Warnings of impact on height and bone strength prompt calls for review into prescribing puberty blockers for children

[PandorasMailbox]

From today's Sunday Times.

"A warning over the health impacts of giving puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones to young people struggling with gender identity has prompted a call for a review of their use in Scotland.

The National Institute for Health and Care Excellence (Nice) said that existing studies of the drugs were small and “subject to bias and confounding”.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/a79b75dc-94ca-11eb-8d6e-90b9b6b1f793?shareToken=4f718a9a4682151a9d9bcdf92ec554d7&fbclid=IwAR2OM0M3eEc917XNf9GoEi1XnT1AMhA0GeYuPsSaXJdJHEsFOC3CStXcTJs

You’d honestly think that any organisation that cares about kids would want to make sure these drugs were withdrawn, unless and until it was confirmed that they could be prescribed safely.

So what does that say about organisations that are pushing for their use to be continued or even increased?

I can see them being banned for use in gender dysphoria eventually.

@EmpressWitchDoesntBurn

You’d honestly think that any organisation that cares about kids would want to make sure these drugs were withdrawn, unless and until it was confirmed that they could be prescribed safely.

So what does that say about organisations that are pushing for their use to be continued or even increased?

It says everything about them. I hold out the hope that in not too many years this scandal, which will dwarf other scandals, will conclude with people in jail.

Those pushing this medication appear to have a blind spot when it comes to all the recent warnings.

I wonder why that could be....?

Why has it taken this long for an organization to figure out something that is basic common sense?

I really hope someone in Scotland is paying attention to this. Found it absolutely shocking that the Bell judgement was ignored, here.

I bet nichola just points at this as more proof of our transphobia here in Scotland 🤬

Ah, I can't read the article.

I found it appalling that Scotland just ignored the findings of the Keira Bell case.

I found it appalling that Scotland just ignored the findings of the Keira Bell case.

Scotland and England have different legal systems. Are you also appalled that the US have ignored the findings of the Keira Bell case?

Scotland and England have different legal systems.

Yes, I'm aware of that, thank you.

Are you also appalled that the US have ignored the findings of the Keira Bell case?

I think when evidence comes to light in another country, it can be used to inform guidance elsewhere. For example, I believe Canada has changed its stance on the AZ vaccine based mainly on evidence from Germany (my understanding, anyway).

I would certainly expect the findings of the Keira Bell case to be used in evidence in a similar court case in the US. Common law countries will consider cases from other common law countries, even if they are not bound to follow the decisions.

But yes, I think it is entirely irresponsible of the Scottish clinics that are the equivalent of the Tavistock to ignore what came out of the Keira Bell case - i.e. that the evidence showing the safety and efficacy of puberty blockers is extremely weak and that the studies done to date leave a lot to be desired.

Scotland and England have different legal systems. Are you also appalled that the US have ignored the findings of the Keira Bell case?

There are differences in English and Scottish legal systems however the specific findings of the Judicial Review in Bell v Tavistock which are based in medical ethics and Child Protection legal frameworks cannot/ should not be ignored in Scotland. The responsibilities to protect children in Scotland are the same as in England and Wales.
NHS services in Scotland would be expected to follow closely a finding that concerned children and informed consent in the English High Court.
Core legislation such as the Children Act is in place across the UK.

Are you also appalled that the US have ignored the findings of the Keira Bell case?

The first motivation, when we're talking about children's health and the best way to treat children ethically, is always to keep the child's best interests at the forefront, surely? Which means it's not about winning or losing a legal case, but about looking for clinical evidence for best practise. Unless one is arguing on the basis of what supports a particular ideology, I suppose.

Are you also appalled that the US have ignored the findings of the Keira Bell case?

I saw commentary at the time that certainly suggested that other countries, including the US, would reconsider their policy in response to the Keira Bell judgement.

Scotland is particularly shocking because after the judgement in the Keira Bell case, it seems extremely likely that someone would bring a similar case in Scotland. And of course there is an overlap between the Scottish and English health systems, with health professionals trained in one country practising in the other, patients moving between countries etc.

That share token takes me to an arrival dates 23 March 2017, how odd

Aargh an article dated...

@PopperUppleton

That share token takes me to an arrival dates 23 March 2017, how odd

Someone's archived the article in the OP.

archive.ph/KcZ25

Are you also appalled that the US have ignored the findings of the Keira Bell case?

It's very common for courts to have regard to court decisions in other juridictions, for example see the very recent AB vs Tavistock case where the UK court in looking at puberty blockers and consent considered what had been decided in Australia:

The Australian cases
100. The Court's attention was directed to two Australian cases where the issue of the prescription of PBs to children has arisen. In Re Jamie [2013] Fam CAFC 110
101. However, in Re Kelvin [2017] CAFC 258
102. I place some weight on these Australian authorities because they were dealing with precisely the same treatment and the same legal issue

www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Fam/2021/741.html

Courts like to look at "home" decisions but when there isn't much "home" guidance they will look elsewhere if they can find other courts that have looked at the matters in question.

Ah thanks yourhair

@PandorasMailbox

Those pushing this medication appear to have a blind spot when it comes to all the recent warnings.

I wonder why that could be....?

They cannot say they didn't know. They know and they don't care, if anything they are pushing children towards this and vilifying anyone who objects.

They cannot say they didn't know. They know and they don't care,

I'm grateful to everyone archiving the proof of people/organisations doubling down. They'll no doubt try and blitz the proof of what they promoted from their social media when the shit really hits the fan, but the receipts are out there.

I'm grateful to everyone archiving the proof of people/organisations doubling down.

I'm not a KF visitor but from everything I hear the people who are to the forefront of it should (even commercially) offer a course on how to archive and authenticate all things digital as it's profoundly helpful.

They cannot say they didn't know. They know and they don't care, if anything they are pushing children towards this and vilifying anyone who objects.

This

counterweightsupport.com/2021/04/03/transin-the-suburbs/

'I never believed I would have a negative word to say about the transgender movement. I was born into a middle-class family of liberal Democrats. My grandparents emigrated from Europe in the 1920s to escape fascism. My father was a small business owner who lobbied for socialized medicine in the 80s due to his health issues. I was a nerdy science girl who loved the outdoors and earned a degree in environmental science in the 90s; my liberal roots run deep. I’ve been a fan of the Squad, have a Black Lives Matter flag flying in my front yard and a garden of native plants to support wildlife in my backyard. I was appalled at the bathroom bill business in North Carolina a few years ago. Of course, my thinking was that transwomen are women, transmen are men; who can that possibly hurt? (As it turns out, the answer is my family and me.)'

Really good piece, lionheart

Mirrors the experience of a kid in my extended circle. Bright, bookish, nerdy, no outward changes but 'a girl'.

Friends are of course completely on board and scorn the elderly dinosaurs; they have no idea how sexist they're being...

People are speaking out at least.