Queering of Motherhood. <warning>

[WarriorN]

Disturbing content.

https://grahamlinehan.substack.com/p/the-queering-of-motherhood?r=nbcqt&utmcampaign=post&utmmmedium=email&utmsource=

Oh and as an aside, all language is always evolving. It’s what language does. But the imposition of new meanings and the forced erasure of existing meanings is not evolution. It’s authoritarian coercion. And it never leads to permanent change in language.

The monitors will be all over this one.

Of course they are, images such as the one in this article are all over twitter, easy to find by anyone who wishes to search, and they don't want it to be zapped.

@CreepingDeath

I agree it's pretty horrific when you understand what the motivation is behind much of this. Unfortunately, even MN don't like us talking about AGP so this thread might get wiped.

It is the TRAs dirty little secret, they don't want the wider public to know about this, because they well know most people would be pretty horrified. Many women are being used as unsuspecting props in men's sexual fantasies. And if we complain, we are the hateful, bigoted ones .

There was also the case of the online support group for women who had suffered miscarriage and stillbirth, where a TW joined and wanted to 'act out' a miscarriage or something. When some women complained that it was offensive, they were kicked out of the group! Who are the women going along with this, thinking this is ok?!

Yes - and yet you can bet that it will be the same people who get horrified over “cultural appropriation” in other contexts. Yet fetishising miscarriage and stillbirth is apparently okay because it is all about “dysphoria”

Omg 🤮🤮🤮🤮

Yes it doesn't make much sense to me either. Transmen are female born people who present as male. They do not fetishise their femaleness, far from it.

Also we know not all trans people are dangerous/disturbed, but you can't deny the existence of people who are very real and then accuse others of transphobia.

WTF is that silicone 'baby'

All throughout history men have taken the experience of birth and nurturing away from us. This is just the modern day iteration.

I have no words for the disgust I feel for these men.

@Gncq

I can hear gender ideology myth number nine calling....

"Any mention of autogynephilia means you are calling ALL transwomen fetishists/perverts/rapists (delete as appropriate), you must immediately stfu".

Aaaannnd....

Today 12:25HowardNoir
It's very silly to assume all trans men are autogynephiles.

I am sure that MNHQ will be inundated with reports from the normal suspects. I do hope they allow this to stand so that women can see how the extreme aspects of this ideology that go completely uncommented on by all the organisations, pose a direct threat to women and children.
It's long overdue for trans advocates to start challenging the extreme fetishes / behaviours that threaten the safety of women and children

There's no shame in it - everyone recognises that political movements get appropriated by the unacceptable. What matters is that lines of acceptability are drawn and that safeguarding - especially babies and children - is everyone's priority.

I just read the article.
This is just so fucked up and sick, I don’t even have the words for it. Esspecially the silicone baby part is really, really disturbing.

This was horrific. It's bottom of the barrel stuff but by god do we need to know what the top of the barrel covers up when it's getting smuggled into general society.

Such a disturbing read.

This quote though:
“When they pulled my daughter free of my wife’s body, I was the first one to hold her. I took her back to the hospital room and did what any mom would do -- I put her on my bare chest and let her find my breast.”

They took a newly born baby straight from it’s mother and tried to get it to latch on? So validation and affirmation (and anything else they disgustingly got from it), is so much more important than that babies first experience of the world. Purposely removing a terrified, traumatised baby from the only safety it instinctively knows for their own benefit is frankly abusive. From the cold way in which they talked about the baby being ‘pulled free of my wife’s body’, suggests the wife was just a body to be used and then something to be discarded after the birth.

suggests the wife was just a body to be used and then something to be discarded after the birth

That’s the inevitable result of referring to “birthing bodies”, isn’t it?

@HowardNoir

It's very silly to assume all trans men are autogynephiles. If women could support each other better instead of tearing each other down we'd all be much more secure in our own identity and the transphobes would stop pretending trans people are mentally unwell or pose a threat to them.

Language used about women including trans women is still evolving and although articles like this highlight why cis women are left out or not specified when talking about women, they're doing more harm than good and aren't actually tackling the problem.

