White actress described as woman of colour

[Buttonitboris]

So white actress from South America referred to as woman of colour, and there you have it, first sex, now race. Nothing to do with the actress BTW.

www.indy100.com/news/anya-taylorjoy-golden-globes-b1810670?utm_content=Echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR0gO1xjlFhQ-a9WXi39-1jwIP2J09al9C0HJHvlDyfg7MP-cM2h8HTYD5I#Echobox=1614722049

Variety are really WEIRD for doing that. For the record, my DD looks the spitting image of this actor and she's the whitest, blondest kid in history.

Ridiculous.

Aren't we all of African descent, aren't we all 'women of colour' (whatever that means)?
What does sex mean, what does race mean anymore!

I think it's far more complex when people 'ethnically identify' differently to how observers would categorise them because race has less biological basis compared to sex. Ethnicity is also not just about your genetics it's also about your cultural background. If you're brought up by black adoptive parents, grew up with black culture but have white skin then I can see why you'd identify as black (or at least African or Carribbean heritage). Likewise if you're Asian but were sent to a very white boarding school from the age of 5 and then onto Oxbridge then you may not consider 'Asian' as featuring as part of your ethnicity at all. There are also many people who don't look like their ethnicity - they look paler or more tanned than you would 'expect' given their parentage and therefore oberservers categorisations can be wildly off. The key question is whether these instances impact a disadvantaged and less privileged minority in the same way as appropriation might if the person truly identifies in a way that might be surprising.

What were they thinking?

@Munkeenut

I think it's far more complex when people 'ethnically identify' differently to how observers would categorise them because race has less biological basis compared to sex. Ethnicity is also not just about your genetics it's also about your cultural background. If you're brought up by black adoptive parents, grew up with black culture but have white skin then I can see why you'd identify as black (or at least African or Carribbean heritage). Likewise if you're Asian but were sent to a very white boarding school from the age of 5 and then onto Oxbridge then you may not consider 'Asian' as featuring as part of your ethnicity at all. There are also many people who don't look like their ethnicity - they look paler or more tanned than you would 'expect' given their parentage and therefore oberservers categorisations can be wildly off. The key question is whether these instances impact a disadvantaged and less privileged minority in the same way as appropriation might if the person truly identifies in a way that might be surprising.

Doesn't matter if you went to a 'white' boarding school and then to Oxbridge (which, by the way, is not 'white'), the world will guarantee to remind you weekly if not daily of your skin colour...

But yes, this is an illustration of how difficult it is to define people by ethnicity.

This seems to be caused by confusion about the very diverse population of ‘Latin’ America. I suppose in America they are lumped together because there is specific prejudice against Spanish speakers who have emigrated from the South American continent. However, that is a lot of people to lump together!

Is this not a result of the face that she identifies as Latina, and in the USA people of Latina origin are considered to be non-White? I had a discussion about this with my Jamaican DP recently when he mentioned a (white) South American person we know as not being white. I responded with but of course they are white and he was insistant that that person, and other South Americans and Spanish people aren't white, because they are Latino.

Sorry meant to say in the USA and some other countries

Is this not a result of the face that she identifies as Latina, and in the USA people of Latina origin are considered to be non-White?

That's my understanding.

There's a wide believe you can't be latino & white.

Antonia Bandaras has been referred to as a POC or a Latino despite being Spanish.

@fronz

There's a wide believe you can't be latino & white.

This isn't correct though. It's actually very common in Argentina.

I know that

I'm talking about from a US perspective

People really should just stop obsessing about race and skin colour and identity, speak in plain language and boycott this identity politics BS.

I remember the POC label with Antonio Banderas. We think of Europeans as mostly white, but I agree with fronz as far as I can tell, many US people of Latino heritage seem to see their culture as POC rather than white, even if pale skinned. Skin colour is not always a reliable marker of your background.
One of the whitest, blondest people I know has a Jamaican grandfather. You would not know that looking at her.

I find the US approach to race & ethnicity quite confusing.

Yes a person from Latin America with 100% white European heritage would be consider non-White in the US. Another reason why importing US race politics to the UK makes no sense. I saw an advert recently for a job in Hackney which welcomed 'indigenous' applicants. Indigenous to where?!?! I'm guessing they didn't mean white working class Londoners.

This is so strange. I may be ruffling some feathers here, but why do they have to broadcast people's race? Surely it's enough that a range of races/genders etc are A. Nominated and B. Win. I understand they are trying to make it public to show they are 'making changes' but I would just be irritated if I were used as, essentially, a PR stunt for them to get a gold star for being inclusive. Can they not just be inclusive and leave it at that? Happy be educated of course, would be interesting to hear others views.

My concern is that if we think she is the 'first woman of colour to win...' it hides the fact that women of significant colour, e.g. very black, are disadvantaged in these awards. How others see - and stereotype you - is very important and very damaging. We subject people to racism largely based on the assumptions we make about them and most people will be assuming she is very, very white. It's making a bigger barrier for people of black african descent for example.

Is this just lazy journalism? That they assumed she was a woman of colour because she is Argentinian.

That post about the Hackney job ad is hilarious and absurd in equal measures.

This came up with the Hilaria Banderas thing. She was revealed to be pretending to be Spanish and issued a mea culpa where she confessed to being ‘a white girl’. A thread on here opened my eyes to the fact that in America all Spanish speakers are considered non-white.

A US poster of Mexican origin explained that on her birth certificate issued over 50 years ago her race is described at white, but that wouldn’t be the case now.

Hilaria Baldwin that should say

Ascribing BAME status can be very subjective. Just as discrimination is imposed upon people because of others' prejudices, BAME status can be assumed by them because of the imposers' prejudices.

I'm Jewish. I have been told that this makes me BAME. It's a minority view, but both Jews and non-Jews have told me this.

My people may have come from the Middle East many generations ago, and again more recently, but I'm not convinced that makes me BAME.

My people have certainly suffered severe discrimination, and in many cases still do, but it's not the same. Accepting the label BAME feels appropriative of someone else's struggle. I would rather stand side by side with people than merge us all into one falsely equivalent group.

@merrymouse

This seems to be caused by confusion about the very diverse population of ‘Latin’ America. I suppose in America they are lumped together because there is specific prejudice against Spanish speakers who have emigrated from the South American continent. However, that is a lot of people to lump together!

Agreed.

This is the key.

I am never sure what people actually mean when they say Latino/Latina.

I ever use it on its own. I use the full 'Latin American' to refer to nationality - anyone from Central and South America who is a speaker of Spanish or Portuguese. Not associated with race.

Latin America must be the one the most racially diverse places of all.