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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Harrop MPTS thread 2

999 replies

Personwithrage · 18/11/2021 11:20

Starting the new thread

OP posts:
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KittenKong · 20/11/2021 19:12

Is her just really dense or is his godfather the head of the GNC or the pope or something? Because he really believes that he can say and do what he wants doesn’t he? Unless he is thinking ‘sod it if I’m going down...’

BreadInCaptivity · 20/11/2021 19:20

@Redshoeblueshoe

Well I see Harrop has seen the light. Someone has just posted a picture of him with Joss taken in Liverpool today. On his hoodie is the badge of terf repellent.

He's an absolute fool though predictably true to form.

Anyone fancy sending this latest picture to the GMC/MPTS?

Might not be allowed to be "bundled" for this tribunal but it's a clear sign of how hollow his defence was and his irreverence for the severity of his situation (just like the vice article) and be relevant for any future proceedings (and I think there will be more if he only gets a slap on the wrist because he simply can't help himself).

BreadInCaptivity · 20/11/2021 19:22

@KittenKong

Is her just really dense or is his godfather the head of the GNC or the pope or something? Because he really believes that he can say and do what he wants doesn’t he? Unless he is thinking ‘sod it if I’m going down...’

I don't think he thinks......I think he's incredibly impulsive and can't resist any temptation to promote himself.

FlyingOink · 20/11/2021 19:26

@Redshoeblueshoe

Well I see Harrop has seen the light. Someone has just posted a picture of him with Joss taken in Liverpool today. On his hoodie is the badge of terf repellent.
On the one hand, it could be argued that even if Harrop was ordered to refrain from any and all social media use, including in a work capacity, he would still find a way to get a message across in this kind of way.

On the other hand, he's got a good argument that he should be allowed to have pictures posted of him, pin badges or not. Also he can't control what others put on their social media. It could be worse than what he would write himself, and then it would have to be proven that an accompanying picture of him signified agreement with the content of the tweet or post or whatever. Which would be hard to prove.

It's still very ill-advised isn't it? Is he actually trying to get struck off?

Terfasaurus · 20/11/2021 19:33

Taking a selfie with Joss Prior who has already boasted that they have inside intel of the case. Of course there was no way that it was going to wind up on social media, no of course not and it wouldn’t have occurred to AH to tell his activist friend not to publish the photo. No of course not, this is just more evidence of how St Adrian of Arc is the only person being burned…

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 20/11/2021 19:47

@Redshoeblueshoe

Well I see Harrop has seen the light. Someone has just posted a picture of him with Joss taken in Liverpool today. On his hoodie is the badge of terf repellent.
No words. The man has the self-awareness of a pebble.
LizzieSiddal · 20/11/2021 19:47

Does anyone know where you can see this picture. I cannot believe anyone would be so utterly stupid.

LizzieSiddal · 20/11/2021 19:50

I’ve found it on Twitter. He really is that stupid.

Lordamighty · 20/11/2021 19:50

@LizzieSiddal

Does anyone know where you can see this picture. I cannot believe anyone would be so utterly stupid.
Joss Prior’s Twitter.
LizzieSiddal · 20/11/2021 19:54

Thanks Lord, xposted with you.

Redshoeblueshoe · 20/11/2021 19:58

Someone has retweeted it and tagged in MPTS

Datun · 20/11/2021 20:18

Photos with Josh prior are either here or there, really. If it indicates that he is still hellbent on the same trajectory, then all his chickens will come home to roost at this time or next time.

Cuck00soup · 20/11/2021 20:28

Loving James Dreyfus’ work on Twitter.

LizzieSiddal · 20/11/2021 20:30

I don’t think the issue is who he’s in a photo with, it’s more the badge isn’t it.

FannyCann · 20/11/2021 20:33

LOL. Joss has described us as members of an incel/far right forum. Grin

Most posters here are Mums Joss, clue's in the name - Mumsnet!
So by definition I doubt there are many incels around here! GrinGrinGrin

RepentMotherfucker · 20/11/2021 20:47

@BreadInCaptivity

I just don't think we need to defend every utterance by every GC person at all costs.

Neither do I and I've already clarified that I disagree profoundly with many views E holds.

GC Fems are not a hive mind and frankly I struggle to think of many with whom I'd agree with on every view they've ever expressed and some who hold opinions I find repugnant.

What I'm struggling to understand is if you think that tweet was inappropriate because of the person who posted it or if you would be objecting to it regardless of who did so?

