Peter Tatchell says bisexuality will be the new normal for many

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

^In the future, as homophobia declines, most people will no longer define their sexuality so rigidly and exclusively. The boundaries between gay & straight are already blurring. Bisexuality will be the new normal for many.'

Really, Peter? I see this has attracted outrage from a number of gay men and lesbians already, and quite right too.

Denis Kavanagh on Twitter is on fiery form. twitter.com/Jebadoo2/status/1482103455460339713?s=20

As a straight woman, I look on at his weird shenanigans with incredulity. Does he have no judgement, no insight, no common sense? He was the best known gay rights campaigner in the country a few decades ago. What happened?

It's been something discussed for years and definitely been plenty feminist discussion.

Twitter is not the right place, his angle misses massive things to focus on his own angle, and his statement is lacking context, history, ... Well everything really!

It's a theoretical question. A tight experiment I think sometimes called. And it certainly prompts consideration and debate!

Question along lines of.

In a hypothetical future. Where hetero normativity did not exist in any way, and that was the norm and had been for so long no one had any concept of it.

Also there was no misogyny, racism, homophobia, classism, xenophobia or anything like that.

Where there were no hierarchies and no concept there even could be or ever were.

Where everyone is truly free, and truly equal. No poverty, no crimes of sexual violence, no coercion, no capitalist sex industry, no expectations around longevity of relationships/number of partners for anyone, whatever anyone wants to do. Monogamy 1 sexual partner life/loads of partners zero expectation judgement. Somehow children/risk of pregnancy all aok somehow...

In short. It's purely imaginary situation.

What would sexuality look like?

It's a fascinating question. Would some still enjoy a dominant role? Would people still have an interest in watching others have sex? Would sexual orientation be different size groups to now? Women being totally in control of when who how etc. What would that mean for Society?

When there's this type utopia presented. Invariably it's a male fantasy. The women are all young beautiful, skimpily dressed and high sexual appetite. Having sex (and when I've seen/read its usually with men involved!) all over the place group sex, approaching men with obvious intent and ripping own clothes off etc.

It's not about that stuff we know that obv! They never seem to get that in a situation where women had free choice.
That the result could just as likely be much less sex and group outdoor sex just. Hmm bit uncomfy cold. Sex with someone know better, know what I like. Sod that.

Yes it's v interesting.

PT just I mean whatever.

@Omicrone Yep, just like Kinsey was.

@Ionlydomassiveones

Not by me it isn’t! 100% straight. Wish I could be progressive and futuristic but it’s just not for me Pete sorry.

Yes, I'm straight, got off with a couple of girls when I was in my teens and twenties ( you know the normal experimenting) and often think now how much easier it would be to fancy a women as it seems we are so much more in tune with each other. The more I have delved in to this this whole thing, I have realised that men and women truly are different, (always confirmed when I see a lot of TW, still display obvious male traits), and a relationship with a women sounds like a much nicer option, but hey ho, whilst I can appreciate a lovely women, I'm still attracted to men. I'm in my 50's if that makes any difference...

I can’t understand why anyone is surprised by anything he writes now. Not since writing about ‘intergenerational sex’ with children having benefit (in historic times apparently) and that some children are not harmed by child sex abuse (when he dresses it up as ‘intergenerational sex’). That last was about some of his friends ‘having sex’ with men at aged 9 and 12 iirc.

And he recently said he was approached about a 15 yr old girl who told him how watching porn was good for her, because it taught her how to have sex. I think he said she told him that it taught them how to 'make him happy and he can make her happy'.

So he is all for minimising the harms of porn on children and ‘intergenerational sex’ on children (ie child sex abuse).

He has been campaigning for lowering the age of consent too I believe. From 16-14. I assume he is also going to ignore the predation on children in France by prominent French men that occurred when that happened in France. I mean, it is only recently some victims have spoken out. And looking at the positions of power the abusers are now in, it is not surprising just how long it has taken to expose and how few people have come forward.

But still. Peter Tatchell is in the media discussing sex education and lowering of the age of consent and lauded on his past activism. He keeps denying he minimises child sex abuse. But his comments stand, and his actions and comments around children watching porn and lowering the age of consent indicate his statements in the past were probably interpreted correctly despite his attempts to distance himself.

No, being bi is its own thing, we’re not an overflow category for people wanting to ‘blur boundaries’ or experiment.

Also, as has been said already, this guy has very dubious sexual preferences and weird ideas about capacity to consent, which he’s put in print several times. Don’t want to take relationship advice from someone who thinks that not all sex with children is ‘unwanted, abusive or harmful’.

Yes, wasn’t there a prominent French philosopher who was part of the movement to lower the age of consent ? And also seem to want to lower children’s sexual boundaries ?

Always interesting to see the similarities. I am not claiming Tatchell is a paedophile, but he surely does have some of the same patter as Foucault came out with around child sex abuse. Which will result in the same harms to children.

Pardon me if I don't take opinions from a former member of the Paedophile Information Exchange.

"Gender aristocrats" seems to hit the nail on the head. This all feels like a very establishment-driven enterprise, with no thought to how the actual population may think or feel about these ideas.

