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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Change in focus in equality policy...

141 replies

RedToothBrush · 16/12/2020 23:20

Lucy Fisher @LOS_Fisher
EXCL: Gvt has focused too heavily on “fashionable” race, sexuality & gender issues at expense of poverty & geographical disparities, Liz Truss will say tomo.

Overhaul of equalities policy will see pivot away from quotas, targets, unconscious bias training & diversity statements

In major policy reset speech, Truss will hit out at “identity politics, loud lobby groups & the idea of lived experience” in debate about a fairer society.

She will unveil new approach to equalities based on “freedom, choice, opportunity, & individual humanity & dignity”.

New equalities policy will seek to dovetail with PM’s “levelling up” agenda

Gvt will:
• look to move Equalities Hub from capital to the North
• launch equalities data project
• move Social Mobility Commission into Government Equalities Office

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/12/16/pivot-fashionable-race-sexuality-gender-issues-focus-poverty/
Pivot from 'fashionable' race, sexuality and gender issues to focus on poverty in equalities overhaul
Liz Truss hit out at identity politics and unconscious bias training, saying her policy reset will instead look at geographic disparities

Trying to think about down sides to this. Focusing on poverty is a key thing for women and the BAME community anyway.

It strikes me as occupying a space that Labour should be, given their roots and history.

This is definitely culture war related, but its also a sensible move, because it is an approach that is needed in many respects.

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Redburnett · 17/12/2020 09:34

In recent years the Tories have repeatedly promised to look after the underdogs/Northerners/ low income families etc. I may just be cynical but it has never actually happened.

Imnobody4 · 17/12/2020 09:36

The speech will be live on the Centre for Policy Studies You Tube channel at 2pm.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4108642-Liz-Truss-to-overhaul-Equalities-brief

I'm not sure where issues like CEDAW would fit, and issues like medical care, maternity vaginal mesh. I'll be watching with interest.

RozWatching · 17/12/2020 10:32

If they move the equalities hub to the north they might get some more straight talking. I'm not sure what an equalities hub is, mind!

It was actually launched by Theresa May. It sounded like a streamlining cost-saving exercise (and still does) to lump all equality issues under one umbrella. I'm amazed they are actually doing something with it and the relocation sounds interesting, but let's not forget that the Tories have been quite content to let the Equalities Office become the 'LGBT Office' and would probably sack the whole thing off if they could get away with it.

SirSamuelVimes · 17/12/2020 11:22

She will argue that objective data should be prioritised over the subjective experiences of individuals in influencing policy.

Objective data over emotional anecdote sounds good to me.

She believes there has been an over-emphasis on campaign groups like Black Lives Matter and is concerned that the loudest groups have tended to attract the most attention, instead of evidence leading the debate, it is understood.

I don't claim to know enough about BLM to give a terribly well informed opinion, but if you substitute Stonewall or Mermaids into that sentence, it reads pretty well to me.

RedToothBrush · 17/12/2020 11:32

Jim Pickard @PickardJE
NEW:
"Ministers have concluded that unconscious bias training does not achieve its intended aims. It will therefore be phased out in the Civil Service. We encourage other public sector employers to do likewise."

questions-statements.parliament.uk/written-statements/detail/2020-12-15/hcws652
Unconscious Bias Training
Statement made on 15 December 2020

Intro:
This government is committed to levelling up opportunity for everyone, no matter what their background. We are also determined to eliminate discrimination in the workplace. To meet those ambitions, we must ensure that policy and advice on equality is evidence-based, and is delivered in a way that means we can respond quickly to new insights.

Earlier this year, the Government Equalities Office commissioned the Behavioural Insights Team for a summary of the evidence on unconscious bias and diversity training. Titled ‘Unconscious bias and diversity training - what the evidence says’, the report highlights that ‘there is currently no evidence that this training changes behaviour in the long term or improves workplace equality in terms of representation of women, ethnic minorities or other minority groups’. It also states that there is emerging evidence of unintended negative consequences.

The report is published alongside this response, and will be deposited in the House Libraries, today. In light of its findings, Ministers have concluded that unconscious bias training does not achieve its intended aims. It will therefore be phased out in the Civil Service. We encourage other public sector employers to do likewise.

