Scottish Doctor in Shock Safeguarding Win! Murderer not having free surgery

[gardenbird48]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/9596eeda-5e82-11eb-86a3-5d0f1154a22e?shareToken=b12227698e7bb455fef59c6c764fab74

I was relieved to see that a doctor actually considered the impact on his other patients of having a violent murderer on the ward with them and has decided that the risk assessment shows that it is not appropriate to continue.

There could be an eye on the bottom line, he is part of a private practice and that one patient could be a problem for all the other patients so the impact on the cash flow could be significant.

Interestingly, the patient has been 'living as a woman' for more than two years (they don't specify how they have achieved that) but blames their crimes (horrendous murder) on the fact that they are a woman trapped in a man's body. They seem to have had a terrible childhood, for which I have every sympathy, but I think they are misguided in blaming it on their transness.

I wondered if I’d have been a different person if I’d been a woman.

Well, yes, it's statistically rather unlikely for a woman to be a violent murderer.

Excellent decision making by the surgeon although as suggested it's one made with an eye on the bottom line.

The person seeking the surgery shows the level of consideration for others that we've come to expect from individuals in this position.

The surgeon obviously understands that the vast, vast majority of people do not buy into this woke bollocks. People can't change sex, and the surgeon knows that should he bow to this nonsense, then the public would rightly judge him for it.

One of the comments: 'This article doesn't mention that Green was previously held in the women's estate but moved after "inappropriate" incidents which included sex with other inmates'

It is always down to cash or votes. If you thought altruism was high on anyone's list best put your sceptics hat on. In my book though, a win is a win, sunlight is sunlight

There was a comment on Twitter that suggested Green had only claimed to want surgery shortly after conviction and had been avoiding it since.

Why would the surgeon agree to go to discuss the surgery if he had no intention of carrying it out?

Articles on Ms Green

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2494991/Murderer-born-man-sentenced-life-womens-prison-arranging-sex-change-taxpayers-money.html?ico=news%5Eheadlines

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2525441/Transgender-murderer-Paris-Green-moved-womens-prison-sex-inmates.html

They seem to have had a terrible childhood, for which I have every sympathy, but I think they are misguided in blaming it on their transness.

A retired social worker I know argues from their long professional experience that a lot of mental ill-health stems from childhood abuse or trauma.

The thoughtful contributions from psychotherapists and psychiatrists to the webinar on Saturday (23Jan) on the recent issues around the Tavistock ("Do Not Adjust your Set" - it's discussed in a thread in here) also suggest that transness is usually a symptom of much deeper health struggles (mental and physical).

I’m glad the clinic patients are protected from this murderer, now known as Paris Green. Too bad about the inmates of the women’s prison where Green was originally held, until ‘incidents’ caused PG to be moved in with the men.

I’m not asking anyone to care about me, but I’d had a really awful childhood, and I was totally messed up. I was beaten with a belt for ridiculous things. I spent time in care, I never had any stability and because I’m dyslexic people treated me like I was stupid. I was already walking around carrying a lot of anger inside me before I realised I should have been a woman

A person with a traumatic childhood who has committed a serious crime.

And a person with a traumatic childhood who realised they should have been a woman.

This person's trauma is what needs treating if they are to be rehabilitated.

Oh, and obviously keep prisons single-sex.

Well done that doctor.

Wonder what surgery it was? Orchiectomy and penile inversion (or what most members of the public think of as "sex change surgery")? Or a boob job and facial remodelling?

Given Greene's past history (sexually assaulting women prisoners when the authorities were stupid enough to put Green in a women's prison), I don't think it would be a stretch to hypothesise that Green is unlikely to want to part company with Green's penis, given Green's well-documented proclivities.

This person's trauma is what needs treating if they are to be rehabilitated.

this is it - the trans seems to be a symptom (and appears to be so for many people, especially the young). Coincidentally Paris Lees said they had a difficult childhood that resulted in them having sex in public toilets (I presume Paris meant with men) at age 14.

Meaningful (exploratory, non-affirmative) psychological support needs to be sought before hormones and surgery imo.

@ArabellaScott

One of the comments: 'This article doesn't mention that Green was previously held in the women's estate but moved after "inappropriate" incidents which included sex with other inmates'

A person using their penis for sex is not 'living as a woman'.

(I'm assuming I'd be deleted for using correctly sexed pronouns in that sentence.)

