Women at Doha airport were removed from flights and forced to undergo invasive internal inspection in an ambulance on the tarmac

[ReplacementPlasticUterus]

I can't quite believe this.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-54682565

@IheartJKR

I’d also like to say that I’m horrified that anyone - let alone on FWR would refer to a woman who abandoned their baby in a place such as Doha as ‘scum’. I am as afraid for the birth mother as I am for the baby and I’d happily bet my life on the fact that the authorities were not looking for the birth mother to reunite her with her baby or check if she needed medical attention ...

I am pro-choice and definitely think safe drop off boxes are necessary and need to be advertised and no one prosecuted for that.

But to dump a newborn in a toilet and leave it to die alone ... is quite simply horrifying. Trauma is not an excuse for someone’s appalling lack of humanity.

This is sickening, disturbing and vile

It reminds me a little of the scene in The Handmaid's Tale (TV version, series 3) when June has been captured and detained. It's a flashback to the beginning of the regime. She is taken by a guard for processing with lots of other women in some sort of centre. They pass several temporary containers where fully naked women are being examined. This was to test their fertility I think.

Obviously the reasons were different in this case but it's still so shocking.

Latest eye witness account here

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/26/i-was-absolutely-terrified-australian-witness-recounts-qatar-strip-search-ordeal

@Bluewavescrashing

This is sickening, disturbing and vile

It reminds me a little of the scene in The Handmaid's Tale (TV version, series 3) when June has been captured and detained. It's a flashback to the beginning of the regime. She is taken by a guard for processing with lots of other women in some sort of centre. They pass several temporary containers where fully naked women are being examined. This was to test their fertility I think.

Obviously the reasons were different in this case but it's still so shocking.

First thing I thought when I read this news yesterday was "Gilead"

I'm sorry but I think that when you go to a country with different societal rules then you have to accept that their norms differ. It is no different to how their prisoners are treated.

In this scenario, I understand the logic, from 3 perspectives.

1 Leaving the baby under Qatari was obviously a crime.
2 the mother may well have been in need of medical help and that was apparently the driving force of the situation, albeit deemed heavy handed.
3 the baby under Islamic law has a right to know its parental history.

I’m surprised anyone is surprised.

And I’m surprised anyone is shocked more isn’t made of it.

We have no idea how lucky we are in many respects. One day I would love to see a fight for women all over the world akin to BLM

@allhappeningatonce

The baby will be brought to an orphanage & then fostered out to a local Muslim family. It won't ever be adopted as that's not a thing under Islamic law. The mother, if they find her, will spend a long time in a horrible, dirty, overcrowded jail. The mother and baby won't be reunited. The chance of an Aussie abandoning their baby was probably slim anyway, especially as those women were transiting on the whole. The poor mother was probably an underpaid Asian worker in the airport or elsewhere & trying to escape. She'd know having a baby out of wedlock could cost her everything. I got pregnant out of wedlock in Dubai myself. I had tens of thousands owed to me so had to wait out the first trimester there. I was afraid of leaving the house in case I ended up in a car accident (very common there) and taken to hospital where they'd find out & that would be me jailed. Sometimes I don't know why I did it. I literally put a price on my freedom. I knew though, that with my passport & the fuss that could be made in the UK though I was a million times better off than any of the poor Filipinas it happens to everyday.

This is all very true, but also what someone "signs up to" if they visit, transit through or work in Qatar.

Going to have to disagree. Anyone who leaves an infant to die alone is a scumbag. Trauma is not an excuse

What rot. I’m so glad you’ve never found yourself in a position of desperation. It’s easy to judge from your high horse.

@allhappeningatonce

The baby will be brought to an orphanage & then fostered out to a local Muslim family. It won't ever be adopted as that's not a thing under Islamic law. The mother, if they find her, will spend a long time in a horrible, dirty, overcrowded jail. The mother and baby won't be reunited. The chance of an Aussie abandoning their baby was probably slim anyway, especially as those women were transiting on the whole. The poor mother was probably an underpaid Asian worker in the airport or elsewhere & trying to escape. She'd know having a baby out of wedlock could cost her everything. I got pregnant out of wedlock in Dubai myself. I had tens of thousands owed to me so had to wait out the first trimester there. I was afraid of leaving the house in case I ended up in a car accident (very common there) and taken to hospital where they'd find out & that would be me jailed. Sometimes I don't know why I did it. I literally put a price on my freedom. I knew though, that with my passport & the fuss that could be made in the UK though I was a million times better off than any of the poor Filipinas it happens to everyday.

