Pro-porn Childline film encouraging kids to google BDSM etc

[Sunkisses]

Jeez, just seen this from the Safe Schools Alliance UK on twitter. Six years ago Childline produced this pro-porn film which is basically an advert for PornHub masquerading as a child protection resource. It tells children that porn is "fun" & recommends genres like BDSM to google. It's had over 3 million views in the last 6 years, and goodness knows how much it has contributed to the rape culture we are now seeing in schools. It is illegal for under 18s to view porn, and children should be taught this and the harms of pornography, not encouraged to view it with a nod, nod, wink, wink attitude.

You can view the Safe Schools Alliance UK tweet here: twitter.com/SafeSchools_UK/status/1379528765261381634

SSAUK are calling on Childline and the NSPCC (who run Childline) to take this film down.

The Government should bring in age-verification for online porn ASAP to prevent children having easy access to online porn. All the laws have been passed, and the regulatory framework is in place. The Government bottled it at the last minute in 2019 after facing pressure from the powerful porn industry. Our children deserve better.

If that's how you view child line then fine, however I wouldn't agree that they aren't a reliable charity and source of support for young people.

Why do adults involved in the sex education of young children believe they need to be told in detail about different kinds of pornography? Adults working with vulnerable children shouldn't be desperate to be seen as cool. It creates an unhealthy dynamic.

@GoingThruTheMotions

^However, I'd much rather a young person in that situation watch this then find dangerous pornography.^ It's not an either or situation though, is it? The signposting of types here actually guarantees exposure to those types, of course curiousity is going to mean they'll look it up. I'm a grown adult and I don't know the swan thing. The only thing stopping me from looking it up is the knowledge that no good can come from that. Children don't check their impulses in that way. If as you say, "Children will look at porn anyway" then it's doubly important a clear message comes from adults not affirming nonsense.

This was me too. My reaction was later remembering and thinking ... I want to look that up.

The fast pace of this delivery means so much of the information is left simmering to pop up later.

This also makes it a fail for discussions as it mentions SO much that you cannot give it adequate attention in one session. So they are going to look it up for themselves.

@ASugarr

If that's how you view child line then fine, however I wouldn't agree that they aren't a reliable charity and source of support for young people.

So, are you simply damping down the bits of this video you are uncomfortable with then?

Because of Childline’s involvement?

Personally I find there's a vast difference in quality both of training received and the type of adults involved with children.
I have experience in primary, secondary and youth work. Very few primary colleagues are not up to scratch with child protection. I've come across the occasional TA with funny ideas, but they tend to be on the stricter lines anyway (like one ta who told me male teachers should not teach girls pe in ks1 and 2 because they might see them changing).
In secondary and especially youth work I have seen many red flags. Ranging from down with the kids naivety to really troubling stuff. I'm not saying you don't get dodgy people in primary, but they are definitely vetted better.

I mean I don't see any issues really with the video so.

GoingThruTheMotions

“However, I'd much rather a young person in that situation watch this then find dangerous pornography.” (Written by Asuggar)

Absolutely. I too did not know many of these variations of porn and was especially confused by Swan dancing porn.

Of course children would look it up. Just think of those girls and some boys who love dancing. Think of the beauty of Swan Lake.
Now think of the horror of what they’ll find - immediately:

Without opening links I just found lots of porn sites look linked to Swan Lake.

Pointing the way to finding this- which in my opinion the video does- epitomises the meaning of corruption.

Yes, we get that.
If you cant see problems you cant respond to them. Even if you've had safeguarding training its never a bad idea to do a refresher, and to review the safeguarding procedures where you work.

Sorry, I was not clear. I had been responding to this:

GoingThruTheMotions

However, I'd much rather a young person in that situation watch this then find dangerous pornography.

It's not an either or situation though, is it? The signposting of types here actually guarantees exposure to those types

@ScrollingLeaves

GoingThruTheMotions

“However, I'd much rather a young person in that situation watch this then find dangerous pornography.” (Written by Asuggar)

Absolutely. I too did not know many of these variations of porn and was especially confused by Swan dancing porn.

Of course children would look it up. Just think of those girls and some boys who love dancing. Think of the beauty of Swan Lake.
Now think of the horror of what they’ll find - immediately:

Without opening links I just found lots of porn sites look linked to Swan Lake.

Pointing the way to finding this- which in my opinion the video does- epitomises the meaning of corruption.

Well yeah if you google any thing with porn you are going to get porn. You can put restrictions on your internet so that key words like porn can't come up, again that's more of a parental thing.

I taught my lot that misogyny is a form of bullying. Once you see it that way its a lot harder to unsee and easier to challenge.

Well yeah if you google any thing with porn you are going to get porn. You can put restrictions on your internet so that key words like porn can't come up, again that's more of a parental thing.

May I please refer you to the point on the previous page about where this leaves children who do not have parents who implement parental controls on the internet? Whether out of ignorance, naivety, or darker reasons?

Are they an acceptable sacrifice so a youtuber can come off as cool and worldly?

