The ACLU strikes a blow for sex based rights <eyeroll>

[Thelnebriati]

They aren't pressing for 'sex' to be defined in law, or for women to be drafted, or for the end of the draft but they do think that saying that only men should be drafted is sex discrimination.

''Ending sex-based registration would be a significant advancement in equal protection law for men, women, and LGBTQ people.''
www.aclu.org/cases/national-coalition-men-et-al-v-selective-service-system-et-al

Its ok though! Its for our own good.

''The requirement that only men — but not women — register for the draft is one of the last examples of overt sex discrimination written into our federal law.''

''Representing an organization called the “National Coalition For Men” may seem like an unlikely way to advance women’s rights, and to be clear, the ACLU firmly opposes some of NCFM’s positions and activities. In this case, however, we share the common goal of ending an antiquated federal law that harms both men and women. ''

www.aclu.org/news/womens-rights/requiring-men-but-not-women-to-register-for-the-draft-is-sex-discrimination/

An ACLU representative recently responded with ‘twaw and tgag’ when asked if they would find it acceptable in say, 20 yrs time that a female sports team could be made up of all male bodied trans people so it is inter that they now think that sex matters in this very specific area.

Rape and sexual abuse are a known problem in the US military. Shouldn't that be tackled before you apply the draft to women?

Female Soldiers Died of Dehydration Rather Than Risk Sexual Assault
www.digitaljournal.com/article/145378

'''The women asked to be here, so now let them take what comes with the territory''
www.salon.com/2006/01/30/karpinski_2/

'' Morgan Robinson killed herself after being gang-raped by colleagues''
nypost.com/2020/11/18/soldier-killed-herself-after-being-gang-raped-by-colleagues-mom/

The ACLU are such a massive embarrassment to their legacy.

And so very hypocritical.

Chase (formerly Kate) Strangio has been allowed to relentlessly promote their own personal politics over the ACLU's original intended purpose, including calling for books they don't agree with to be BURNED.

The ACLU used to defend people against the likes of Strangio. Now they stand for special interest groups. Until management grow a pair (or have some surgically made? ) the ACLU has zero credibility anymore.

Israel drafts women and I think that is generally not a problem

How likely is America to have a draft, anyway?

They'll need to be realistic. If the country is under such serious threat that they need a draft, would drafting women help?

Utter rubbish, by their own logic.

If only men are drafted then by their own beliefs this is a mixed sex group who have chosen to be in that group.

There is another mixed sex group they could choose to be in if they wanted to.

Either sex exists and matters or it doesn't. Make your mind up.

And I feel it important to know just what percentage of frost gendered or Goliath gendered people are drafted in comparison to those who identify as men and women? Has anyone gone through the list of genders and done this properly to check on the equalities of all this?

Id be happy with females being up for the draft when we have 50% political representation and of course half of military and industry leadership are women too. From a country that has never even had a female president they have a cheek. Just one more way for men to murder us.

The ACLU ditched women's rights way before the crowd. Now they have to (effectively) support conscription to keep their woke lead. What will their next trick be?
[Settles down with popcorn.]

Watched “A question of sex “ about Ruth Bader Ginsberg. The ACLU fully involved in first cases around discrimination on basis of gender . No 1 was about a male carer not getting tax deductions. The case was taken on basis of gender, because “ you know how men are around the word Sex. Fascinating . I didn’t the think that ACLU came out of it well.

I think both men and women should sign up for draft in US. It is not likely to be used, as the military is currently well staffed with volunteers. But other countries do draft both men and women if needed.
As for sexual assault, yes it should be tackled but since women can voluntarily join the military already, it seems a bit silly to only care about conscripts but not recruits.

@WellIWasInTheNeighbourhoo

Id be happy with females being up for the draft when we have 50% political representation and of course half of military and industry leadership are women too. From a country that has never even had a female president they have a cheek. Just one more way for men to murder us.

But apparently it was ok for minority men to be drafted despite ethnicity gaps in political, military and industrial leadership? It doesn’t work like that. If you want half the power, you have to be willing to shoulder the same responsibilities.

If you want half the power, you have to be willing to shoulder the same responsibilities.

Pardon?

Women didn't opt out of serving in wars, it was a decision made by men who informed women of their executive decision. It's not something women have ever been consulted about, or that the male sex considered that females should have a voice in. Female service personnel world wide have fought for decades to be allowed to do more than typing. That 'shoulder the same responsibilities' bit sounds a bit paternalistic to say the least. Females could well point out many responsibilities that males have never shouldered at all.

And the point is: if you go with identitarianism a la Biden, men is a mixed sex group, and anyone not wanting to be a man and perform manly stereotypes and roles has other opportunities.

Or alternatively, it has to be admitted that sex exists, everyone knows it and it can be used when it's convenient to male agenda. Which makes it very difficult to explain why people of the female sex can't name themselves or group themselves by sex.

