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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Observer campaign to tackle femicide.

33 replies

merrymouse · 07/03/2021 11:08

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/07/the-observer-view-we-can-no-longer-turn-away-femicide-must-be-tackled-now?CMP=fb_cif

www.theguardian.com/society/2021/mar/07/end-femicide-278-dead-the-hidden-scandal-of-older-women-killed-by-men

Just going to say there are people at the Observer doing some great work.

OP posts:
EmbarrassingAdmissions · 07/03/2021 11:21

Until three years ago, women of Ruth Williams’s age would not have been counted in the Crime Survey for England and Wales (CSEW). Then, it had a cap of 59 years, now it is 74, and is due to be raised next year, excluding institutions such as care homes and refuges; a hidden death toll.

“If you are found at the bottom of the stairs at 40, the police are probably going to ask questions,” says Bows, one of the few researchers working in the area. “Deeply entrenched ageism means that if you are 80, it’s, ‘Well, she probably fell.’

“When you look at police data on abuse, rape and murder, older women aren’t there. If a crime is looked at, at all, it’s treated as a safeguarding issue, gender neutral, ‘elder abuse’ with no perpetrator.

Accurate and horrific. It's why accuracy of sex is so important. This always makes me think of Joseph Cotten's chilling dialogue as Uncle Charlie in Shadow of a Doubt :

The cities are full of women, middle-aged widows, husbands, dead, husbands who've spent their lives making fortunes, working and working. And then they die and leave their money to their wives, their silly wives. And what do the wives do, these useless women? You see them in the hotels, the best hotels, every day by the thousands, drinking the money, eating the money, losing the money at bridge, playing all day and all night, smelling of money, proud of their jewelry but of nothing else, horrible, faded, fat, greedy women... Are they human or are they fat, wheezing animals, hmm? And what happens to animals when they get too fat and too old?

www.imdb.com/title/tt0036342/

334bu · 07/03/2021 12:32

Thank you for posting these articles

FrankButchersDickieBow · 07/03/2021 12:49

I just came on to see if this had already been posted. Very sad article, but so glad it is being brought up.

Eyesofdisarray · 07/03/2021 12:50

Absolutely shocking, but thanks for posting. I don't read the G.
Such tragic stories- one man 'walked free' ????
Those poor women

ViolaDaviesFanClub · 07/03/2021 12:51

So glad to see this campaign from the Observer. Karen Ingala and Nia do such great work.

The frightening thing is that we only count the official number of femicides - there are so many more that are not classed as murders or as femicides in official records.

Excellent podcast reportage (multi-media) about this from Tortoise, which I would recommend to everyone: www.tortoisemedia.com/audio/hidden-in-plain-sight/

Ereshkigalangcleg · 07/03/2021 12:55

This is a very good and utterly chilling article. An important campaign.

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 07/03/2021 13:44

I am sick with anger about this and that I didn't know about the age threshold.

I've often wondered why items that I recalled from the news didn't seem to turn up in official statistics. I've mentioned it a few times and been told that either I didn't remember correctly (I have a very unusual memory) or that the newspapers didn't print the correct details (feasible). But to discover there was an actual threshold that I didn't know about - I feel complicit to making these women invisible.

I have repeatedly asked about whether women are especially vulnerable in Elder Abuse and who does it - I feel that not only was I gaslighted but I allowed myself to be gaslighted when I knew that something had to be wrong. I should never have allowed myself to live with the implication that I was wrong about this.

merrymouse · 07/03/2021 13:54

The 59 cut off is very strange.

Madonna is only 62.

OP posts:
Lettera · 07/03/2021 14:15

I would second Viola's recommendation of this brilliant series of podcasts. They're about women their families believe were murdered but the police simply haven't bothered to investigate that possibility.

www.tortoisemedia.com/audio/hidden-in-plain-sight/

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 07/03/2021 14:16

Excellent podcast reportage (multi-media) about this from Tortoise, which I would recommend to everyone : www.tortoisemedia.com/audio/hidden-in-plain-sight/

I'm 'listening' to this (via PowerPoint subtitles so it might not always be accurate) but I've had to stop because of the waves of anger passing through me. I'll resume later. It's excellent but I'm sick and heartsick. Oh, Katie.

Hidinge · 07/03/2021 14:21

Shocked. As if only younger women suffer rape etc. As if there are men who actually can't see how dumb that idea is. I suppose it's an idea about when women stop being generally considered to be sexually attractive?

