Stella Creasey forbidden from bringing her baby to Parliament

[ArabellaScott]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-59396801

'"I've had a baby, I haven't given up my brain or capacity to do things and our politics and our policy making will be better by having more mums at the table," she added.'

Interesting to think how politics and daily life might be changed were it to be more mother (and child) friendly.

Bit aggressive, there, @Warmduscher

“Do you seriously not understand the difference between a breastfed 3-month-old and a teenager?”

Of course I do. But as soon as a line is drawn, someone will want to step over it. We see this all the time in questions about “when does my son have to go into the male changing” in sports centres - even if there is a rule that says children must go into the adult changing appropriate to their sex at 8, there are often posters on here explaining why their child needs to be an exception.

Yes, I do understand that the House of Commons is not a municipal swimming pool, before you ask.

@Ginger1982

I think it's bonkers that there isn't some system to allow MPs to vote remotely. I remember Michael Heseltine being wheeled in in a hospital bed to vote after he had a heart attack and that must be more than 25 years ago.

There is now. It’s the reason Geoffrey Cox was able to “work” from the Caribbean.

MPs get six months paid maternity leave.
MPs can vote by proxy whilst on mat leave.
MPs can take their babies into the building, just not the chamber itself.
There is an on-site nursery.

I don’t understand. It seems much more new-mum friendly than anywhere I’ve ever worked??

Imagine the outrage there would be on here if someone like say Jacob Rees- Mogg had complimented Creasey on her "well-behaved baby"

Not all jobs are suitable for being done with a small baby in attendance. If the baby is there, attention is being focused on the baby- not the job in hand.

@Somebodylikeyew

MPs get six months paid maternity leave. MPs can vote by proxy whilst on mat leave. MPs can take their babies into the building, just not the chamber itself. There is an on-site nursery.

I don’t understand. It seems much more new-mum friendly than anywhere I’ve ever worked??

It is. It's manufactured outrage by Creasey and some posters on here; particularly the apologists for the crass , on several levels,"well-behaved baby" comment by Creasey.

I'm confused now.
If she gets maternity leave or can vote remotely or by proxy what is the point she is trying to make?
If it's just she wanted to take her baby to work then it is in appropriate for a mother or a father in most workplaces, including this one!

*inappropriate

I really wished she hadst done that tbh. She has done women no favours. It was publicity stunt.

@KimikosNightmare

Imagine the outrage there would be on here if someone like say Jacob Rees- Mogg had complimented Creasey on her "well-behaved baby"

Not all jobs are suitable for being done with a small baby in attendance. If the baby is there, attention is being focused on the baby- not the job in hand.

I just don't see the issue with this phrasing. In the context she used it, it's obviously not some sort of mral judgement.

I have had babies that were well-behaved and quiet who I could take anywhere and breastfeed with no problem. I've had babies where I wouldn't even try. I didn't sit home with the former just because some babies aren't as easy to take places.

As they get older most infants are more difficult to contain anyway, so the window for taking any baby to quiet places tends to be short. Luckily they can often wait to see mum longer by that time, too.

Its interesting as my friend went to view a private school. Its a very hippy school. The head teacher shown them around whilst breastfeeding. My friend loved it - I would have been

@SomepeopleareTERFSgetoverit

Bit aggressive, there, *@Warmduscher*

“Do you seriously not understand the difference between a breastfed 3-month-old and a teenager?”

Of course I do. But as soon as a line is drawn, someone will want to step over it. We see this all the time in questions about “when does my son have to go into the male changing” in sports centres - even if there is a rule that says children must go into the adult changing appropriate to their sex at 8, there are often posters on here explaining why their child needs to be an exception.

Yes, I do understand that the House of Commons is not a municipal swimming pool, before you ask.

If you think that’s aggressive you must have very thin skin

I’m really confused now. So she does get maternity leave and a proxy vote, do I understand that right? So the issue was more that she wanted to go in, rather than had to?

I have had babies that were well-behaved and quiet who I could take anywhere and breastfeed with no problem

I'm almost lost for words at that comment. You did not have "babies who were well-behaved".

Until a child is old enough to understand what it is being told to do, or not do, the concept of being "well-behaved" or "badly-behaved" is an irrelevant adult imposition.

She wasn't forbidden from bringing her baby to Parliament, she was forbidden to bring the baby into the chamber.

