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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

The de-radicalization of an anti-trans activist

153 replies

malloo · 19/11/2021 07:20

rabble.ca/lgbtiq/the-de-radicalization-of-an-anti-trans-activist/

This is interesting, some hints and tips for anyone looking for a route out of being part of extremist gender critical hate groups Grin. Worth reading the whole thing but below are a few excerpts.

This nascent anti-trans movement is known as “Trans-Exclusionary Radical Feminism” (or “TERF”) to its opponents and some neutral observers. To its proponents, however, the movement is more commonly described as “gender critical feminism”: a euphemistic rebranding of trans-exclusionary politics that tries to pass it off as something more respectable and enlightened than it is.For my part, I will use “gender critical” here to emphasize that, no matter what name it goes by, the movement is transphobic to its core.

Already, gender critical feminism has its apostates: people who initially participated in anti-trans activism, sometimes intensively, but have since desisted.

These “ex-gender criticals” are rarely profiled. De-transitioners (people who begin but later stop gender transitioning, sometimes becoming anti-trans activists themselves) figure much more prominently in the media discourse on transgender rights.

(So-called gender criticals themselves are to thank for this. They like to bandy de-transitioners around as proof that trans people’s experiences of their gender is not “real”; that trans-affirming medical care is too easy to access; and, that people can, in the end, be rescued from “transgenderism.”)

The relative absence of ex-gender criticals from the public consciousness does a disservice to trans people and our allies.

Trans-inclusive feminists have much to learn from the experiences of ex-GCers. For one thing, the trans-exclusionary movement is not nearly as solid as it might appear from the outside. It is possible for even hardcore members to join the cause of trans inclusion.

.........

The making of a transphobe
It was the fallout from trans woman Jessica Yaniv’s unsuccessful campaign to force aestheticians to wax her genitalia that set Alicia Hendley on the path to radicalization.

She still considered herself a trans ally in January 2019 when she connected with Morgane Oger, then the vice president of the B.C. New Democratic Party. Allegations were circulating that Yaniv had engaged in predatory behaviour online: in at least one instance, targeting a twelve-year-old girl for sexual harassment. Hendley, a sexual assault survivor herself, was concerned.

Oger suggested she try to identify some of Yaniv’s other alleged victims. So Hendley reached out to Irish transphobe Graham Linehan.

True, she and the gender criticals on Twitter had not gotten along in the past. “I saw them as transphobic and bigoted,” Hendley explained to me. “The GCers disliked me, and I disliked them. A lot of insults were tossed about.”

But the gender criticals were the ones talking about Yaniv the most — to their mind, Yaniv’s behaviour confirmed their worst fears about trans women to be true. Surely, then, a gender critical as prominent as Linehan could connect Hendley with the right people.

The road to hatred isn’t necessarily paved with hatred. It wasn’t for Hendley, whose descent into the bowels of anti-trans activism was as much a trauma response as anything else.

Linehan referred her to others in the gender-critical movement, and Hendley quickly found common ground.

The GCers speculated that Yaniv might not be a trans woman at all, just a man abusing gender self-identification to prey on vulnerable (cis) women and girls. Hendley found this possibility terrifying.

Perhaps the man who assaulted her could do this, too. Perhaps he could do this to victimize her daughter.

Radicalization is a highly personal and individual process. That is one of the reasons it is so difficult to combat. But it often flows from the unsatisfied needs that lead people to seek fulfillment in extremist movements and ideologies in the first place. There could be a need to heal from some earlier trauma, for example, and to feel safe from further victimization.

The transphobic, erroneous claim that permitting gender self-identification exposes women and girls to male violence stoked Hendley’s fears. Joining the gender criticals in their crusade against the rights of trans women in turn gave her a way to resolve them.
.........
Pandemic school closures meant Hendley’s children were at home much more than before. Her focus turned to providing them with the all-day supervision and care they required. Protecting “sex-based rights” began to seem less urgent.

She picked up a new hobby, learning German, and found she would rather spend her free time on that.
.....
“We were one group-think,” Hendley explained to me. “An echo chamber, a hive mind, with our mission to be ‘protecting the sex-based rights of girls and women’ (that meant cis).”