Good, let's hope more doctors follow suit. When will prison authorities learn though, FFS! If you're a woman who commits a crime and goes to prison, you should have the right to NOT be attacked by men.

I am relieved to hear this as I thought the surgery had already happened.

A person using their penis for sex is not 'living as a woman'.

Can we extend that to include people making threats that involve said body part? It might narrow things down a bit.

@CaraDuneRedux

Well done that doctor.

Wonder what surgery it was? Orchiectomy and penile inversion (or what most members of the public think of as "sex change surgery")? Or a boob job and facial remodelling?

Given Greene's past history (sexually assaulting women prisoners when the authorities were stupid enough to put Green in a women's prison), I don't think it would be a stretch to hypothesise that Green is unlikely to want to part company with Green's penis, given Green's well-documented proclivities.

Do prisoners get boob jobs and facial remodelling? I would hope not.

OTOH the idea that we are castrating highly disturbed men in prison and calling them 'women' in the name of progress is sickening.
And I wish they would stop using that idiotic phrase live as a woman. What does it actually mean? Given that it's part of the criteria for 'gender reassignment', there has to be a definition.

If I read it correctly, the gender clinic was in Brighton? The surgeon was unhappy with other patients being in close proximity to a convicted murderer and presumably all the security, prison guards etc that would accompany PG.
The costs of this must have been immense - if you factor in all the consultations, hours of work just to set this up, let alone the medical / support costs. Must run in to hundreds of thousands of ££ .Presumably the NHS in Brighton and the Scottish prison service are all awash with funding if this is a priority for them

There must be someone in MN who knows alternative and cheap methods to stop oneself having unfortunate sexual wishes (or highly violent wishes) to assault women or children (or other men).
Hormone implants would presumably work? How extensive and expensive is the surgery needed to remove the testosterone and sperm making parts of anatomy? And the same question about reducing the rape weapon to an inch or whatever is required merely for urination?

@InflagranteDelicto

Excellent decision making by the surgeon although as suggested it's one made with an eye on the bottom line. The person seeking the surgery shows the level of consideration for others that we've come to expect from individuals in this position.

That this surgeon might have thought it would damage his earning capacity / the clinic's reputation is an interesting one though.

So much of the US experience seems to involve surgeons /clinics who view this as a growing income stream. If this UK surgeon - in ultra-woke Brighton! - saw it as quite the opposite, then I'm taking that as a hopeful sign.

persistent previously the Telegraph quoted the cost being £80k.

@20mum

There must be someone in MN who knows alternative and cheap methods to stop oneself having unfortunate sexual wishes (or highly violent wishes) to assault women or children (or other men). Hormone implants would presumably work? How extensive and expensive is the surgery needed to remove the testosterone and sperm making parts of anatomy? And the same question about reducing the rape weapon to an inch or whatever is required merely for urination?

There have been voluntary experiments in the UK with 'puberty blockers' for sex offenders but the side effects are significant. Breast growth being one of the milder ones.

It doesn't work like that 20mum.

Rapists are often driven by psychopathic urges to inflict cruelty rather than by sexual urges. I believe previous studies have shown that rapists subject to "chemical castration" (which renders them unable to get an erection) don't stop committing sexual assault - in the absence of a functioning penis they commit assault by penetration with objects instead.

Incidentally the "chemicals" typically used as chemical castration are cross sex hormones, so it's highly unlikely that cross sex hormones would magically fix a violent sex offender - he'd just find other ways of committing sex offences.

And I wish they would stop using that idiotic phrase live as a woman. What does it actually mean? Given that it's part of the criteria for 'gender reassignment', there has to be a definition.

Last year a transman, who I think had a GRC, did a helpful “Ask me anything” thread on Mumsnet. I asked what did “living as a man” mean, apart from changing name and wearing traditionally other-sex clothes? Transman said that was pretty much it, really. Transman was friendly and polite, so I was too.

But presumably, all you women called Chris or Sam or Jo who (like me) live in jeans and flat boots — you could get a Gender recognition Certificate tomorrow and change your birth certificate to male.

garden We should send this article to the Devon Partnership NHS Trust.
The question to ask is why other patients are only considered in private healthcare.
Women using the NHS deserve the same consideration.
Instead, the Devon Partnership Trust has a current policy of placing male sex offenders on female wards.