Overwhelm from news relating to murder of women by men

[parentingperson]

It just never stops. There is always at least one story in the news where a man has taken a women's life. Sometimes he knows the woman, sometimes not.

Sometimes the woman is going about her day, at a bus stop a couple of minutes from home at 6pm.

Sometimes the men are in positions of power and use this to entice a woman into their car.

Sometimes they murder the whole family and friend that was staying over also involving rape of the two girls.

Sometimes the woman is found dead having been attacked and left in a bush and whilst there is some reports on it, the sad death barely makes a ripple.

These are all examples in recent months and it's becoming quite overwhelming in a way I haven't experienced before.

The leader of the conservative group on Plymouth City Council spoke on ITV about the need for people to modify their behaviour to stay safe. Fffs Bobbi-Ann McLeod was at a f*ing bus stop in a residential area. He came under fire for it and said obviously in an ideal world everyone would be safe to do as they pleased but that's not the current reality blah, blah. However his spin was clearly that we need to make the streets safer (police patrols, better lighting etc) but no mention made of challenging male behaviour and attitudes towards women to achieve that.

@SomepeopleareTERFSgetoverit

I feel the same. The news last night that the man who murdered the family and the visiting friend is now also charged with raping the little girls just felt like the final straw.

Has it got worse or are we just more aware?

We are more aware. Women are speaking up and it is getting more publicity. Not nearly enough though. It is a terrible sickness in our society.

@EsmaCannonball

I felt this yesterday when I was looking at the news: a 12 year old girl at a Christmas light switch-on stabbed to death by a gang of boys; a teenage girl getting the bus to meet friends killed by a man; a 65 year old woman found with extreme injuries in her own home and a male stranger arrested; a man charged with the cold-case murder of a young woman and rape of a teenage girl; the police referring themselves for investigation after mishandling the case of a young woman killed by her stalker; a woman missing and a man arrested on suspicion of murder.

I'm sure there were other stories I didn't see.

When Owen Jones and his ilk sneer at women's fears of male violence as 'moral panic,' this is what they are being smug about. They have no idea what it's like to negotiate the world as a woman, dealing with regular small, nasty incidents and knowing that any one of them could turn into that big incident where your worst fears do come true. They are so lucky they can laugh and patronise women about it.

I agree. I also remember that it made the the front of The Guardian several times when Wee Owen and his friends had a tiff with other men in front of a pub.

I agree

The sadness I felt for Ava White is quite overwhelming. She was 12!! That not one of the gang of boys said “come on, she’s a girl” or “stop it she’s just a kid” is heartbreaking.

And then compounded by reading that the girl who was murdered by her mums boyfriend had been raped.

They were children. I have a daughter that age. To think of the terror they must have felt is devastating.

@EsmaCannonball

I felt this yesterday when I was looking at the news: a 12 year old girl at a Christmas light switch-on stabbed to death by a gang of boys; a teenage girl getting the bus to meet friends killed by a man; a 65 year old woman found with extreme injuries in her own home and a male stranger arrested; a man charged with the cold-case murder of a young woman and rape of a teenage girl; the police referring themselves for investigation after mishandling the case of a young woman killed by her stalker; a woman missing and a man arrested on suspicion of murder.

I'm sure there were other stories I didn't see.

When Owen Jones and his ilk sneer at women's fears of male violence as 'moral panic,' this is what they are being smug about. They have no idea what it's like to negotiate the world as a woman, dealing with regular small, nasty incidents and knowing that any one of them could turn into that big incident where your worst fears do come true. They are so lucky they can laugh and patronise women about it.

Yes, I saw all those and also the case of a "vicar's daughter" who a 29 year old man was admitting to killing, but denying murdering. Was completely overwhelmed yesterday by the sheer viciousness of men towards women and girls. Imagine if we treated them the way they treat us.

Sumpathy OP.

I think once you recognise this, it's impossible Not to see. It's utterly horrendous.