Who gives a shit what that paedo thinks?

No doubt Tatchell’s personal boundaries remain intact whilst at the same time expecting everyone else to blur their own.

@Omicrone

He's obsessed with other people's, especially young people's, sexuality and sexual experiences. He is such a creep.

And in plain sight too.

There's a big difference between saying that more people can "admit" to being bisexual in a society where it is seen as socially acceptable, and saying that more people actually "become" bisexual.

Saying that people can actually change their sexual orientation is obviously extremely homophobic.

@Signalbox

No doubt Tatchell’s personal boundaries remain intact whilst at the same time expecting everyone else to blur their own.

I reckon so...

@NotBadConsidering

”The boundaries…..are already blurring.”

Yes, Tatchell is all about blurring boundaries 🚩 🚩🚩

That's a good spot. Why is it that some people are so keen to blur boundaries, remove barriers?

That's a good spot. Why is it that some people are so keen to blur boundaries, remove barriers

Funny how it's claimed small children know their sexuality in.order to justify inappropriate teaching content but then their boundaries are all blurred and maybe they aren't gay/straight at all.

Which is it?

I think this is really interesting. Sexual expression really varies between cultures and it is quite possible that he will be proved right. But there are still lots of homophobic men (more than women IMO) in our society... I wonder if that will change.

Meh.

I was raised in a heavily hetero-normative world. I got "accused" of being gay for displaying "gender non-conforming" behaviour.
I pursued heterosexual relationships as:

1. I was genuinely attracted
2. it was the path of least resistance (and greater social acceptance)

Once I got over the fact that "lesbian" had been used against me as an insult in an attempt to control and define me, I started to accept I was also attracted to females. Very much so.

That's me. I'm bi.
Sometimes I like to fantasise that "everybody is gay until proven otherwise" (mostly to tease strongly heterosexual people), but deep inside I know sexual orientation is a scale, and you simply are what you are.
Whether you're free to express it or not is a different matter, and bi-erasure is real. But I don't believe the average number of bi people is likely to change overtime. The only thing that changes, is how visible we are (including to ourselves).
Some people will always be firmly and exclusively straight or gay. That does NOT make them bigots, and their boundaries must be respected.

That's me to a t Tabasco. I could appreciate a good looking guy . And I was fairly androgynous looking lad. Had a crush on a guy and we enjoyed kissing. But after that I couldn't make anything happen? Felt really silly but he was very understanding about it. Since he was really gorgeous that's that I guess - I'm just an old straight. Some lucky people are naturally bi sexual. Tatchell certainly isn't one of them.

No, being bi is its own thing, we’re not an overflow category for people wanting to ‘blur boundaries’ or experiment.

This. Peter Tatchell is not a useful authority on sexual behaviour.

That's a good spot. Why is it that some people are so keen to blur boundaries, remove barriers?

This video was in the replies to Tatchell, I hadn’t come across it before.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=n-NseFg2kno

When I tried to come out as bi as a teenager in the 80s I was told quite firmly by the l&g community that bisexuals didn't exist and I'd need to pick a side. I had solely same sex relationships for 10 years, but then when I started to see a man I was disowned by many of my lesbian friends. I do understand this to some degree but it was horrible to be on the receiving end of it.

'Homophobia' seems to have become 'being homosexual and saying no to hetero sex'. We live in odd times.

Tatchell, sadly, is a walking example of the distorted boundaries and perceptions that abused children can grow up with. I can see why he'd feel better if his personal perceptions were more usual, but I'd much prefer no other children were ever let down by responsible adults in the way he was.

I'm just not sure I agree. I'm straight and never dabbled and never wanted to. My lesbian friends have always been lesbians. I have a handful of friends who have declared they are bi and had very short lived lesbian relationships before reverting fully back to men. I know no bi men. Again exclusively straight or gay. The view that we're all bi doesn't chime at all with my experience of people.

I have a handful of friends who have declared they are bi and had very short lived lesbian relationships before reverting fully back to men.

Bisexuals are not welcome in the lesbian community though, or at least weren't when I had same sex relationships. People now mostly assume that I'm heterosexual because I have a child and my last relationship was with a man. I'd be open to a relationship with a woman, but then I feel as though I wouldn't fit well anywhere. Social pressure is a big thing.

@ViceLikeBlip

There's a big difference between saying that more people can "admit" to being bisexual in a society where it is seen as socially acceptable, and saying that more people actually "become" bisexual.

Saying that people can actually change their sexual orientation is obviously extremely homophobic.

This is one of the claims that come out of a certain type of activism, and while it seems to be true for some people, it doesn't seem to be true for others. It seems to be something that came to be accepted as 100% the case mainly because it seemed useful in terms of making comparisons between gay rights and the civil rights movement. But it ignored certain voices even within the lgb community who disagree, notably political lesbians, and it also ignores how homosexual activity has been known to occur in terms of cultural and historical distribution, or in unusual settings.

The idea that sexual orientation never changes for anyone and to disagree is homophobic is just a dogmatic statement, there's no logical necessary connection there.