@KimikosNightmare

I have had babies that were well-behaved and quiet who I could take anywhere and breastfeed with no problem

I'm almost lost for words at that comment. You did not have "babies who were well-behaved".

Until a child is old enough to understand what it is being told to do, or not do, the concept of being "well-behaved" or "badly-behaved" is an irrelevant adult imposition.

No, it's a figure of speech that everyone understands within it's context. She just meant a baby that wasn't likely to be disruptive.

The way people pick over the exact wording of people's verbal statements is crazy. No one is going to use the exact most perfect language all the time, according to every person's various sensibilities.

Does anyone actually think that she believes babies that are easy to take places are morally superior to those who are more difficult? That is hugely unlikely, so trying to claim that's her meaning is just a gotcha attempt, and a distraction from the real question about infants in the chamber.

Precision in language is great, I'm a big fan, but it requires some awareness that in the real world, people are often less than perfectly precise, especially in verbal situations. Discrediting people because you don't like their exact word choice is not a tactic that should be encouraged.

@lazylinguist

I'm not sure what I think about this tbh. Nobody's 3 month-old is reliably 'well-behaved'. There is a nursery available on-site. Most jobs don't really allow for feeding a baby while actually carrying out the job, even if it would be theoretically possible. I can't quite imagine breast-feeding in my classroom of 15 year-olds, for example. Has anyone actually suggested that having a baby has made her give up her brain or capacity to do things? Seems unlikely.

Nurseries aren’t really set up for babies that small.

You wouldn’t need to bring your baby to school because you would be able to take maternity leave.

I want women of child bearing age to participate in Parliament, and part of that is being able to accommodate their needs when they are pregnant and have small children.

@Franca123

Women have fought hard to be taken seriously at work. It's ridiculous to suggest that looking after a 3 month old isn't a full time job. How can she be seen to be doing a good job whilst looking after her baby? She needs childcare like the rest of us plebs. She earns enough and there's a creche on site.

She can't do both, that's the point. She doesn't get mat leave/her mat cover isn't allowed into the HoP

Lobsternapkin I don’t think she thinks her baby is morally superior to other babies. But “well-behaved” is a weirdly old-fashioned thing to say. I would have overlooked it myself but now I am wondering what point she is making. If she has maternity leave and a proxy vote, I am not clear why she needs to be at work with a tiny baby. If there is a reason she needs to be, it shouldn’t matter if the baby is quiet or not - if she has a right to be there, so does any parent whatever the volume level of their baby. So she has confused the issue even more by saying it was ok because she had a “well-behaved” baby.

No, it's a figure of speech that everyone understands within it's context. She just meant a baby that wasn't likely to be disruptive

The reasons for avoiding that "figure of speech" have been set out.

I've seen so many posts on MN over the years where mothers have, quite rightly, been upset by public criticism for not having "well-behaved babies" or if you prefer , for having babies which are "disruptive"

Language matters and Creasey came across as smug and dim with that choice.

If she has maternity leave and a proxy vote, I am not clear why she needs to be at work with a tiny baby.

So she can talk and make speeches.

With the best will in the world that is difficult if the baby is screaming.

‘Well behaved’ is just a phrase. I’m sure she didn’t mean anything by it.

*not allowed into the Commons. Don't split hairs.

it shouldn’t matter if the baby is quiet or not - if she has a right to be there, so does any parent whatever the volume level of their baby. So she has confused the issue even more by saying it was ok because she had a “well-behaved” baby

You see pub signs with "well-behaved dogs welcome"

Perhaps the H of C should have signs saying "well-behaved babies welcome"

Perhaps pubs should as well.

@Forgotthebins

I’m really confused now. So she does get maternity leave and a proxy vote, do I understand that right? So the issue was more that she wanted to go in, rather than had to?

No, she does not get maternity leave.

There is more to bring an MP than just voting. She was speaking on a subject that is relevant to her constituents.

@merrymouse

If she has maternity leave and a proxy vote, I am not clear why she needs to be at work with a tiny baby.

So she can talk and make speeches.

With the best will in the world that is difficult if the baby is screaming.

‘Well behaved’ is just a phrase. I’m sure she didn’t mean anything by it.

Why bother saying it then?

I'm honestly gobsmacked at the hypocrisy on here given the number of threads I've seen over the years from women dealing with appalling criticism for not having "well-behaved babies" in public places.