Not one person - not one - has suggested that ANY transmen are AGP. It would be a silly suggestion, given that they're already female.

Now, let's just overlook you not knowing the difference between transmen and transwomen. You claim that we shouldn't assume all... The basic rule of safeguarding is to assume the worst, until it can be ruled out. What possible motivation can someone who cannot give birth, or breastfeed have for joining a miscarriage/antenatal/breastfeeding group? I'm definitely in favour of assuming the worst.

@HowardNoir

It's very silly to assume all trans men are autogynephiles. If women could support each other better instead of tearing each other down we'd all be much more secure in our own identity and the transphobes would stop pretending trans people are mentally unwell or pose a threat to them.

Language used about women including trans women is still evolving and although articles like this highlight why cis women are left out or not specified when talking about women, they're doing more harm than good and aren't actually tackling the problem.

Good thing that no-one is doing that - assuming all transmen, or indeed, transwomen, as are actually being discussed here, are autogynephiles.

But I would not expect you to represent what is being said honestly, because it's not what you do.

Please, please, stop with the CIS!!!!!!
I don't understand Howardnoir- at all; perhaps they could 'educate' themselves?

"When women are not defined as adult human females, they are instead relegated to splintered parts that are made available for possession"

Well said.

Of all the stuff I've been reading on this forum recently, this is the first to have actually turned my stomach and given me tight anxiety in my chest. And I read the BK articles too. Can someone please provide me with something hope, as the BPA article in the telegraph did at the end of last weekend.

The part about the male partner deciding to transition during pregnancy reminded me of Alexandra Hemmingsley's story

LittleWingSoul
I just remember that these people do not represent this ideology. They're outliers - and in normal circumstances would be condemned and isolated. It's only the impact of social media and a weird defensiveness, "acceptance without exception" as Stonewall tell us, that seems to stop people from challenging them.
I do think that the increased publicity and awareness will eventually have an impact. Just as universities are being shamed into protecting the rights of their staff to speak freely about contentious issues, so organisations will have to start acknowledging the need to safeguard children and to rein in the extreme levels of queer theory / celebrating kink etc.

I do hope I'm right....

How can we say "these people are outliers" with any certainly as academic research is being shut down?
It's horrific that babies are being co-opted into adults' delusions. Any incidence of this is unacceptable. The interruption of the mother-baby bonding process is not a trivial matter to be overlooked in the interests of affirming another adult's delusion.

Anontwentyone

It's just so disturbing
As Necessary Scene said the majority are het, I read about about 6O% of TW sexually desire women, so there's a very strong chance the majority of that 60% are AGP going by Blanchard's studies.

Another interesting stat on paraphilias is that about 5% (some studies even show as high as 15%) of men have at least one type of paraphilia.

Ranking by prevalence, voyeurism is top, followed by in order fetishism, exhibitionism, masochism, sadism, transvestism, then others (thankfully paedophilia ranks v low).

With transvestism (AGP) ranking in the top five paraphilias, coupled with 1 in 20 men having at least one paraphilia, statistically it's likely AGP could be found in (I'm not a statistician!) around 1 in every 100 man?? Someone else could probably work that out better than me.

The reason why it's significant that most or many men who have a paraphilia have more than one, is because if a man has AGP it's statistically likely he also gets off on exhibitionism and voyeurism (also in the top five).
It's basically a cocktail of desire to gain access to women's spaces.

It would certainly explain why so many men appear to have such a relaxed attitude to the possibility of fetishes being played out in public or at work.

Eg the NSPCC, and rubber suited, pissing gimp man.

The outrage over that and the questions it raises over safeguarding children, appeared to completely pass them by.

For some men perhaps them not being the object of the fetish means they're not really seeing the problem. Or are also reasonably sympathetic towards it, because they are that way inclined themself.

The advent of the Internet, and sharing your fetish, has emboldened a lot of men to be quite upfront about this. The sheer numbers of men with fetishes (not just AGP), is overwhelming.

Oh my.
This needs to be seen by all.

@MrsOvertonsWindow I hope so too. And there's hope for the toppling of stonewall...