Getting our girls off the internet

[Wandawomble]

Difficult night and we just found some very very dodger stuff on 8yr old stepdaughters phone. LGBTQ groups, Depression groups.
She’s been playing roblox and has all these invites along with some very odd messaging.
I’ve been saying for two years she is too young to have a phone but her actual parents weren’t listening. Finally I think the penny has dropped.

But generally adults need to be better at saying no to kids and getting them off the internet. I propose a thread on tactics to do this. Too many girls are going to be harmed by this current trend.

I know of a sad story where a single mum wouldn't restrict internet access for her child because she thought it was unfair. She herself spends up to 10 hours a day on her phone and would hate to be without it, so she thought it would be unkind to limit her then 14 year old's access. The kid was groomed online for sex by a 40 year old man and ended up suicidal in spite of support and input from police, social workers and NSPCC. Still struggles now four years later and will probably always be fragile. And she still doesn't restrict internet access.

I’m a safeguarding lead in a primary school and there is absolutely no way my children will have access to any social media until they are mid teens. I have had personal experience of some awful things through my job and the risks are too high.

My oldest DS is in Year 2 and the majority of his friends have iPads that they use unsupervised. They have WhatsApp and HouseParty and who knows what else. When he asked for one I explained why not in an age appropriate way. We have a Switch that he plays as we have never enabled the WiFi on it. I am fully prepared for some major resistance from him as he gets older but this is something I will hold the line on.

Those on this thread who are making their plans now for their babies and very young children will be in a much better position than the parents for whom smart phones and social media were new to them at the same time as their children were getting smart phones.

I hope so, Daisies. What worries me is what other new technology might be here in 2031 when my child is 10 (assuming this pregnancy goes to plan). I do feel that parents are more aware of the issues now than they were 10 years ago.

My parents had it so easy. I just wasn't allowed a TV in my bedroom and I thought I had a hard life.

I was very anti social media until lockdown when I realised that that would isolate them from their friends so I allowed WhatsApp (13/14 years old).

There is always the option to have a phone that's not a smartphone, for contact and safety etc.

iphones are quite useful, though, in that they have a tracker, so you can see where they are!

Part of the trouble is that kids who are growing up with this tech know more about it than I do. My child (11) already has a strategy for dealing with tracking cookies, refuses to have his picture on f/b, and has blocked the possibility to allow strangers to chat to him in-game.

I trust him and know that he is fairly sensible, and we discuss these things every so often. He doesn't use a website or app without asking first.

As with so many things, I think focussing on the relationship and maintaining trust is the most important thing.

I just don't understand why parents think it's okay for children in primary and lower secondary to have unsupervised access to internet or social media.

Is it because they are unaware?
Is it because they are online a lot themselves?
Or do they feel "mean"?
Or don't they care?
Is it just easier to let them get on with it and hope for the best?

What I meant to say was if you are letting children that young to have online access (which I don't think should happen) why aren't you at least supervising it?

To be fair, it's not just parents! I've had a hell of a time trying to stop the school from getting the kids to make films for a facebook page that is open to the world, putting up tiktok vids, etc. I send them stuff on internet safeguarding every so often, but they seem to not to give a fuck be more concerned with good publicity for the school than considerate of privacy/safeguarding.

@ArabellaScott

There is always the option to have a phone that's not a smartphone, for contact and safety etc.

iphones are quite useful, though, in that they have a tracker, so you can see where they are!

Part of the trouble is that kids who are growing up with this tech know more about it than I do. My child (11) already has a strategy for dealing with tracking cookies, refuses to have his picture on f/b, and has blocked the possibility to allow strangers to chat to him in-game.

I trust him and know that he is fairly sensible, and we discuss these things every so often. He doesn't use a website or app without asking first.

As with so many things, I think focussing on the relationship and maintaining trust is the most important thing.

Yes. That line of communication is so important. DC here very sensible but that's because we have discussed it thoroughly and we continue to discuss it. Our expectations are very clear. DS even came out of his year WhatsApp group during lockdown because he said it was too toxic! He has no other social media interest.

I'm also a SGL and I work in a primary school (though not the lead there). My DC are 9 and 7 and they have Kindle Fires as I can lock them right down. I can monitor exactly what they've been using on their via parental dashboard on my phone.

The do use Roblox and think I'm terribly mean as I have that set to restricted too. That means no chat at all and no access to games for over 13s. They are always sat in communal rooms too. I've also told them that they are not allowed to accept friend requests other than ones I have pre-approved (only the boy next door and their cousin). Any flouting of this rule will result in it being taken away.
Which is why at the moment DS1 does not have access to it and DS2 does.

We have said that they can have a phone for secondary, for communication purposes only and it won't be a smart phone.

My dd has an IPOD and it’s controlled to within an inch of its life. She cannot download any apps without my permission, she cannot use safari unless it’s on the list of approved websites.

She has a FB account so she can FB messenger her friends, but she has no idea she has a FB account only the messenger. Her friend’s list is limited to family and pre-approved contacts whose parents I know really well and on the same page with this.

First thing one of her friends asked her was, “what is your Roblox name?” This is so they can message and play games online. The problem is I don’t think some of those games are suitable and it’s a magnet for kiddyfiddlers. I was on yahoo chat rooms unsupervised in the late 90s as a pre-teen. I know what creeps are out there. I also spent many, many hours of an evening lost to Age of Empires, SIMS etc and no my children will not be getting games consoles either. They have fire tablets and can amuse themselves for an hour or two on them but no way am I jeopardising their education by allowing fortnite, mincraft etc to take over. These games are more addictive than 20+ years ago. It’s a slippery slope and not worth it.

