Not ones in prison not any.

They should never have been there, should not be there. It's so obviously wrong. How many general public think ok? Fuck all. Not that anyone's allowed to ask obv.

Then KW. And who knows what in past. Other issues too.

The obvious immediate thing to do when became more known was to stop. Even before any issues that were widely reported.

Sorry KW just obviously stopped. THEN think what to do with proper assessment of options eg separate wing etc.

The fact males are still there. The repeated dismissal of the discomfort/fear experienced by women simply from males being in with them. The insistence that their risk assessments now will be brilliant. Full stop no other comment.

The judge saying legal males in women's prison. Stated clear risk of harm to women but. Numbers to date of crimes not very many in number. (!!!).

The man's got a life sentence, reflecting the seriousness of his crimes. Tbh I find it hard to be sympathetic about any bullying he might encounter in a male prison, and I realise that there are other men whose behaviour may be beyond my imagining, but I still don't sympathise with this man to the extent I think it's OK to him in with women (it's never OK to put male criminals in with women criminals).

You know prison could be the death of you, you know it'll be truly truly awful, you know it'll be dangerous and full of pain and terror. Don't wander round raping people.

quote from article

Cheryle's statements formed part of the Crown Prosecution Service's case against White, which saw her admit two sexual assaults on female prisoners at Leeds Crown Court in October 2018.

A judge, who described White as a 'predator', ordered the remaining two charges, including the assault on Cheryle, to lie on file. White was also convicted of raping another two women outside of jail, as well as wounding.

So, over the course of three months in 2017, KW is known to have committed at least four sexual assaults in one women's prison in England. It may very well be more. This was the impact of just one male prisoner in one prison.

I find this significant, and so should all of you, because we have the statistics for the total number of reported sexual assaults across all women's prisons in England and Wales in 2013.

It was four.

Four noted. Not necessarily four reported let alone four committed. Pah.

@RepentMotherfucker

That's a great article. 100% on the side of women.

Brave Cheryle. Well done to you 👏👏👏

No it wasn't.

Throughout the article the journalist referred to the rapist as "she" and allowed the poor woman being quoted to use "she" when what they should have been saying was "he".

"He" has a penis. He is a man.

Woman = Adult Human Female.

Man = Adult Human Male.

There are no other options.

Journalists are in a bit of a fix, though, atee. They are often required to use whatever pronouns the person chooses to use as their 'gender identity'. We regularly have reporters on here complaining that they are compelled to mis-sex people in articles.

@ArabellaScott

Journalists are in a bit of a fix, though, atee. They are often required to use whatever pronouns the person chooses to use as their 'gender identity'. We regularly have reporters on here complaining that they are compelled to mis-sex people in articles.

Oh poor them... They should just use the sex of the person they are referring to, and if the editor changes it they should write an article on that.

If they get fired this would be good, since then they are free to write what they like.

The perpetuation of this nonsense is bad for our society and culture. And actually devastating for the children who are being abused by "well meaning" people into mutilating and neutering themselves.

So these journos need to develop a spine and push back against the fascists who are promoting this thought police framework.

For all we know, in newsrooms up and down the country, editors are changing pronouns for their journalists.

Journalists can write what they like on their own laptop, but that doesn't mean anyone will print it.

Relevant thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4104200-Examining-trends-in-editorial-standards-in-coverage-of-transgender-issues

It's not just about editors, either, the IPSO guidelines have a lot to answer for.

I don't disagree about the pronouns. But I was responding to a PP who was saying the article was a kind of veiled attack on Cheryle. Which it clearly isn't.