It continues in the link.

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RedToothBrush · 17/12/2020 11:35

Thats sounds a lot like the government just killed the Stonewall cash cow.

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Sexnotgender · 17/12/2020 11:36

I don't claim to know enough about BLM to give a terribly well informed opinion, but if you substitute Stonewall or Mermaids into that sentence, it reads pretty well to me.

I agree. Lobby groups have had far too much of a hand in shaping policy.

Shedbuilder · 17/12/2020 11:39

Unintended negative consequences...

That's something of an understatement, isn't it? When was erasure of an entire sex class an unintended negative consequence?

How do statements like this work alongside the extraordinary bias shown by the Tories on the Women and Equalities Committee?

MedusasBadHairDay · 17/12/2020 11:39

It will centre on reforms that aim to promote equality by handing people greater agency over their lives

Uh-huh.

So no acknowledgement of structural inequality then?

I can't see how this is going to help make society fairer. Just easier for those already privileged to pretend that we live in a meritocracy.

RozWatching · 17/12/2020 12:16

@Shedbuilder

Unintended negative consequences...

That's something of an understatement, isn't it? When was erasure of an entire sex class an unintended negative consequence?

How do statements like this work alongside the extraordinary bias shown by the Tories on the Women and Equalities Committee?

"Yes we agree that woman is just an identity"

"...and now we are going to move away from identity politics"

EmpressWitchDoesntBurn · 17/12/2020 12:22

Ms Truss will call time on "a small group of self-selecting activists" holding sway over the equalities debate. ...

Call time on Stonewall. PLEASE call time on Stonewall!!!

RozWatching · 17/12/2020 12:57

@EmpressWitchDoesntBurn

Ms Truss will call time on "a small group of self-selecting activists" holding sway over the equalities debate. ...

Call time on Stonewall. PLEASE call time on Stonewall!!!

That would be great. Stonewall is trying monopolise the whole equalities field and more, from 'anti-misogyny' (lol) to representing people with DSDs and telling Ofcom how to regulate the BBC.
Covidasaurus · 17/12/2020 13:01

I think yesterday’s announcement about scrapping unconscious bias training (and wider D and I training) was to pave the way for this.

They can scrap the Equality Act in January. They will love doing this.

I agree this is bad for everyone, especially disabled people, women and ethnic minorities. It’s classic Tory individualism.

MedusasBadHairDay · 17/12/2020 13:36

@Covidasaurus

I think yesterday’s announcement about scrapping unconscious bias training (and wider D and I training) was to pave the way for this.

They can scrap the Equality Act in January. They will love doing this.

I agree this is bad for everyone, especially disabled people, women and ethnic minorities. It’s classic Tory individualism.

Yeah, I'm not seeing how any feminist can support this. It's not going to help women's rights at all.
RedToothBrush · 17/12/2020 13:41

I'm not convinced they will scrap the Equality Act. Not yet at least. And I think they WILL scrap the HRA. They like the veneer of being pro rights. And the issue with the EA is its not easy to enforce, so its a bit toothless in practice. It looks far worse to scrap it completely.

I definitely am weary as I do fear a sting in the tail but i am also willing to reserve judgment too.

If they are urging the civil service to not do this type of training that also applies by extention to government departments such as the DfE... follow that through and look at Stonewall's accounts.

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sashagabadon · 17/12/2020 13:45

The move away from London is (I presume) part of the levelling up agenda and to get away from all the lefty liberal labour luvvies ( good alliteration there Grin) which I think is a good thing.
Hopefully a move away from London will mean more of a focus on income/ class inequality - as previous posters have said, Labour’s old ground now abandoned.

stumbledin · 17/12/2020 14:39

I dont think there is any suggestion of doing away with the EA just saying that those who try and make equality only a tick box exercise about the (current) protected characteristics.

And whilst I can see how tempting it would be to think that doing away with "shouty groups" if that meant Stonewall and Mermaids, need to be aware they could equally be WPUK and others.

Not sure why someone up thread thought anyone was saying this would be better for women.

Just that in fact the issue of finding equality for women is not just about the impact of trans rights on women's rights, is also about making sure women have the same rights in all areas that men do.