So far none have asked for any games consoles so hopefully avoided but the moment they do they will hear the immortal words, “you can buy what you like when you have a job and live under your own roof.”

I maybe accused of being the worst mother ever, but ultimately I am their parents and not their best friend. We have to make difficult choices to keep our children safe, and until the internet becomes a safer place for children I’d rather not risk exposing them to something awful.

I have to say lockdown has forced a lot of my peers to cave in and let the kids use FB messenger. It was getting annoying them borrowing our phones to do this. And it felt especially cruel to ban independent communication as they cannot socialise any other way.

Thats very wierd stuff to be on an 8 year olds device, very weird... did she seek that out or did they seek her out?
my 9 year old doesn't have a phone, my 12 year old does,because he makes journeys alone. hes sensible with his phone so ive had no issues, my 9 year old plays console games with shareplay with his his brother and his brothers mates, i know them all ok, kids, so.... ive no massive worries tbh.
Id rather teach safe navigation than fear mongering and so far its working for us...,
i agree that children browsing aimlessly around the net is dangerous, leaves them vulnerable.

@WarOnWomen

I just don't understand why parents think it's okay for children in primary and lower secondary to have unsupervised access to internet or social media.

Is it because they are unaware?
Is it because they are online a lot themselves?
Or do they feel "mean"?
Or don't they care?
Is it just easier to let them get on with it and hope for the best?

Easier to give in, tbh. Everyone else has a smartphone, everyone communicates by smartphone. Far harder to say no and follow that through.

@ArabellaScott

To be fair, it's not just parents! I've had a hell of a time trying to stop the school from getting the kids to make films for a facebook page that is open to the world, putting up tiktok vids, etc. I send them stuff on internet safeguarding every so often, but they seem to not to give a fuck be more concerned with good publicity for the school than considerate of privacy/safeguarding.

And this! Secondary expects they will all have smartphones (they use them in lessons to acces things the teachers direct them to!) And primary constantly wanting to photograph children excelling at different things for Twitter, FB, other SM

Last year my DD was in a school assembly with years 4,5 and 6.
They were asked who didn't have a phone. She said less than 10 (including her) out of about 180 8-11 year olds put their hands up.
I find that incredibly sad.
She has a tablet to chat with friends that is connected to my phone. No social media accounts. Lockdown is hard as it's her only means of communication with them but at least I know who she's talking to.

No tech in rooms overnight will also continue through teens.

No tech in rooms overnight will also continue through teens.

Nobody should have tech in rooms overnight!

I won't say anything about the fire risk because I know you all know about chargers and fire risks.

I have 2 children in KS2 who have virtually no screen time besides TV. They've not got any personal devices and no unsupervised time on the internet. Lockdown changed things slightly here as they've had to use online learning platforms, participate in zoom and teams etc and have really missed their friends. They have the use of a really old spare iPhone 4s of dh's as many friends also have imessage/facetime and they have dabbled but tbh it hasn't taken off.

I have no idea what I'm going to do when they go up to high school as they will be using public transport and so must have a ihone. I'm going to look into it carefully and give them the minimum device I can.

I have seen first hand the damage that can be done by SM apps - girls comparing self harm on Instagram etc and do not want that for my young children.

So far it's not been particularly hard to have this take on things. They are not in anyway left out of things and many of their friends have v limited access too, which makes things easier. I'm v worried as to how that might change when they start high school though.

@Wandawomble
Read to her and get her interested in that.
It will be a long walk to do.

Parental controls don’t work on iPhone 4 so annoyingly you’ll have to upgrade to get that. The same with Apple arcade which I prefer for games as there are no adverts. Some of those on the free games are totally inappropriate for children to see imo.

Parental controls on iPhones stop working automatically when the child turns 17. So it is important to put the right date of birth in when you set up Apple family. I know of some clever clogs young teens who managed to set their age at 17 before their parents knew anything about it!

Thats very wierd stuff to be on an 8 year olds device, very weird... did she seek that out or did they seek her out?

This - at the age of 8, how would she even know where to look up groups like that on the internet, where would she have got the idea from in the first place?

Non-smartphones are the way to get around if they need to call you when out. Often called dumbphones or brick phones, there's lists of modern ones without internet access. Or find an old one in a drawer.

Headmist of one of the highest performing comprehensive schools in the UK Katharine Birbalsingh says parents “don’t understand how dangerous smartphones are”, and they “shouldn’t be given to children at all” until they are at least 16.
“If a 13-year-old boy has a smartphone I can you guarantee you – guarantee you – he is watching video porn,” she said.

inews.co.uk/news/education/dangerous-smartphones-banned-schools-cigarettes-alcohol-health-warning-372141

indeed @Mockolate if you said anything like that to my 9 year old he'd have no
clue,

*headmistress.

She has a blog with a list of reasons to not give kids smartphones tomisswithloveblog.wordpress.com/. It's aimed at teachers but a lot of it would be useful for convincing parents.

"Explain to parents the concept that their kid isn’t exceptional. They aren’t going to be able to ignore the groomers, the sexy boy or girl who leads them astray, met on Instagram. When given the choice between homework and Fortnight, 95% of kids will choose the latter."

Last year my DD was in a school assembly with years 4,5 and 6
They were asked who didn't have a phone. She said less than 10 (including her) out of about 180 8-11 year olds put their hands up
I find that incredibly sad.

I would be pissed off with the school for asking them about it in such a public way. Fine to ask but ask the parents or ask the kids individually if schools need to know. Seems unfair to do it that way at ages when kids will usually want to have whatever the other kids have.