WendyTestaburger · 07/03/2021 14:58

@Hidinge

Shocked. As if only younger women suffer rape etc. As if there are men who actually can't see how dumb that idea is. I suppose it's an idea about when women stop being generally considered to be sexually attractive?
That's what I was thinking. Value depleted. So who cares. This is sickening.
EmbarrassingAdmissions · 07/03/2021 15:03

As if there are men who actually can't see how dumb that idea is. I suppose it's an idea about when women stop being generally considered to be sexually attractive?

There's a mortality and morbidity rate associated with the male gaze and perspective* being used to frame laws and even how we gather, report and use statistics. For me, this makes the importance of recording sex in the Census more important than ever.

*I'm not overlooking the internalised misogyny and frank ageism that is too often on display from other women when victim blaming or saying that somebody can't be surprised her DH had left her when she'd 'let herself go' etc. In some MN threads it sometimes feels as if somebody only has to be in her 50s for someone to ask if she's got early dementia.

stumbledin · 07/03/2021 19:29

Viola (as I have said on the other thread about this article) - I dont think the campaign has anything to do with nia. It is associated with Karen Ingala Smith because of the work she has done of the Femicide Census - although you may be aware that her "ownderhsip" of the project has led to some women complaining that their contribution has been erased.

Karen Ingala Smith may (still?) work at nia, but as has been said many times, nia is in fact Hackney Women's Aid and as such does much the same sort of work as most refuges, ie not compile stats for a census!

Sorry if this seems a niggle, but it is only right to be clear about the sources of something. And who does the work.

As it says in the article: "We are working in conjunction with Karen Ingala Smith and Clarrie O’Callaghan, creators of the unique Femicide Census."

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 07/03/2021 20:16

I deeply want to understand the reasoning behind omitting care homes and refuges from the data collection.

Abuse flourishes in a permissive environment - and whether there's no data collection or recognition, there's an atmosphere of impunity. Like for other crimes even when they're prosecuted there are 'off-the-shelf 'ready-to-go' defence packages that mostly end up with modified charges and sentences.

I would hope not but I am not comfortable with the reality that it's entirely possible that women have been abused and even killed in plain sight and we don't know about it. And we still won't know if it happens in care homes or refuges or beyond certain ages.

Mollyollydolly · 07/03/2021 20:23

I was a carer for my mum for years. I know how hard it is .. I used to wonder how many elderly people were abused by their carers. I loved my mum and know how close I was to the edge sometimes, it's frightening how many vulnerable elderly people are under the radar. On occasions when mum was in hospital (on geriatric wards) I was shocked by the callousness of some of the staff. Most were fantastic but there were definitely people working there who seemed completely lacking in compassion and empathy. I'm sure there's so much abuse that's just invisible. I dread being old and frail like my mum and having to rely on other people.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 07/03/2021 20:34

Abuse flourishes in a permissive environment - and whether there's no data collection or recognition, there's an atmosphere of impunity.

Completely agree.

UppityPuppity · 07/03/2021 21:15

If domestic abuse isn’t believed, if rapes aren’t prosecuted, if killing means a man may receive a few years in prison or even walk free, if a woman’s death in suspicious circumstances is not properly investigated, then these are crimes hidden in plain sight – in the name of justice, that has to stop,

This.

Well done The Observer.

All in society should be ashamed of itself - the killing of our Mothers, Sisters, Daughters - hidden in plain sight.

Almost at International Woman’s Day - where soon in some parts of this country where saying a ‘woman is an adult human female’ may soon be classed as hate speech.

Police, Judiciary, CPS, political parties - what the hell are you going to do to show you actually give a shit about women and stop this abuse against women because they are women?

Ninkanink · 07/03/2021 21:22

It is just too sad for words.

Igmum · 07/03/2021 21:38

Excellent campaign thanks for posting OP

LizzieSiddal · 07/03/2021 21:44

Thank you for posting. A great campaign and so very much needed.

WarriorN · 07/03/2021 21:45

Shocking and but so glad they're highlighting this. I had no idea.

SirVixofVixHall · 07/03/2021 22:58

59 !!! So post menopausal women.

CardinalLolzy · 08/03/2021 00:18

I was so glad to see this campaign launched today! How are people not constantly outraged at all this?

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 08/03/2021 00:30

There is a call to action outlined here with the specifics of the 3 things that need to happen:

If you want to join our campaign, write to or email your local MP and ask them to support our three calls to action.

www.tortoisemedia.com/2021/01/26/what-you-can-do/

There's also a good website: Advocacy After Fatal Domestic Abuse

www.aafda.org.uk/

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