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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Nolan show Radio Ulster now - 'people' have periods

67 replies

WhereYouLeftIt · 09/11/2021 09:42

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_ulster

Maya Forstater on too.

OP posts:
GCmiddle · 09/11/2021 16:25

I wish he had asked the doctor who called in whether she thought men had periods.

bellinisurge · 09/11/2021 16:42

"Be kind" creates inaccuracies in law. By all means have a Code of practice which says "organisations should ensure that women/girls and people who have periods are able to access free products ".

SolasAnla · 09/11/2021 17:29

"Be kind" prostate cancer health care legislation
Without man/male

"Provision for people who currently have or had a prostate...."

Datun · 09/11/2021 17:45

I'm so sick of it. Nolan is doing a great job, but he really needs to nail the bloody questions.

"Is there any situation that you can think of, where the collective term woman for adult human females would be used?"

I want people to really hear the shit they're spouting.

rabbitwoman · 09/11/2021 19:40

listening to this right now and it is really really interesting.

my first thoughts on hearing Emma speak, was that actually i sympathised with what she was saying. Yes, i think when we are considering period poverty, this is something that effects everyone - families may well have to chose between period products for the girls and women in their family and another essential that benefit the whole family, such as heating or food, or something for their boys and men such medical supplies or clothing for a rapidly growing teenage boy....

in a parallel universe where the requirements of the transgender activists are actually reasonable and fair and take into consideration the impact on women and girls, we may well even be cheering on that sentiment and agreeing that is a progressive and inclusive step we all align with. it may well be a step towards eradicating period poverty, looking at how it effects everyone rather than just women - because even in this more reasonable parallel world, there is still a high level of misogyny - am i right!??

but i could hear the insincerity in her voice. It was so disingenuous! That is not the reason they have worded it that way, and we know it and probably she does too, this is complete capitulation to trans rights activism. if they weren't so dead set on their path of erasing the words women and girl and mother from public policy we would not mind. It would be great. But they are - we know it, emma knows it, Nolan knows it.......

Datun · 09/11/2021 20:08

but i could hear the insincerity in her voice. It was so disingenuous! That is not the reason they have worded it that way, and we know it and probably she does too, this is complete capitulation to trans rights activism. if they weren't so dead set on their path of erasing the words women and girl and mother from public policy we would not mind. It would be great. But they are - we know it, emma knows it, Nolan knows it.......

Exactly. She thinks we were born yesterday.

This is across the bloody board.

It's not just period poverty which, at a stretch, only in the west, if you were a linguist contortionist, might just possibly, on one day a week, affect men.

This is about menstruation, menstruation products, it's about breast/chest feeding, bodies with vaginas, cervix havers, birthing bodies and, courtesy of Teen Vogue, non-prostate havers.

It's absolute bollocks to take each one of those individual things and claim it's got nothing to do with sexism, or men wanting to claim the word woman.

BethnalGreenBambinos · 09/11/2021 20:28

GCmiddle - yes! The Dr said that some patients were missing school and their education due to period poverty. So, that "inclusive" language again - I so wanted Nolan to ask which patients those were - it's girls!
And the stuff about men accessing san pro - a man picks up supplies only because a woman asks him to! I don't think a man ever thinks, off his own bat, "I'd better get some tampons for the next time X needs them"!

rabbitwoman · 09/11/2021 20:31

Also, it really struck me how the callers were all completely supportive of trans rights - no one wanted trans people to die!! No one wanted trans people to be excluded from public life, no one denying their existence - they just wanted policies fair to women.

These are normal people with normal lives - they don't enter intellectual debates about spectrums and cis hetero normative colonialism, they are just normal people who are tolerant of all, but want to protect sex based rights, and they make up the vast majority of the voting public, so it would be a very good idea to listen to them....

Stealhsquirrelnutkin · 09/11/2021 22:28

It's straight out of the Denton's playbook. Sneak in the change you want to see under cover of something innocuous that has general support.

I remember Lily Madigan latching on to period poverty (after being accused of being a woman's officer who ignored women's issues and only ever talked about trans women's issues). Apparently there was a meeting where transactivists decided that fighting period poverty would be useful for improving their tarnished image.

The fact that, when legislation is being considered, the words woman, girl and female have been erased, shows that they couldn't even allow poverty stricken females access to cheap sanitary products unless it could at the same time be used as a cover to erase the entire female sex.