It’s wrong — and more than a little counterproductive — to assume that the people who join, or even found, hate groups do so because they lack intelligence. Hendley herself holds a doctorate in clinical psychology from the University of Windsor.
.......
Rather than argue ad nauseum that trans exclusion is anti-feminist and contrary to Canadian values, trans women and our allies ought, instead, to mobilize ex-GCers like Hendley to combat transphobic hate. Whatever such people have done in the past, they are in a unique position now to pull others out of the gender-critical movement. That makes them invaluable allies.

Recruiting ex-GCers requires, of course, knowing that these Formers exist in the first place.

“I will forever be cognizant of the harm I caused,” she told me recently, “by initiating the creation of caWsbar (not to mention my subsequent involvement). That’s on me, and no one else.”

But it is not too late for her — or any of the increasing number of ex-GCers out there — to make amends.

OP posts:
MsRosley · 06/09/2022 10:30

Gosh, an utterly incoherent article supporting an utterly incoherent ideology. What a surprise!

Goingforarun · 06/09/2022 10:46

I’m pretty smart but I found the OP completely and utterly meaningless if there was a thread I tried to follow it and it led nowhere. For language to work words have to mean something.

NotTerfNorCis · 06/09/2022 10:54

Goingforarun This explains her ideas more clearly: aliciahendley.medium.com/turncoat-aa08c2dd5881

She had reservations about how some other gender critical people were prepared to speak alongside conservatives. Also, her son didn't approve of her beliefs. She ends by straying into mysticism:

What if science (with all of its limitations) had yet to fully catch up to valid human experience? What if science never catching up was okay, because human experience isn’t solely tethered to “absolute” material reality?

She admits she 'doesn't have all the answers'. I find life is much better when I can admit that I’m not smart enough to be so certain about the human condition.

Franca123 · 06/09/2022 11:11

I'd love someone to de-radicalise me! The more I get to hear their arguments the better. Maybe one day I'll understand what the hell they're on about. I think I've spent 2 years trying to understand and got basically no where with it beyond mantras and reality denying.

WeeBisom · 06/09/2022 11:42

I’m struggling to be de-radicalised. I get on very well with my circle of fellow gender crits, I don’t have children, snd I already learn a language. Help! Do I need to get pregnant and take up a more intensive hobby, like cooking classes? Also, I can’t shake the deeply held belief that “woman”‘isn’t a feeling in a man’s head, and that women and girls have sex based rights. Do I need some actual reasoned arguments to shift these, you think, or will more feminine domesticity do the trick?

ANewCreation · 06/09/2022 11:43

"She still considered herself a trans ally in January 2019 when she connected with Morgane Oger, then the vice president of the B.C. New Democratic Party. Allegations were circulating that Yaniv had engaged in predatory behaviour online: in at least one instance, targeting a twelve-year-old girl for sexual harassment. Hendley, a sexual assault survivor herself, was concerned.

Oger suggested she try to identify some of Yaniv’s other alleged victims."

This is creepy, right?

pattihews · 06/09/2022 11:46

WeeBisom · 06/09/2022 11:42

I’m struggling to be de-radicalised. I get on very well with my circle of fellow gender crits, I don’t have children, snd I already learn a language. Help! Do I need to get pregnant and take up a more intensive hobby, like cooking classes? Also, I can’t shake the deeply held belief that “woman”‘isn’t a feeling in a man’s head, and that women and girls have sex based rights. Do I need some actual reasoned arguments to shift these, you think, or will more feminine domesticity do the trick?

You need to learn German.

KatVonlabonk · 06/09/2022 12:01

Awww I love it when the busy little bees come to visit, inspires me to do some gardening. Sarah's garden I think today.
😘😘😘😘😘😘😘😘😘😘😘😘😘😘😘

KatVonlabonk · 06/09/2022 12:02

ANewCreation · 06/09/2022 11:43

"She still considered herself a trans ally in January 2019 when she connected with Morgane Oger, then the vice president of the B.C. New Democratic Party. Allegations were circulating that Yaniv had engaged in predatory behaviour online: in at least one instance, targeting a twelve-year-old girl for sexual harassment. Hendley, a sexual assault survivor herself, was concerned.