Other than that it inconveniences the male sex, who have the power to make decisions and inform the female sex of their executive decision, while not consulting them or seeing them as having any voice or stake in the matter.

Which would make it overt and appalling sexist behaviour on the part of males. Which is kind of getting to the definition of male supremacism.

You see @MichelleofzeResistance I’m not interested in dragging in the trans debate on a simple question regarding whether women (sex) should be subject to the same national service requirements as men (sex). Frankly, equality means the same rights and responsibilities. Minority men, as soon as they got the vote were subject to the draft. And there was and still is an ethnicity gap in pay, wealth, income, education, and in political, industrial and military leadership. But the gap between men of different ethnicities is less than the gap between the sexes. Why is this? Because with taking on the responsibility of the draft, they then had the combat/military service qualifications and experience that then meant they could climb the ladder of military, political and industrial leadership. Look at the how many politicians and CEOs of 500 fortune firms are veterans....it’ll be a higher number than you think. In addition, most Presidents were also veterans/generals, starting with George Washington.

So it’s just a silly excuse to my mind to say that women should refuse the responsibilities that come with equality due to the existence of a sex gap in any of these things. Because it is by taking on the responsibilities that we are better able to narrow that gap. If black men, Asian men, and Hispanic men did it, then so can women.

Women didn't opt out of serving in wars, it was a decision made by men who informed women of their executive decision. It's not something women have ever been consulted about, or that the male sex considered that females should have a voice in

How far back are you going and is this just US centric? Because currently this isn’t true of many other countries or time periods in history.

For example Norway and Sweden have mandatory military service for men and women and FAR score higher than the US for equality between the sexes. In fact Norway is #2 globally and Sweden is #4.

www.weforum.org/reports/gender-gap-2020-report-100-years-pay-equality

Here in France, women have to register for our draft as well as men, and Macron put in place compulsory national service for all men and women. Too, we have the highest % of women on company boards in the world at 43.4%.

Are you missing the point about the specific situation in the US regarding sexual assaults in the military? Women are not trying to evade military service, the women who are in service are more at risk from their colleagues than from the enemy.

Why isn't the ACLU fighting for the women in service who are being sexually assaulted, raped, or dying of dehydration before they tackle the issue of sex discrimination?

Why isn't the ACLU fighting for the women in service who are being sexually assaulted, raped, or dying of dehydration before they tackle the issue of sex discrimination?

Exactly. Chase Strangio's internalised misogyny is a wild ride being played out in public.

@Thelnebriati

Are you missing the point about the specific situation in the US regarding sexual assaults in the military? Women are not trying to evade military service, the women who are in service are more at risk from their colleagues than from the enemy.

Why isn't the ACLU fighting for the women in service who are being sexually assaulted, raped, or dying of dehydration before they tackle the issue of sex discrimination?

More at risk from colleagues than the enemy? No, that is not true in the slightest. Pure exaggeration on your part.

I didn’t miss the point, I do think sexual assault should be tackled and it needs to be done now because recruits are the ones suffering. However, it is worth noting that sexual assault is at an unusual high point in US military right now. For decades it was lower than the incidence in the general population by age group. They are being fought for now. And because women can volunteer for the military, there is no reason why sexual assault should be a barrier to adding women to the draft.

I just think worrying about how a future conscript in the event of a possible WWIII might be treated is not a valid point. If that ever happens, then surely we’d see how sexual assault in the military is then? And then adjust what the women are called up to do accordingly. As in if sexual assault is high in combat roles, then put women in support roles. Much like the U.K. did in WWII.

@PlanDeRaccordement

Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez, former senior U.S. military commander in Iraq, ordered that the cause of death for some female soldiers who served in Iraq be covered up.
'''The women asked to be here, so now let them take what comes with the territory''

Does it look like women are welcome in the military to you? How dare you suggest women are trying to evade their responsibilities.

@Thelnebriati
3 soldiers dying of dehydration in a desert war does “come with the territory”. In fact, more aid workers (94) died in the Iraq War than US female military members (52). Compare that to over 4,300 male US military.

Yes, if you vote for women to not be included in draft, you ARE voting to evade your responsibility as an adult citizen of a nation during wartime conditions. You are literally asking to be infantilised.

You can get sexually assaulted at home, so to expect going to war to be perfectly safe from sexual assault as a condition of defending your nation is simply baffling.

That's certainly one view.

And going back to the OP: the issue under discussion is the confused double think of the ACLU in sex does not exist but it does sometimes when there's a point relevant to us.

If there was a draft announced tomorrow in the US, would Chase, being a man, fulfil his legal requirements and turn up to the nearest draft office, or would chase look for any potential legal loophole to avoid being sent to war? Or would Chase act as a pioneer to demonstrate that those of Chase’s sex are just as able to be forcibly sent to a war they may not agree with just like males?