I am sick of this shit

[bitheby]

I have been trying to conceive for 2 years and at over 40, single and after a miscarriage last year, I am emotional, and managing the impact of possibly never having children.

I am in various Facebook groups for people considering or undertaking IVF and made this comment.

Just had the following response. I've had it. Perhaps rather immaturely I refused to edit my language and have left the group. There was nothing factually incorrect about what I wrote.

There's only one possible reply:

So sorry for the tough ride your female biology is giving you.

Jesus Christ. It really is madness. Hope you find a better group.

I’m so, so sorry you’re going through this, hope you’re coping ok. I’m in a similar place xxxxxxx

Ironically it’s fucking crap like this that’s turning me against using more inclusive language etc. Ok mate, you’re non binary but give us a fucking break. I’m sorry you even had to look at that stupid and tactless response.

I wouldn’t mind if they were as insistent on using this kind of language for what’s traditionally seen as men’s stuff - but it only seems to be what’s traditionally to do with women. Eg that NHS East England tweet about caring for ‘pregnant people’ whereas you go on the eg NHS web page for prostate cancer and they state:

What is the prostate?

The prostate is a small gland in the pelvis, found only in men.

www.nhs.uk/conditions/prostate-cancer/

@Nonmaquillee

I would also have done the same. Only biological women can have IVF.

The fact that this group considers it more important to spout such gaslighting nonsense than to support you as a woman on a painful journey speaks volumes. I hope other women leave the group too and then perhaps you can create your own group free of this BS.

Wishing you luck.

Absolutely this!

I'm so sorry OP. I am really sick of people who loudly identify as kind but whose actions show them to be intolerant, thoughtless, power crazed and sometimes outright cruel. If I was trans I'd be horrified at people behaving like this on my behalf.

Any transmen (or females with other gender IDs) contemplating bringing a child into this world, are going to have a pretty rough time if they don't understand the vital need for words to have meanings when dealing with anything medical.

How about all those who purport to be trans allies stop perpetuating the lie that those who don't believe in gender ID wish trans people harm?

OP maybe you would have success starting a specific support thread on fwr?

It’s infuriating isn’t it? Mumsnet is great for support through IVF, I went through it 6/7 years ago and had great support and gained a lot of knowledge and insight from some wonderful women on the infertility threads. Interestingly, I see a lot of their names popping up on FWR now that I’ve found my way here and I’m again learning from these amazing women.

So you aren't allowed to call yourself a woman any more? Gestational carriers? Where will this madness end. if you can carry and give birth to a baby you are a woman end of.

Jfc. I'm furious for you!

I'm sorry OP.
How can telling utter lies be more important than listening to a woman talk about her biological based situation?

Fuming for you, you did nothing wrong. That person is a bully and genuinely stupid. You are better off out of that sort of 'support'.

So sorry OP! Infertility is a bitch...my sister through years of struggle and the LAST thing you need is some self-righteous policing in the group that is supposed to support you. I would tell them why you are leaving - that their bullying is making this place impossible to feel supported.

Bullying is rife. Someone rocking up asking me to edit my language would get a swift block from me, I don't entertain bullies.

Identity seems to attract bullies. Just block and don't engage, carry on without them, don't give bullies any time.

Thanks to everyone offering support. I was only really mentioning that by way of background and to explain that the group is pregnancy specific so it hasn't even occurred to me not to talk about women. I'm in other groups that aren't LGBTQ focused but as I'm TTC with a donor, that one covers that aspect of things. To be honest, when I posted it I probably didn't even check whether it was the LGBT group or a general IVF group but wanted to respond to a woman concerned about her cycle length changing after the vaccine. Hence my post.

I'm active on the conception and donor conception boards on Mumsnet so don't worry about that. I am getting support.

Thanks for those talking about the bullying nature of it. I felt like I was expected to capitulate and apologise which got my hackles up even more. I just said something like 'no,ta and I'm
leaving the group before you boot me out' and I went.

Capitulate is right.
Fascinating to see how all that matters are feelings and people's truths... obviously not women's feelings and truths though, who cares about that?

Reminds me of people posting on Facebook etc demanding everyone 'be kind' (except them, obviously).

Someone jumped on your honest and open posts to play "victim top trumps" with it. That is callous and inappropriate and I would have left on the spot, too.

I'm sure there are more sensitive and supportive groups out there, though I suppose someone can always barge in

Is it worth asking the moderators whether they see that post as acceptable? If they do, you know not to go back!

What the absolute fuck is the matter with some people. I am so sorry you had to deal with that op - I would have done the same.

It always astonishes me how, even in a situation like this, women are expected to prioritise other people's feelings. And when it's other women doing the policing (I assume it is?) then it's an even harder kick in the teeth.

Wishing you all the very best

Argh! That’s so ducking annoying!!!!

The statement “many women are reporting cycle changes” says nothing at all about whether trans men or non binary folk have cycles or are reporting changes. Your statement isn’t even excluding anybody!!!

In a specifically lgbtq+ group I can see that assuming anyone looking to be pregnant is ok with being called a woman might be provocative but you didn’t do that. You used the word woman in a perfectly normal and accurate way that doesn’t exclude anyone.

For fuckings fucks sake.

I'm sorry OP

I'm so sorry OP. Gestational carriers? Get in the fucking sea

Sorry you had to experience that - I'd have left too. (I left a group I liked recently when some younger women started to go about policing what they called "terf rhetoric" - I just can't be doing with any of that rubbish. I miss the group, but I'm too old to be bullied.)

I hope you are doing ok, OP. It's rough and the last thing you need is some sanctimonious language policing from idiots.

I want to know for the purposes of all the allies pretending this is about TM rather than TW, how many TM are currently pregnant, and how many have been? How many more than Freddie. I genuinely really want to know.