The relevant embassies do help out runaway maids, as they are aware it is a problem. It happened in Doha a few years ago where a Filipina was jailed with her baby, she tried to leave before she started to show but because she took out a loan that hadn’t been paid back, she was essentially trapped.

But this indicates they thought it was someone transferring? I do wonder if it was just this one flight or were other flights also flagged?

@LongPauseNoAnswer

Going to have to disagree. Anyone who leaves an infant to die alone is a scumbag. Trauma is not an excuse

What rot. I’m so glad you’ve never found yourself in a position of desperation. It’s easy to judge from your high horse.

I am judging it.

I mean, look at you, defending someone who’d abandon a baby to die in a toilet. You do not get to pass on your hurt and trauma to another human being.

I feel sorry for the women traumatised by this assault on their dignity and privacy, not for a woman who’d leave her newborn to die alone.

@user102740264923

That's really distressing to read. Including the wholly inadequate response to it.

I can't even tolerate basic medical care since I was assaulted. If something like that had been done to me I truly think it would have tipped me over the threshold between just about tolerating living with trauma and ending my life.

I want to believe the women who were subjected to that will have had decent support and won't be traumatised, but it seems highly unlikely there won't be any who will be severely affected.

Distressing and terrifying and sickening.

I’m so sorry for you💐 Poor women having to go this. I hope they get some support as well.

*am judging it.

I mean, look at you, defending someone who’d abandon a baby to die in a toilet. You do not get to pass on your hurt and trauma to another human being.

I feel sorry for the women traumatised by this assault on their dignity and privacy, not for a woman who’d leave her newborn to die alone*

To start, many don’t abandon babies to die. They leave them somewhere where they will likely be found. You don’t know in this case- in fact somewhere like an airport toilet is likely to be searched/cleaned frequently so the baby would be found quickly.

Second this is not a western country. The mother’s decision may have been on what was best for the baby. A life in prison for both of them? An orphanage might have been the better choice.

There are no such things as safe drop off boxes in these countries. There are serious corporal and prison sentences. This may have been hers and her babies best chance.

@SoloMummy

I'm sorry but I think that when you go to a country with different societal rules then you have to accept that their norms differ. It is no different to how their prisoners are treated.

In this scenario, I understand the logic, from 3 perspectives.

1 Leaving the baby under Qatari was obviously a crime.
2 the mother may well have been in need of medical help and that was apparently the driving force of the situation, albeit deemed heavy handed.
3 the baby under Islamic law has a right to know its parental history.

Seriously?? I mean, I get the analogy that, for example, if you smuggle drugs to somewhere like Thailand then you're probably going to get executed but you actually think what happened to these women was justified?

@bluebluezoo

*am judging it.

I mean, look at you, defending someone who’d abandon a baby to die in a toilet. You do not get to pass on your hurt and trauma to another human being.

I feel sorry for the women traumatised by this assault on their dignity and privacy, not for a woman who’d leave her newborn to die alone*

To start, many don’t abandon babies to die. They leave them somewhere where they will likely be found. You don’t know in this case- in fact somewhere like an airport toilet is likely to be searched/cleaned frequently so the baby would be found quickly.

Second this is not a western country. The mother’s decision may have been on what was best for the baby. A life in prison for both of them? An orphanage might have been the better choice.

There are no such things as safe drop off boxes in these countries. There are serious corporal and prison sentences. This may have been hers and her babies best chance.

The baby definitely could have died though.

I doubt this was a local resident, as they wouldn’t allow a heavily pregnant resident to board an airplane without medical documents.

But let’s say it was a resident. Usually, the embassy helps out with runaway, pregnant maids because it’s a real problem in Qatar.

Usually they are facilitated to leave, but I do recall a case where a Filipina couldn’t go home because she took out an loan that hadn’t been paid back.

You know what she didn’t do? She didn’t abandon her newborn to die in a toilet.