But I think for the Tories this means the tired old them that those who try hard will always suceed.

Not sure who did their training but of all places, particularly the HoC people need to be made aware that their experience of the world is not THE experience of the world for the vast majority of people.

As the always used to say "never trust a tory", but the problem is who can you trust.

Sad
stumbledin · 17/12/2020 14:45

Will also be interesting to see how far Liz Truss gets with undoing the woke thinking within the Civil Service.

I started a thread about the consultation on home abortions (which nobody read!) but also pointed out that in the briefing for this consultation they state that it is about "people" who get pregnant!!!!!!!!!
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4107152-Home-use-of-both-pills-for-early-medical-abortion-up-to-10-weeks-gestation-Government-Consultation

MichelleofzeResistance · 17/12/2020 14:54

The Equalities Act was the hoovering up of lots of bits of legislation and tying it together with equality duties etc. I could see an argument for saying to release it back into its separate legislations: for example going back to the disability discrimination act, but losing that centralised system. The protections in there are tied in to a lot of other bits of legislation which would not go away: there are a LOT of things they would have to re draft from scratch if they did this, and to me that makes it unlikely. Likewise many other bits associated with each protected characteristic. I could see an argument that stuffing all those bits into the one bucket has not gone anywhere useful on reflection, and they did better in their separate legislations.

MichelleofzeResistance · 17/12/2020 14:59

And I can see by this point that the govt are really, really fed up with gender identitarianism and with women being really pissed off with them about it. I'm sure they'd like it all to just go away.

The problem is that if they think this is an easier third way than growing a backbone and setting down boundaries, and being prepared to withstand the tantrums, they're wrong. That boundary will be pushed for until it's found, and as they've already discovered, the longer they leave it, the bigger the mess gets that they will have to eventually face up to.

RedToothBrush · 17/12/2020 15:06

I apologise for the source, but guido fawkes have a transcript of the speech:

order-order.com/2020/12/17/read-in-full-liz-trusss-landmark-anti-woke-speech/

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yourhairiswinterfire · 17/12/2020 15:22

Thanks Red.

"It has led to the Left turning a blind eye to practices that undermine equality, whether it be failing to defend single-sex spaces, hard fought for by generations of women… enabling and tolerating antisemitism … or the appalling grooming of young girls in towns like Rotherham."

There's going to be some tantrums over that, I bet...

WootMoggie · 17/12/2020 15:23

It's well worth watching the speech itself.
Really puts the boot in, where the boot was needed.

MichelleofzeResistance · 17/12/2020 15:25

In addition, this focus on groups at the expense of individuals has led to harmful unintended consequences. It has led to the Left turning a blind eye to practices that undermine equality, whether it be failing to defend single-sex spaces, hard fought for by generations of women… enabling and tolerating antisemitism … or the appalling grooming of young girls in towns like Rotherham.

Study after study has shown that unconscious bias training does not improve equality, and in fact can backfire by reinforcing stereotypes and exacerbating biases. That’s why this week we announced we will no longer be using it in government or civil service.

Whether it’s “affirmative action” … forced training on “unconscious bias” … or lectures on “lived experience” … the Left are in thrall to ideas that undermine equality at every turn.

This school of thought says that if you are not from an ‘oppressed group’ then you are not entitled to an opinion … and that this debate is not for you. I wholeheartedly reject this approach.

I am calling time on “pink bus” feminism, where women are left to fix sexism and campaign for childcare.

we need the equality debate to be led by facts … not by fashion. Time and time again, we see politicians making their own evidence-free judgements.

…….. I think she's nailed all of this, and there's little to disagree with.

We will not limit our fight for fairness to the nine protected characteristics laid out in the 2010 Equality Act … which include sex, race, and gender reassignment. While it is true people in these groups suffer discrimination, the focus on protected characteristics has led to a narrowing of the equality debate that overlooks socio-economic status and geographic inequality...….In addition to race, sex, disability and religion, (this project) will also look at issues around geography, community and socio-economic background..

In addition to.

Imnobody4 · 17/12/2020 15:27

I'm rather shocked but on balance I'm in agreement. There's still a lot of details to discuss but at least no one is shouting no debate in your face.

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