Unbelievable projection from Jane Fae on puberty blockers

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With breathtaking chutzpah, Fae claims in an article in the Independent that the "the consequences could be devastating" for those children no longer allowed easy access to puberty blockers.

Fae worries that there has been no no "risk assessment for those affected" (unlike all the non-existent risk-assessments for putting the poor kids on puberty blockers in the first place).

"Whatever happened to “first, do no harm”?" Fae asks, in a really outrageous piece of DARVO.

"In the case of puberty blockers and Hormone replacement Therapy (HRT), the adverse physical and psychological effects are equally well-documented." Fae says. But no, this is not Fae suddenly accepting reality. It continues: "We know, for instance, that women who suddenly have HRT withdrawn may become suicidal." So it is withdrawal that Fae objects to, not the filling of innocent children with dangerous and untested medication in the first place. The article continues with more unproven, dangerous assertions that children are being driven to suicide as a result of not being able to get hold of blockers.

www.independent.co.uk/voices/transgender-court-ruling-puberty-blockers-b1766456.html

You'd think the Independent, which reports all of this uncritically, must have no idea that biological sex is an indelible characteristic or that men's treatment of women underlies many young girls' unhappiness with their birth sex. And yet, on the same day, they publish this:

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/baby-making-factory-nigeria-ogun-b1766419.html

Unfuckingbelievable.

What is a genuine cross gender identity?

It’s a core element of human identity that gives a person a strong (seemingly permanent) sense that they are not the biological sex they were born.

It's the wrong way round isn't it, surely to inflict no harm would be to ensure a robust process for ensuring that it is the best way forward for the person, and that they understand the potential risks and implications. Surely if they actually cared about those going through this, they would be jubilant that it seems to be more of a focus on making it safer.

@Typesofcatalogue

What is a genuine cross gender identity?

It’s a core element of human identity that gives a person a strong (seemingly permanent) sense that they are not the biological sex they were born.

Every trans person has that! From AGP, to someone who's been brought up subjected to relentless homophobia.

It's just a description of wanting to be the opposite sex.

Thanks Datun. The pshe association links to all those groups, repeatedly.

Recently I had a look though and one resource listed two further resources which no longer exist; one of which was the Royal College of Psychiatrists.

As I say, what ever it was had been removed.

@Typesofcatalogue

What is a genuine cross gender identity?

It’s a core element of human identity that gives a person a strong (seemingly permanent) sense that they are not the biological sex they were born.

So are you saying it's actually a delusion?

Normally if someone has a strong sense that they are something they are not, it's described as delusional. Why is this different?

Since your definition appears to imply that having a 'cross gender identity' is a delusion, could you explain in more detail, because I'm sure that's not what you meant to imply.

(For anyone who wants to report this post, please note that I'm not saying that this is delusional, simply that the description of 'cross gender identity' given by Typesofcatalogue appears to be defining it as a delusion.)

So it's based mainly on stereotypes apart from the first point and the last two.

And it’s only the last two that are a concern.

I notice that you didn't comment on my remarks about the last two: that a child having a strong dislike of their sexual anatomy or a strong desire for the physical sex characteristics of the opposite sex could be due to abuse or trauma which should be thoroughly investigated. It doesn't mean they have the brain of someone of the opposite sex.

It strikes me that one of the big problems with diagnosing gender dysphoria is that, as the DSM list shows, we still don’t understand it. At all. As a result we find ourselves in the current situation, where groups have been dragged in under the trans umbrella who probably don’t belong there, the ‘accepted’ ideology has been driven by the narrow experience and self-interest of the mostly middle class and middle aged MtF late transitioners who dominate the movement, because having spent most of their lives as men they’re used to getting their own way (how else can you explain the weird dearth of FtM transitioners in positions of influence?), and the vehement opposition to any research that doesn’t have ‘Trans! Yay!’ as aforegone conclusion. The trans movement has painted itself into a corner as a result. Effective treatment for those who feel they are the wrong gender isn’t possible unless we have far more objective, dispassionate, agenda free research into different groups of apparently trans people. Some will find this uncomfortable, even painful, and it may well result in many different approaches of which a fair number will most likely not be affirming. Sometimes medicine tastes bad, but you’ve still got to take it.

The more I think about it, the more TWAW feels less like it’s been promoted as a cry of empowerment than it does as a distraction from some serious shortcomings and ugly truths. We’re certainly a long way from the point where it justifies changes to law, changes to society, or messing around with children’s endocrine systems.

Normally if someone has a strong sense that they are something they are not, it's described as delusional. Why is this different?

Since your definition appears to imply that having a 'cross gender identity' is a delusion, could you explain in more detail, because I'm sure that's not what you meant to imply.

This is what I was going to say, when or if Types responded to me.

There are, no doubt, some people who want to be the opposite sex. Some want it very much indeed.

But if anyone truly believes they are the opposite sex, then yes of course it's a delusion.

Someone on Twitter was citing a pic of E Page as a child, riding a bike in a flannel shirt with hair tied back, as proof of transgenderism. And I think they were actually serious.

Empress I think that pic was in a movie. So chosen by an adult costumier to be appropriate for a female character of that age.
Even in private life kids don’t usually buy their own clothes.

I tried to find the photo, got this which has been updated with new names and pronouns but the URL not been renamed. It now refers to the misogyny Elliot has suffered from & etc. .reads very strangely..

HTTPS:www.thelist.com/149804/the-stunning-transformation-of-ellen-page/

If natal puberty is fatal for trans people, how come Fae is alive and well and able to write nonsense?

Found an archive link so can read without the clicks.

archive.md/02lgu

The way Fae describes it you’d think GPs were turning up on doorsteps to pry pills out of teenagers mouths...