She was imprisoned with her baby, and the expat community lobbied on her behalf. It took a few years, but she’s now back in the Philippines.

No, she should not have been jailed. It was a horrible case and I would hope that Qatar will be shamed in just letting these women go home without an issue.

I thought that the point of the story was about innocent women being exposed to humiliating examinations? However horrible it is that a baby was abandoned by someone does not really justify doing those examinations on travelers who had nothing to do with that.

How could they have dealt with it better? If i was on that flight i'd rather be examined and go on my way than wait for DNA testing. There is no get away from an investigation about such a thing in Qatar. There was no choice of the qatari authorities leaving the matter. They had to find out who did it. It was the quickest way to do it. What happened is a potential crime there. I am far more outraged about the treatment of unwed mothers and babies born out of wedlock than a mandatory vaginal inspection for what is a crime in that country.
This is only getting out because the women are Australians but this sort of treatment happens to arab and asian women there all the time.
Reports i've read describe the baby as prematurely born and that the inspection was by a female doctor. The baby might have been born dead anyway rather than 'left to die'. It could be a miscarriage of 4 months or a birth at 7 months.

@nepeta

I thought that the point of the story was about innocent women being exposed to humiliating examinations? However horrible it is that a baby was abandoned by someone does not really justify doing those examinations on travelers who had nothing to do with that.

This is true.

The woman could have been raped and unable to report it as sex outside of marriage would result in jail time. Even a pregnancy from consensual sex would be a difficult situation if unwed. This is the real reason they wanted to find her, not out of concern if wellbeing.

She might have gone into labour early and assumed the baby dead. Or she knew she would be separated from the child anyway if caught and someone would find it soon.

I don’t think it’s fair to judge her actions. The country is at fault for having such misogynistic laws that create situations like this.

@TurkMama

How could they have dealt with it better? If i was on that flight i'd rather be examined and go on my way than wait for DNA testing. There is no get away from an investigation about such a thing in Qatar. There was no choice of the qatari authorities leaving the matter. They had to find out who did it. It was the quickest way to do it. What happened is a potential crime there. I am far more outraged about the treatment of unwed mothers and babies born out of wedlock than a mandatory vaginal inspection for what is a crime in that country. This is only getting out because the women are Australians but this sort of treatment happens to arab and asian women there all the time. Reports i've read describe the baby as prematurely born and that the inspection was by a female doctor. The baby might have been born dead anyway rather than 'left to die'. It could be a miscarriage of 4 months or a birth at 7 months.

You may have consented to an intimate exam for expediency but those women did not get the choice.

Would urine pregnancy tests still produce a positive result soon after birth? This could have at least narrowed the women down in a non-invasive way.

I lived in Doha for 3 years, had my daughter there before returning to the UK. Believe me, the only reason why they would want to find out who the mother was would be to sling them in prison.

I always remind people heading off to the gulf that it may be warm, sunny and have beautiful beaches but they are going to stay in a dictatorship, they have no rights there.

The Asian workers and particularly women get treated like shit. I would never ever travel there again nor even transit though them.

I hope the Australian government give the Qataris a kicking over this but I doubt it

This is all very true, but also what someone "signs up to" if they visit, transit through or work in Qatar.

So any person who travels through the Middle East or to Australia has "signed up" to potentially being sexually assaulted, if their flight happens to be re-routed?

Or wait, not person. Any woman. ONLY women.

Men can fly and travel anywhere they like with zero fear of state-sanctioned rape.

How could they have dealt with it better?

Any other way would have been better.

Maybe they could have liaised with the Australian Authorities to ask then to check with the women on the list later?

But dragging women out of a plane, subjecting them to barbaric searches and intimate examinations, in a car park, without any information and not a shred of consent is no way of doing it.

The baby's needs don't come into it, even if the mother had been found, it would have made no difference to the baby whatsoever.

UsedUpUsername I pray that you don't have children. Being raised by a parent who doesn't understand or possess empathy must be crippling.

(And no one "left a baby to die", since the baby did not in fact die.)

Usually, the embassy helps out with runaway, pregnant maids
She was imprisoned with her baby

You have a funny view of "help". I wonder how bad the abuse of women would need to be before you'd call a government that imprisons women including female slaves for having premarital sex or being rape victims "scumbags."