I follow someone on Twitter who has also been researching deaths of women who were in abusive relationships inc death by suicide. Prof Jane Monckton Smith. She posted on 25.11.21"

"My estimation for traumatic deaths of women related to male violence and domestic abuse is about 15 per week. We simply don’t know the full scale of this problem because we aren’t identifying or recording all the deaths. #16DaysofActivism"

twitter.com/JMoncktonSmith/status/1463813323439357956?t=2xrBl621DqORLzP5IxzH1g&s=19

The more open-minded among you might find this interesting: Figure 3: The number of male homicide victims has increased in the latest year while the number of female victims has decreased.

At 12, an exchange with a bunch of lads would've been name calling. Bitch, slag, dickhead, wanker etc. Then you walked away. My only physical fights were with other girls.

It depends where you are. Around that age, the girls with whom I'd been classmates at junior school were trying to set me up for a punishment gang rape (I'd won a scholarship to an out of area school). At an earlier age, I'd been beaten badly by a gang boys from my school who fractured my skull and ribs (I'd intervened to stop them beating up a very young child).

I know men are victims of male violence too - I have a son and I worry about him constantly. I really hope the day will come when decent men decide they've had enough. I'd love to hear them arguing about it work, on the bus in the pub, on chat forums. But it's a conversation only they can start. Until they do, women need to focus on the best ways of staying safe, thank you.

@LarryTheLurker

The more open-minded among you might find this interesting: Figure 3: The number of male homicide victims has increased in the latest year while the number of female victims has decreased.

Start your own thread, please.

This thread is about female victims of male violence.

@LarryTheLurker

The more open-minded among you might find this interesting: Figure 3: The number of male homicide victims has increased in the latest year while the number of female victims has decreased.

* * The number of female victims in the last year (188) has returned to the levels seen between year ending March 2012 and year ending March 2017, following the two previous years when the number of these victims were higher. The latest figure is similar to the average of the previous 10 years (189 female victims per year).

So what you're saying is that the last year is broadly on average the same as the last 10 years?

I don't really see your point. Perhaps that doesn't make me the open minded amongst us that you intended this data for and would be interested in your insight / perspective that I seem to be missing?

In regard to the quote and link posted by a pp, they refer to the year ending in March 2020. Just saving you the click, anyone else who thought the decrease in female victims didn’t sound right.

Start your own thread, please.
Better still, Larry, start a thread on a men's forum.

"An est. 74,808 women (E&W) attempted suicide due to #DomesticAbuse by a partner in the last year.

How many attempted due to domestic abuse in their lifetime?

How many women are no longer here, having suicided because of male violence?

Truth is, we just don't know."

twitter.com/we_are_nina/status/1354746041480990720?t=d6lVSNIyG1i5lnYFkQqcKA&s=19

Not RTFT

I wish I knew whether this is because it's being reported more because of couzens or its worse.

I would hope it's being reported more rather than happening more.

Given so many are strangers/ extreme I feel like it's more frequent which is just horrific.

@LarryTheLurker

The more open-minded among you might find this interesting: Figure 3: The number of male homicide victims has increased in the latest year while the number of female victims has decreased.

The source of these figures is the Home Office Homicide Index.The guidance to these figures clearly states that the police record suspects' genders and not their biological sex.

The guidance explains:

"The Homicide Index form is returned to the Home Office PDCS and loaded onto the Homicide Index. When a suspect is charged with a homicide, the police update the form with suspect information (for example, age, gender and ethnicity), and when the case has been through the courts, it is updated with case outcome information (for example, indictment, court outcome, date of conviction and sentence length)."

Obviously, since the police and Home Office record suspects as male or female on the basis of their stated gender identity, they're not going to treat dead victims less "inclusively" if that person has a male legal name and male-appearing gender presentation.

The Home Office policy of recording gender instead of sex is well-covered in the press and on government and police websites, and we all know that "female" in Home Office statistics (including for crime and prisons) doesn't mean "biologically female" anymore.