In reality, these kids get a 12 weekly intramuscular injection that naturally and slowly wears off.

www.medicines.org.uk/emc/product/780/smpc#gref

@Whatwouldscullydo

GIDS current patients are probably going to be let down very badly

Definitely. I mean it would be goodnof they started publically speaking out against all these idiots who are now online /doing interviews etc practically begging kids to start killing themselves. I mean the plan seems to be to emotionally blackmail everyone into reversing the judgement as opposed to presenting all this "evidence" that they claim there is but seemingly didn't present when they had the chance

God, I hadent thought of that. Do you think they are activly wanting a poor child to harm themselfs so they can blame the judges?

They really have no consideraton for children, everyone is just a pawn to the idology.

Slightly off topic but I've just done a "I wonder" look on the royal college of Psychiatrists.

I found this and i do think it needs some urgent reviewing (it's just a blog, but still...):

Child psychiatry has been very active and energetic in promoting that agenda of not only tolerance but acceptance, working with people to say, "I am your advocate, I am here to help you feel safe, and if there are safeguarding implications for you in some aspect of your life, that will absolutely be my priority."

We know that safeguarding is everyone's priority, and I would go a step further and say that supporting people to be able to express their identity is a key part of safeguarding. Child and adolescent psychiatry is at the forefront of that.

www.rcpsych.ac.uk/news-and-features/blogs/detail/special-interest-groups/2020/02/24/gender-sexuality-and-psychiatry-interview-with-lgbt-activist-dr-louise-theodosiou

I do think she's referring mostly to LGB but she talks a lot about the T too.

Those letters should have never been put together.

So, Catalogue, if it's a small minority of girls with genuine GD and most of theose coming forward just extras carried away by peers or SM thinking they do, perhaps Stonewall's "Acceptance without exception" mantra is not the smartest way to approach them?

Any ideas how clinics can sort the genuine from the misguided? Apart from automatic affirmation, drugs, perhaps surgery and then waiting a few years and counting the detransitioners, of course.

This is almost inevitably going to end in a class action to end all class actions, and as the plaintiffs will all have life-altering impacts including sterility, it's not going to be cheap...

So, Catalogue, if it's a small minority of girls with genuine GD and most of theose coming forward just extras carried away by peers or SM thinking they do, perhaps Stonewall's "Acceptance without exception" mantra is not the smartest way to approach them?

Swap gender dysphoria for anorexia, Stonewall for those pro-ana sites and puberty blockers for laxatives or diet pills - amphetamines. Does "acceptance with exception" still apply and if not why not?

that a child having a strong dislike of their sexual anatomy or a strong desire for the physical sex characteristics of the opposite sex could be due to abuse or trauma which should be thoroughly investigated. It doesn't mean they have the brain of someone of the opposite sex.

Yes OldCrone it could be due to abuse and trauma and that should be fully investigated.

You set up a bit of a straw man when you say ‘brain of someone of the opposite sex’. I’m not describing transsexualism as that. More a set of factors including brain development that predispose an individual to develop a gender identity incongruent with their sex.

So, Catalogue, if it's a small minority of girls with genuine GD and most of theose coming forward just extras carried away by peers or SM thinking they do, perhaps Stonewall's "Acceptance without exception" mantra is not the smartest way to approach them?

No it’s not.

Any ideas how clinics can sort the genuine from the misguided?

That’s the job of the psychiatrists with a specialty in gender identity who run the clinics.

@Typesofcatalogue

that a child having a strong dislike of their sexual anatomy or a strong desire for the physical sex characteristics of the opposite sex could be due to abuse or trauma which should be thoroughly investigated. It doesn't mean they have the brain of someone of the opposite sex.

Yes OldCrone it could be due to abuse and trauma and that should be fully investigated.

You set up a bit of a straw man when you say ‘brain of someone of the opposite sex’. I’m not describing transsexualism as that. More a set of factors including brain development that predispose an individual to develop a gender identity incongruent with their sex.

But what does that mean? What is a gender identity? In what ways might it be congruent or incongruent with someone's sex? Isn't that all about stereotypes? If it's not a stereotype and it's something that the person truly believes (even though it's at odds with material reality), how is that not a delusion?

That’s the job of the psychiatrists with a specialty in gender identity who run the clinics.

They don't have time machines. You can't predict the tiny 10% who might go on to transition.

They don't seem to know how to work this out themselves. There's no concrete physical evidence to go on.

Also, transition isn't the only way to treat or deal with GD. There are many who live with it but find ways to manage it, just as many people with other types of body dysmorphia do too. (I suffer badly but have found ways to cope well)

The trans narrative fascinates people and media has found they can sell it. They're not as interested in people who want nose jobs and find trans race (rightly) horrific.

Media sets the aesthetic and stereotyped trends.

This is crazily circular, though, Catalogue. If the psychiatrists who we are relying on to sort out the genuine from the mistaken GD sufferers are operating under policies that tell them to affirm automatically and accept without exception, is it any wonder the numbers being treated and waiting for treatment have expanded exponentially?

Can we be surprised that the JR discovered that children proceed almost without exception from the "Let's give you time to think about this" PBs to "No going back now without irreversible and life-altering impacts" CSHs?

Who is looking out for these children? This is a bigger failure of safeguarding at every step of the way than anything in a century and a half, it seems. A lot of influential people are going to be on the wrong side of history when the dust settles.

Not even Dr Johanna Olsen buys the "hormone wash" theory:

www.google.com/amp/s/www.livescience.com/amp/51652-transgender-youth-dont-have-hormonal-imbalance.html

"A gender identity incongruent with their sex."

What does that mean? Its nonsense.

We have a sexed body and a personality. That's it.

Anyone of either sex can have any combination of personality traits.