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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

My post on the person suing NHS was taken down

113 replies

Tesla73 · 11/10/2021 15:38

So I am posting it again with no comment

www.birminghammail.co.uk/black-country/transgender-woman-rowley-regis-sue-21817673

OP posts:
midgedude · 11/10/2021 17:03

Brest size is treated when it's causing problems

Usually reduction not complete removal

Problems that can be detected and measured such as pain , posture problems

Being trans is a self reported something that isn't an illness or disorder that has nothing measurable about it

It's not about what bit of you the surgery affects , it's the why that matters

sunshinesupermum · 11/10/2021 17:05

Speechless and furious.

AwaAnBileYerHeid · 11/10/2021 17:09

@WhoNeedsaLammyInTheWorld

We need proper research. Why should the NHS fund treatment that is not proven and/or potentially harmful
Exactly, isn't treatment supposed to be evidence based?
Maerchentante · 11/10/2021 17:13

Entitled much?

Lovelyricepudding · 11/10/2021 17:16

I joined a waiting list for an op a month ago and was told they have no idea when I will be seen but likely to be at least two years.

Gingerkittykat · 11/10/2021 17:18

@midgedude

Brest size is treated when it's causing problems

Usually reduction not complete removal

Problems that can be detected and measured such as pain , posture problems

Being trans is a self reported something that isn't an illness or disorder that has nothing measurable about it

It's not about what bit of you the surgery affects , it's the why that matters

You could say the same about many mental disorders.

Depression is based on self reporting symptoms.

Just because healthcare is shit in a lot of specialities doesn't mean folk shouldn't be trying to improve it.

I'm currently saving up to go abroad for surgery I will probably need to wait 4 years for on the NHS so not a stranger to waiting lists.

mumwon · 11/10/2021 17:25

My dh annual (ha) cardiac review is pending according to the hospital (translation "well we don't have the foggiest notion of when we will be able to book an appointment - but we will let you know")

Unsure33 · 11/10/2021 17:40

I know two people with very bad painful hernias which affect their everyday life . They have been waiting for years . Same for hip replacements also very painful.

So to say this area is “special” is rubbish .

Bosky · 11/10/2021 17:52

@poshme

I liked the comment underneath the article:

'My self harming, suicidal, Autistic, ADHD daughter is on a two year waiting list to see CAMHS. We have spent thousand on private treatment. If being trans is no longer considered a medical condition then why are services being provided on the NHS? Unless there is trauma or something surely most of it is cosmetic?'

I saw that and too and wondered, as others have, whether the Good Law Project has taken on any other cases based on excessive NHS waiting times or flat-out denial of treatment due to lack of resources. If this is a “test case” then they could hardly have chosen one less likely to garner public sympathy when people have actually died due to lack of medical care.

This seems wildly misjudged and is likely to reduce support for both trans people and the NHS. Every time this sort of story comes up in the Press the comments are full of people asking criticising the NHS for even providing these sorts of services in the first place.

KevinTheKoala · 11/10/2021 17:53

A 6 year old family member of mine has just been diagnosed with cancer after their GP refused to see them for 4 weeks, not phoning back after the parent filling in the Web forms etc. That is the state the NHS is in right now. There are many things they are doing wrong - this is not one of them.

KittenKong · 11/10/2021 17:54

My aunt had a brain tumour. Surgery was postponed and postponed - until it was inoperable.

Some people should just shut up.

Bonsaibreaker · 11/10/2021 18:07

My father passed away this January due to treatment waiting times.

Fact is most people have a story to tell regarding treatment waiting times and the consequences of that no matter what the treatment is for.

It just feels like those awaiting cancer treatment or MH treatment or treatment for gynecological issues do not get the option to sue. We just accept long wait times. However this particular group and in my opinion a group that displays entitled behaviour in most aspects of life are somehow more worthy or deserving so have the support, platform and social media backing in order to portray them as "special or more deserving".

Not sure I have worded this correctly I hope I have sorry if I offend anyone.

midgedude · 11/10/2021 18:24

mental health issues are detectable in the brain

We may use self reported evidence but we also know there are detectable brain changes , chemical imbalances etc

MonsignorMirth · 11/10/2021 18:26

""I’d chose to describe the current NHS trans healthcare system."

This article is so badly written, I can't tell what this means.

The person's attitude seems to be that being trans is a condition that requires medical "treatment". I thought this was a rather outdated and regressive view - a bit like when homosexuality was in the DSM?

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 11/10/2021 19:15

@KevinTheKoala

A 6 year old family member of mine has just been diagnosed with cancer after their GP refused to see them for 4 weeks, not phoning back after the parent filling in the Web forms etc. That is the state the NHS is in right now. There are many things they are doing wrong - this is not one of them.
I'm so sorry to read that. I hope your family member has a referral to a good treatment centre.