Datun · 09/11/2021 22:41

@Stealhsquirrelnutkin

It's straight out of the Denton's playbook. Sneak in the change you want to see under cover of something innocuous that has general support.

I remember Lily Madigan latching on to period poverty (after being accused of being a woman's officer who ignored women's issues and only ever talked about trans women's issues). Apparently there was a meeting where transactivists decided that fighting period poverty would be useful for improving their tarnished image.

The fact that, when legislation is being considered, the words woman, girl and female have been erased, shows that they couldn't even allow poverty stricken females access to cheap sanitary products unless it could at the same time be used as a cover to erase the entire female sex.

Crikey, you're right! I'd forgotten that part of the Denton report.

These women advocating for all people to be taken into account, are being played.

And yes, that twit Madigan writing period poverty on their hand and then taking a selfie.

StarryGazeyEyes · 09/11/2021 23:03

You know what? Having been homeless in my youth, scouring public toilets for shiny tracing paper loo roll to shove down my pants as I had zero income for sanitary protection, it gives me the fucking rage that anyone would want to even pretend to co-opt into that kind of poverty. No man ever had to do that.

3timeslucky · 10/11/2021 20:07

@bellinisurge

Listening to it now. I'm absolutely fucking heartbroken that the SDLP have adopted this shit. I'm desperate for SDLP to be the strongest voice of nationalism in NI. And they had my support. The voices of SDLP supporting callers saying they can't support them anymore because of this. Actually feeling a bit tearful. The madness of this shit in Ireland is going to take a while to unravel. Although TENI (Irish Stonewall) are on the cusp of financial scandal.
Same problem here (RoI) and it seems across the UK. Who do you vote for when they're all unthinkingly hitching their cart to this ideology?

Do you think the financial scandal will be enough? In the middle of this madness that would be one tiny glimmer of light.

NitroNine · 10/11/2021 22:54

I wonder if the SDLP are trying to play catch-up with Sinn Féin (only party in NI to explicitly mention trans rights in their 2015 manifesto*) on this… Plus the usual sway to [some degree of] what UK Labour are up to; & of course looking to the South & dreaming coming out (no pun intended, but I’m leaving it…) with this mess.

  • But let’s face it, the Sinners could put what they liked in their manifesto & [in some seats] have an alpaca stand (possibly the one from this tweet, unclear whether or not it would accept payment in sweets) & they’d still get elected.
CheeseMmmm · 11/11/2021 01:44

The question I would have asked -

Many international orgs eg United Nations, actionaid etc have initiatives about periods where they refer to women and girls.

What's you view on that?

SolasAnla · 11/11/2021 10:39

UN woman on Twitter of 1000% TWAW.
I think they were one of the group's who were told politely to PFO by women working on the front line in countries where women are actively socially excluded while bleeding.

drhf · 11/11/2021 10:50

In a parallel universe where the requirements of the transgender activists are actually reasonable and fair and take into consideration the impact on women and girls, we may well even be cheering on that sentiment and agreeing that is a progressive and inclusive step we all align with. it may well be a step towards eradicating period poverty, looking at how it effects everyone rather than just women - because even in this more reasonable parallel world, there is still a high level of misogyny - am i right!??

No, I don't agree with this actually. In fact for me the existence of this argument is the biggest reason why we need to avoid gender-neutral language. Periods affect women.

When we talk about men's mental health, we don't say it's worth addressing because men have female relatives, so it affects everyone - although male mental illness does have an enormous impact on women and children, through caring responsibilities, domestic violence, suicide and more. We talk about it because men deserve to have the best chance to be healthy and happy, like everyone else. We don't try to cure prostate cancer because it affects everyone - we try to cure it because men have a right to life, just like everyone else. But when women have needs, suddenly we talk about them in relation to how that affects men.

Women are human, and we are entitled to campaign for the things we need. We don't need to apologise for our needs, or to argue that our needs should be addressed because they interfere with our role of looking after everyone else.

My issue with talking about "people with periods" has nothing to do with any group's activism other than feminism. It's because the effect of doing so, whatever the intention, is to make women's issues - yet again - about men. The core of my feminism is being able to say that women matter in our own right.

3timeslucky · 11/11/2021 14:10

@dhrf 100% agree. Well said!

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