If the number of male victims has increased, I wonder how many of those are transmen. Biologically female homicide victims being recorded as male would explain why both the number of females has decreased and the number of males has increased.

Of course, we will never know the truth as the crime stats are forever corrupted now.

I have no basis on which to question figures about men being victims of male violence - I just don't see quite what women are expected to do about it.
Now if only posters like Larry could get men discussing it even half as animatedly as they talk about sport or Brexit then who knows where it might lead.

As a reminder of the Observer's series on femicide earlier this year and what it told us about what we didn't know about the recording of the homicide of women:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4185454-Observer-campaign-to-tackle-femicide

I cannot understand the mindset of those who feel compelled to WATM on threads about individual women and girls who have been killed in situations so shocking they are national front page news.

And moreover it's in the news NOW. complete with their names, photos. Members of public where they lived talking of shock and grief.
With the twelve year old victim, police comment on news, the officer was almost in tears.

It's always bad.

But doing it on this thread is obscene and totally disrespectful to the victims, their relatives and all those who knew them.
Who are likely not even grieving yet, still trying to process sudden death, murder. In ways that included abduction. Sexual violence. They'll be thinking of their terror. Trying not to think about how violated and for how long. Just unimaginable to those who haven't lost someone this way.

And it's disrespectful to the OP who started the thread not even to talk generally about sex offences, killings, male violence.

But because she was having trouble dealing with so many incidents in such a tiny space of time.

As I'm sure plenty of men and women are across the country.

She wanted to talk, that helps when you feel overwhelmed.

One person felt compelled to point out that men are statistically more at risk of being murdered.

And that it's men who are the issue, the perpetrators.

And urged others to focus on men who commit violent crime.

Essentially to focus on female victims and not male is not right.

On THIS thread about specific women and girls in the news right now. OP wanted to talk, to help process it all.

That response essentially says that this thread should not exist. Women should not discuss these horrific, current crimes.

CheeseMmmm I hear you

The other was more straightforward.

The OP wanting to talk about these crimes as it's just too much in such a short time. And other women who do.

And this poster would have seen title and thought. Yep that sounds like something I might well be interested in.

This is the title:

'Overwhelm from news relating to murder of women by men'

So read title.
Thought this sounds like a thread for me.

And opened their thoughts with-

'The more open-minded among you might find this interesting: Figure 3: The number of male homicide victims has increased in the latest year while the number of female victims has decreased.'

I know what fun upsetting/ pissing women off of is. Esp ones posting in feminism topic.

This massively crosses the line though.

Given the prominence of these murders, in the front page news, about these individual women and girls. Named, photos, upset expressed by police, locals, loved ones, so many.

I cannot conceive what kind of person would think bloody hell they're closed minded. Better tell them. And suggest they go off and look at some data and discuss that instead.

Off the scale shitty.

I feel like this OP. In fact after reading about the awful rape and murder of that poor little girl I did some research trying to work out if, as a society, we are getting sicker. I wanted to know if homicide rates of women over the years had increased but what I found was a list of unsolved murders since 1970 of which there are hundreds.

The vast majority are women, who have either been burned in their own homes, often along with their kids, or tortured murdered and dumped on waste ground.

The way their bodies were discarded proves how little empathy men have for women. They don’t even seem to be ashamed of leaving the body in plain sight where kids will find them. Just discarded like rubbish. It’s so sad.

I just can’t process it, and still there is a debate about whether it not femicide should be given the same status as a hate crime. The way I understand it is if a trans woman is murdered because they are trans, then the case will get more serious treatment and the prosecution can ask for a more severe prison sentence than if it were a woman murdered because she is a woman.

I can’t get my head around it.

CheeseMmmm yes. Off the scale. Who gives a f*ck about crimes against women when we could talk about crimes against men. The arrogance, the entitlement, the misogyny necessary to come onto this thread and post that...