If breast reduction surgery is being cut back in some areas that's utterly shitty and I would utterly support someone suing for that.

There are CCGs that don't pay for breast reconstruction after cancer-related mastectomy. There have been several discussions on FWR.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3482320-Woman-DENIED-breast-reconstruction-after-cancer-due-to-funding-cuts

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3242855-Trans-versus-natal-cosmetic-care-on-NHS

NecessaryScene · 11/10/2021 19:20

The person's attitude seems to be that being trans is a condition that requires medical "treatment".

I think the approved view is not that it requires it, but that it deserves it. "Treatment" should be provided on demand.

This is a slightly bad fit for the NHS, which is based around what people actually need.

If people want to specify what they get, they need to go private...

IReallyLikeCrows · 11/10/2021 20:12

I've sat here reading some of the links and my brain is on fire with it all. I'm sure that in proper legalise this isn't what's known as vexatious litigation - n.b. I was trying hard to think of the word vexatious for about half an hour because I knew the phrase but kept coming up with fictitious, vicious, the brain on fire did not help - which means a legal action which is taken for the sole means to harass or subdue an adversary but that's certainly what it looks like to me.

I've had a lot of respect for the Good Law Project but this is ridiculous and has made me lose all respect for them. For one it's really shitty to sue the NHS unless there is some really, really strong reason for it, a death caused by incompetence, for example, and secondly surely any sane person can see that while in an ideal world we'd all be able to get whatever surgery/treatment we needed whenever we needed it, this isn't an ideal world. The NHS is very much up against the wall at the moment, due in no small part to restrictions of funds and what they can and can't do put upon them by successive governments and to go after them for this when we know that waiting lists are getting longer and longer in every part of the service is just so utterly wrong.

The Good Law Project is going very much in the wrong direction by taking on this case.

AlfonsoTheDinosaur · 11/10/2021 20:32

No comment.

SpindleWhirl · 11/10/2021 20:39

"Haters will say there are cancer sufferers etc needing treatment and that we’re not a priority. But I’m not asking for priority. I’m asking for what we are entitled to, what everybody else already has and has had for many years.

Imagine being told you're a 'hater' when you've got cancer. This is a very unsettling ideology.

Fieldofgreycorn · 11/10/2021 20:44

The person's attitude seems to be that being trans is a condition that requires medical "treatment". I thought this was a rather outdated and regressive view - a bit like when homosexuality was in the DSM?

Not for many of those being referred to GICs with crippling gender dysphoria and needing medical treatment it isn’t.

Why would people describe surgery that helps someone be able to have sex and sexual relationships and be intimate with another person as “cosmetic’ or ‘aesthetic’?

It’s like reading the Daily Mail from 20 years ago this thread.

Bonsaibreaker · 11/10/2021 20:50

Imagine being told you're a 'hater' when you've got cancer. This is a very unsettling ideology.

Not surprising though.
Daily we are told males who identify as women are the most oppressed and a lie told often enough is eventually believed...

OldCrone · 11/10/2021 20:51

Not for many of those being referred to GICs with crippling gender dysphoria and needing medical treatment it isn’t.

If gender dysphoria isn't a medical condition why do they need medical treatment for it?

Eyesofdisarray · 11/10/2021 20:53

I have no words...
Well I do actually
Better not though

MonsignorMirth · 11/10/2021 20:56

@Fieldofgreycorn

The person's attitude seems to be that being trans is a condition that requires medical "treatment". I thought this was a rather outdated and regressive view - a bit like when homosexuality was in the DSM?

Not for many of those being referred to GICs with crippling gender dysphoria and needing medical treatment it isn’t.

Why would people describe surgery that helps someone be able to have sex and sexual relationships and be intimate with another person as “cosmetic’ or ‘aesthetic’?

It’s like reading the Daily Mail from 20 years ago this thread.

I've seen many many people who are pro-self-ID because they believe that being trans shouldn't be 'medicalised' and shouldn't require a medical diagnosis. It's not something I've just made up.

This is about a TW who wants cosmetic surgery because they don't feel they look feminine enough - right? How is that different from anyone born female?

I assume field you believe one needs to have gender dysphoria to be trans?

Theunamedcat · 11/10/2021 20:56

Mmm there are so many things I could say to this

24 YEARS ago I came down with a condition easily treated but I was pregnant by the time the consultant saw me so treat me after? No nothing after just waved away with these things can get better by themselves 13 years ago the consultant realised I still had the condition still untreated 9 years ago same consultant hasn't anything been done yet? 2 years ago its getting a bit ridiculous now the pandemic hit my latest referral has gone nowhere

My condition is now causing real issues and is still not fixed but its got to the stage now where the "cure" could be just as damaging as the disease to my system