Oger suggested she try to identify some of Yaniv’s other alleged victims."

This is creepy, right?

Yeah, that's really creepy

MorningtonCroissant · 06/09/2022 14:26

The stuff about Yaniv is so odd. Such an own goal.

But the gender criticals were the ones talking about Yaniv the most — to their mind, Yaniv’s behaviour confirmed their worst fears about trans women to be true.

To our mind? Like we're making some illogical leap there? Are they suggesting Yaniv's behaviour was acceptable? Or that we imagined the whole thing? The only thing I can think of is that Yaniv is NOT a transwoman - so we shouldn't we worried about the behaviour of transwomen, but instead work out how to stop men posing as transwomen in order to abuse. But then...

The GCers speculated that Yaniv might not be a trans woman at all, just a man abusing gender self-identification to prey on vulnerable (cis) women and girls.

Oh. So they want to argue that Yaniv is a genuine transwoman, AND that we shouldn't be worried about transwomen?
This is insane. Surely they'd want to distance themselves as much as possible from that crap? Plenty of us GCers know transwomen personally and would be keen to separate out those with dysphoria from those taking the piss (whilst not believing either group to actually be women). They're basically saying you've got to accept the predators and the abusers, they are part of this. How can they possibly think that helps their case? It's unhinged zealotry. They seem to be determined to make this an issue of extremes with no middle ground or ability to actually address any issues pragmatically.

Truthlikeness I genuinely can't think of any case I've come across of someone GC (who'd spent more than 5 minutes understanding the position) converting to the TRA position.

I know one. Good friend. Came to me terrified, for info, when his ex transed their very small child. (It was dreadful having to explain that no, social services wouldn't protect the child from her.) He was thoroughly gender critical although without really thinking about it, due to upbringing. Somehow he's gone along with things now. In this instance I think it's a kind of Stockholm syndrome thing, with him terrified she would take the child away (they have 50.50 care and the sad thing is he does far better at the actual important parenting like laundry and healthy meals and saying no once in a while.) I do wonder if a similar dynamic happens elsewhere, it's a huge thing to be socially isolated from your entire friendship group, for example.

ImherewithBoudica · 06/09/2022 15:52

😂

Oh dear. It's quite sad really.

No darlings. Go and try again. Think harder. Why might mummy be the tinciest bit pissed off with being shat all over repeatedly by the TQ+ movement?

oakleaffy · 06/09/2022 15:57

MrsOvertonsWindow · 19/11/2021 07:45

Is this poster celebrating Jessica Yaniv? An open predator of children? An open racist who specifically targets women of colour running small businesses? Grim.
OP, your post is not making the points you seem to believe it is Confused . In fact, precisely the opposite.

Yaniv is a deeply unsavoury, creepy character.
most repugnant in my opinion.

Fluffyfluffflufffluff · 06/09/2022 16:07

NotTerfNorCis · 06/09/2022 08:13

Alicia is reviewing 'The Ink Black Heart' for ideological impurities. I'm curious to see what she finds: twitter.com/maggie_xer/status/1566027836552613889

So far, she has a problem with the Strike character, and the relationship between Strike and Robin, but she doesn't seem to have found anything ideologically troubling.

That's very funny since the book largely parodies online commentators who waste their time hunting down ideological impurities and attacking creators over it.

dworky · 06/09/2022 17:09

'Wax my balls' will never win you any argument 😄

PostmortemNow · 06/09/2022 17:37

"She ends by straying into mysticism:
What if science (with all of its limitations) had yet to fully catch up to valid human experience? What if science never catching up was okay, because human experience isn’t solely tethered to “absolute” material reality?"

Oh, good old mysticism.
Thank god for that.

So, how does one de-radicalise oneself, eh?
Have a bonk with a TW with a dick or TM with
his vagina?
Which is better?
Or should one just grab some random non-binary
and hope for the best?
Just wondering...