In terms of the former I refer back to my point about why is that different to an expectation that anyone with GC views should only use trans friendly terminology/wording and in the case of the latter why you think it's appropriate to redefine a word in common usage when its (non slur definition) is clarified by its context?

I have said repeatedly that for me the 'context' is the wider picture of the conversation taking place at the time. Yes the word has a context within the tweet but that's not its only context - there is the wider context too. I think it was foolish in that context

Do I think people engaged in a conversation should refrain from using slurs? Yes. Do I think that means we can only use words that have been approved by LOJ and Stonewall, no. But I wouldn't use the word 'tr**ny' for example on here, even if I was using it to refer to a transistor radio because it's a slur and it would obviously be inflammatory.

I don't think I'm saying anything new now - and haven't been for several replies - and the conversation seems to be moving on. So I hope we can agree to disagree about this particular tweet.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 20/11/2021 21:00

@Jeeeez

Wobberley's case is in recess (not a legal term obvs). They ran out of time to make the determination so the panel will reconvene and is due to report in April 2022
I'd missed that. April 2022? That's a hell of a time to wait and during that time dozens of youngsters and vulnerable adults could be prescribed hormones by that dreadful woman's team, not a one of which is a qualified psychiatrist or endocrinologist, as I understand it.
Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 20/11/2021 21:13

@Lovelyricepudding

But if we are talking about needing to avoid words used as insults....

'Queer'

Well, quite.
Cailleach1 · 20/11/2021 22:05

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Terfasaurus · 20/11/2021 22:35

One of the tribunal attendees has now published her notes on a Twitter thread.

twitter.com/selfcommit2othe/status/1462177585417400324?s=21

I hadn’t realised that the tribunal haven’t read 486 pages from the GMC yet. That sounds like a hefty pile of evidence.

Motorina · 20/11/2021 22:59

I'm wondering if the tweeter has got her wires crossed? It seems extraordinary to me that the panel wouldn't have got the bundle in advance of the hearing to read through. They would have needed to have read the witness statements, at least, to have been able to say - as they did at the start of the hearing - that they didn't have any questions for them.

The closing submissions they wouldn't have got til the end but, again, I would have expected them to read them before going into camera.

That attendee implies that the next few days are for the panel to read the bundle. They're not. They're for them to decide on the charges that remain in dispute and to write up their reasons why. They'll do so with reference to the bundles, but that's different from them now reading them from scratch.

I make no criticism of any of the tweeters in this. The opposite: I think they're doing amazingly well. But they're suffering a bit by not being familiar with the process and how it works, which sometimes is causing confusion.

This bundle, by the way, is what I was alluding to when I said that I thought tribunaltweets had given an imbalanced view of the evidence. Tribunaltweets hasn't had that bundle, which is the entirety of the GMC case, so has only referred to it when the chair or one of the representatives have said something which is suggestive of what might be in it. We know, from what has been said, that the bundle contains the witness statements, umptibillion tweets, and a glossary of helpful terms like 'terf'. But we know no details of any of that.

Motorina · 20/11/2021 23:07

I'm really really not intending to criticise either tribunaltweets or safeguarding for women. They're tweeting what they see, but what they're seeing is incomplete because one side is in the bundles they haven't seen.

Then they're trying to take notes at speed, which is a real skill. And in the confines of tweets, which is another skill. Then we're trying to interpret that.

There's lot's of layers of confusion there. I think they've done brilliantly to communicate as much as they have through that. Re-reading my previous, I can see it comes over as a bit critical and that's really not what I am thinking at all.

Terfasaurus · 20/11/2021 23:23

@Motorina would a closing submission usually be 432 pages?

Motorina · 20/11/2021 23:28

No, absolutely not. 6-12 pages, maybe?

A stage one hearing bundle - so all the witness statements, evidence, and what not, would reasonably be approximately that length.

Artichokeleaves · 21/11/2021 09:31

@Motorina

I'm really really not intending to criticise either tribunaltweets or safeguarding for women. They're tweeting what they see, but what they're seeing is incomplete because one side is in the bundles they haven't seen.

Then they're trying to take notes at speed, which is a real skill. And in the confines of tweets, which is another skill. Then we're trying to interpret that.

There's lot's of layers of confusion there. I think they've done brilliantly to communicate as much as they have through that. Re-reading my previous, I can see it comes over as a bit critical and that's really not what I am thinking at all.

Really helpful Motorina, thank you.

I agree, the tweeters have done an amazing job of communicating what was happening.