Right, so your particular brand of safeguarding seems to be along the lines of why bother, they'll see it anyway.

And the point is, that the video points the direction. You are operating under the assumption that once children hit your magic age of twelve (a problem in itself) they look up porn. They don't. Exposure varies depending on many factors like upbringing, education and peer group. I wouldn't want a child's first exposure to be this video. That doesn't mean I am setting them up for worse. This video is not the Messiah of sex education and there are much better resources (some posted on this thread).
Frankly, Asugarr I think you have a very entrenched view of what the people on Mumsnet are like, so you automatically oppose any opinions you see, even when they make good sense.

@Thelnebriati

I taught my lot that misogyny is a form of bullying. Once you see it that way its a lot harder to unsee and easier to challenge.

Stealing for my boy.

Asuggar
“Well yeah if you google any thing with porn you are going to get porn.”

The point being that having watched the video children will find it.

If the ‘parental control’ system were working there would be less prevalence of children watching porn. Parental control would seem
one way or another not to give protection.

Presumably they are supposed to find ‘WTF if Porn’

@ScrollingLeaves

Asuggar “Well yeah if you google any thing with porn you are going to get porn.”

The point being that having watched the video children will find it.

If the ‘parental control’ system were working there would be less prevalence of children watching porn. Parental control would seem
one way or another not to give protection.

Presumably they are supposed to find ‘WTF if Porn’

Look, at the end of the day this discussion should be have with parents. If for you that includes young people watching this then okay. If not then okay. That's your choice. Sadly not everything can be 100% prevented. But giving open and honest information which I find this video does is important. If it doesn't for you then make sure you have that conversation with your children. Do also remember they are allowed to have a different opinion to you.

“But giving open and honest information which I find this video does is important”

It is not entirely open or honest. It has a pro-porn/porn is fun/ slant.

Asking me to remember that my children might have a different opinion to me (which I presume you take to be an anti-porn one) seems to me to be suggesting you are pleased that ‘WTF is Porn’ will provide it.

@ASugarr

I mean I don't see any issues really with the video so.

Excellent. Then you can go confidently discuss our issues with the communication mechanics being used here and why you feel they are fit for purpose.

Emotive arguments are great distractions but that is all it is at the end of the day. Nothing concrete (unless there is data to support it).

As I learned from an excellent marketing manager, I have an eager curiosity to understand what I am missing and others are understanding better. Hence why I am on MN.

You say you have the expertise. I am keen to learn from people who have a depth of knowledge and expertise.

Please show me what I am missing in the message and the communication style and delivery that makes this a good video.

Btw. You did say upthread you would change some things, that is an indication, to me, that you are not perfectly comfortable with this video despite your later assertions. Maybe you didn’t mean it when you said you would make changes though?? ?

Look, at the end of the day this discussion should be have with parents. If for you that includes young people watching this then okay. If not then okay. That's your choice.
Sadly not everything can be 100% prevented. But giving open and honest information which I find this video does is important. If it doesn't for you then make sure you have that conversation with your children.
Do also remember they are allowed to have a different opinion to you.

You have stated though you would use this in class. You have deemed it suitable for class use as a sexual health educator.

Come to think of it, isn’t you job to dissect a video of this nature to accurately access it? I always thought that in dealing with a subject like this, for under 18s, you would need to show anyone who questioned it an assessment, like a risk assessment that you will have filled out to ensure safeguarding protocols are followed.

Or has my limited knowledge of safeguarding led me to believe things like this are done when clearly they are deemed necessary? One of the pitfalls of having such limited knowledge around such an important issue.

How does a child who has been shown porn by an adult know this is a form of abuse if Childline endorse the message “porn is fun”?

How does a child who has been shown porn by an older child know this is a form of abuse if it is “sharing for a laugh”?

I should add those to my next cut and paste of issues Delirium.

I think you have absolutely hit the nail on the head.

How does a child who has been shown porn by an older child know this is a form of abuse if it is “sharing for a laugh”?

I have a vague memory of a member of this board having to explain exactly that to her unaware daughter after finding out what had been shared on the daughter's whatsapp group.

I said I might make some changes, not very big ones though. I'd probably just want to discuss other parts of the porn industry and stuff.

I think people are mistaking that regular porn is fun to watch. We've used porn in various medias for decades (go the Amsterdam sex museum if you don't believe me). Porn hub as a site isn't very credible because of the harm its done, however porn itself outside of that is actually a fun way to masturbate and learn about the human body in a sexual way!

It might not be a fun thing for you, that's okay! But for many it is and discussing the pros and cons is important to allowing young people to make a choice for themselves to know if it is right for them. Do I think more hardcore/fetish porn should be behind a security system like they do in other countries in europe where you must be over 18 and show evidence for that? Absolutely. But do I think porn as a whole is just this super dangerous thing? No.

Have you ever read Ordeal by Linda Lovelace and Mike McGrady?

I think you should.

www.abebooks.co.uk/book-search/title/ordeal/author/linda-lovelace/