LordLoveADuck · 08/09/2022 04:01

"If trans women are to enjoy any kind of lasting safety, the organizations dedicated to excluding them from women’s spaces and, indeed, Canadian society at large will need to be dismantled. The anti-trans “gender critical” networks that support these hate groups will need to be deconstructed. Whole communities will need to be deradicalized...."

Re-education camps for all Canucks!

Ravensclawdropout · 08/09/2022 07:38

Unfortunately there is no hope of me being de-radicalized as I agree with such radical statements such as "children shouldn't be given experimental treatments leaving them with permanent medical harm" and "post-puberty biological males should not be in women's and girls' single-sex spaces".

Ofcourseshecan · 08/09/2022 07:46

DogDaysNeverEnd · 19/11/2021 07:36

Read the article and not clear why the ex-gcer changed her mind? Seems to boils down to - bored of her mates and learned German? Fortunately I already have a smattering of German so maybe I'm safe. Oh, and identify politics. It's increasingly frustrating to be bundled in with a political persuasion because of a single issue. I feel like it's ok to be a GC socialist, but apparently I'm wrong.

Having been a socialist feminist since the 1970s, I can see nothing leftwing or progressive about male supremacist identity politics!

Ofcourseshecan · 08/09/2022 07:56

Franca123 · 06/09/2022 11:11

I'd love someone to de-radicalise me! The more I get to hear their arguments the better. Maybe one day I'll understand what the hell they're on about. I think I've spent 2 years trying to understand and got basically no where with it beyond mantras and reality denying.

Yes, I read the OP twice, thinking I’d missed the crucial bit where Alicia reveals the clinching argument. You know, what convinced her males should have access to all women-only services and spaces, and children should undergo medical experimentation.

Minutes of my life I won’t get back.

secular111 · 08/09/2022 15:35

Surely a better 'example' could have been found that didn't mention Jessica Yaniv?

Or is this it, the only one (going back to 2019) that has been documented?

I mean the EHRC 'art' even last week likely managed to 'peak' hundreds-of-thousands of otherwise undecided or unconcerned individuals. And the best the TRA/incel movement could find going the other way mentioned a disgusting racist with disturbing traits towards young girls?

That's the best it can do?

Hendley's Medium page only has 42 followers. I think the TRA's/incels don't trust her and she has no pertinent message for the rest-of-the-world that she can adequately articulate in the face of the TRA's/incels incessant homophobia, misogyny, racism and blatant hatred of autistic kids. So her flip-flop to the TRA/incel side went relatively unnoticed by all.

SecretTransTwitterEngineer · 08/09/2022 16:28

I speak to Alicia sometimes and I'm happy as I'm happy for anyone who gets out of the GC pit. I've spoken to several ex-GCs about what keeps them in the endless monomaniacal cycle and all but one have talked about the weaponisation of trauma / fear, which frankly, is really really awful.

Yaniv is trans and a terrible person as is White and plenty of other trans people, but y'know there's always bad eggs in a group, but the difference is these terrible people are used as one of the ways to keep people onside.

NecessaryScene · 08/09/2022 16:38

Yaniv is trans and a terrible person as is White and plenty of other trans people,

And almost all of whom are male. Odd that.

Almost as if "gender identity" wasn't real...

Helleofabore · 08/09/2022 16:52

all but one have talked about the weaponisation of trauma / fear, which frankly, is really really awful.

And yet, we are seeing the constant reminders of the ramifications to those who have been victims of trauma who are being caused harm by the conflicts of the demand for the rights of males being prioritised above the needs and the rights for all females.

Or, do those people not count. People like women being excluded from rape crisis centres, women being raped by males in NHS hospitals and it being denied because no 'men' were on the ward just for starters.

DecayedStrumpet · 08/09/2022 17:13

By 'weaponisation of trauma', you mean saying things like 'when people use the wrong pronouns for me it triggers my dysphoria and makes me suicidal', right?

Datun · 08/09/2022 17:58

Yaniv is trans and a terrible person as is White and plenty of other trans people, but y'know there's always bad eggs in a group, but the difference is these terrible people are used as one of the ways to keep people onside.

Funny that. Women want sex segregation because of predators. Of course they're 'onside'.