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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Bill Burr monologue on SNL - rants about white women

87 replies

WeeBisom · 12/10/2020 01:38

Bill Burr did a gross misogynistic monologue on SNL, and I think it's an interesting insight into the mind of the average liberal American male. Namely - they are very sexist. This is honestly why the feminist movement in America is on its knees - no one really thinks women are oppressed.

Here's what Burr said:
"white women have...hijacked the woke movement....Generals around the world should be analyzing this... somehow, white women swung their Gucci booted feet over the fence of oppression and stuck themselves at the front of the line...I don't know how they did it. I've never heard so much complaining in my life from white women...
The nerve of you white women! Listen, I don’t want to speak ill of my bitches here. I dont, but let’s go back in history here, OK? You guys stood by us toxic white males through centuries of our crimes against humanity. You rolled around in the blood money, and occasionally, when you wanted to sneak off and hook up with a Black dude, if you got caught, you said it wasn’t consensual. Yeah! That’s what you did! That’s what you did! So, why don’t you shut up, sit down next to me, and take your talking to?"

Of course any woman who objects to this is being called a "Karen".

Some history: in 1993 Catharine MacKinnon published an article called 'from practice to theory or what is a white woman anyway?" In it, she argued that if women are truly oppressed by virtue of being women, then even that most pampered, effete, bon bon eating creature - the 'white woman' must be oppressed also. She revealed a deep assumption in American culture, namely that white women aren't actually oppressed - they are in fact the secret, evil behind the throne; whispering like Lady MacBeth into men's ears to make them oppress others.Black women are oppressed by virtue of being black, and poor women are oppressed by being poor, but rich white women aren't oppressed at all. Women aren't oppressed by virtue of being female, so feminism is a sham.

It's actually admirable how clear Burr is about all this, as he tells us 'bitches' to 'shut up' (nice abusive language by the way.) White women campaigning for their rights and freedom from oppression is framed as 'hijacking', illegitimate, taking something that doesn't belong to them.' 'Somehow' white women swung our Gucci boots (haha because we're also rich bitches!) over the fence of oppression. I really think that women in America are the only oppressed group that aren't allowed to acknowledge and fight against their oppression - their oppressed status is belittled and constantly cast into doubt.

This is coming from a man in a supposedly first world country that has no maternity leave. Abortion rights are precarious and highly contested. Women have to walk past hordes of shrieking crowds to have a D and C. Women cannot get contraceptives without first submitting to a once a year internal examination. American women have some of the worst maternal death rates in the developed world. Women's health care is expensive and not covered in standard insurance plans. Women do not have any kind of equality act to protect them. Three women are murdered by an intimate partner a day in the USA. Many states still allow child brides. 10 year old girls have been married off to older men in the USA in the 21st century. Women are raped and their rape kits lie untested and their rapists go free after two months in jail because 'he's a nice guy and he misses BBQ.' Women have been sexually assaulted and their abuser goes onto become a Supreme Court justice. Women. have been raped and their rapist goes onto to become president of the United States. Me Too showed that some of those Gucci wearing 'bitches' can be raped over and over again for years while Hollywood turns a blind eye. Bill Cosby drugged and raped multiple women, some of them white. Were these women lying about Cosby? If women aren't oppressed then why does it fucking feel like it?

And then he gives us a charming history lesson. Women 'stood by' while men committed atrocities and crimes against humanity. What's the first rule of misogyny again? Oh yes, that women are responsible for what men do. Men did the lynching and the enslaving and yet the blame, once again, is deflected onto 'white women'. And here's a real history lesson - women stood back and 'let' men do these things because women were property. They had no separate legal personality. They were essentially bought and sold into marriage contracts. Black people actually got the right to vote in America before women did. I think people forget that not so long ago women couldn't own property - not even small pieces of sentimental value. They had no legal existence of their own. Men owned their children and could stop a woman from ever seeing them again. Men could commit their wives to mental institutions for life if she became an annoyance. Marital rape was entirely legal.

The cruellest irony is that women are the original victims of male oppression, the ultimate test case, and yet men like Bill Burr have the absolute gall to turn around and say that actually women aren't really oppressed at all and all that evil shit that men did is actually women's fault. Because we 'let it happen', despite having an average life expectancy of 33 due to childbirth complications.

OP posts:
Childrenofthestones · 13/10/2020 07:41

I don't know if its relevant to his train of though but he's married to a black woman.

Iminthewrongstory · 13/10/2020 09:37

Good rant @WeeBisom - I saw a bit of SNL and was so disheartened. I don't know Bill Burr's work (for a heart-stopping moment, I thought they'd booked the odious William Barr, the U.S. Attorney General, which would really have been mind-blowing - in a bad way.) In his monologue I thought there was one potentially good bit - about Black History month getting a short and crummy month and how that could be changed. I know people online were saying the audience wasn't laughing because they were the sort of liberals he was having a go at, but I thought it was pretty hard to locate the jokes. Was calling women 'bitches' a laugh line?

HelloToMyKitty · 13/10/2020 09:42

Was calling women 'bitches' a laugh line?

Yeah, it’s not surprising. Of course they didn’t laugh and probably felt uncomfortable. Some of Bill’s best bits are like that though.

His set on gold-digging whores was some of his best work (imo), but there was so much shocked silence there. Like, the audience wasn’t sure if it was okay to laugh or not

Iminthewrongstory · 13/10/2020 10:46

@HelloToMyKitty Had a look at the set you recommended. Huh. Not funny to me at all, despite his reassurances that we're not all 'whores.' But if you dig it, great. From the comments below the video, reckon I'm not in his target audience demographic. When audiences don't laugh it can simply be because they don't find it funny, rather than something more complicated. They turned up to a comedy gig - they want to laugh. However, despite his complaint of 'It's not fair,' he's not entitled to their laughter.

boatyardblues · 13/10/2020 10:46

@WeeBisom

Bill Burr did a gross misogynistic monologue on SNL, and I think it's an interesting insight into the mind of the average liberal American male. Namely - they are very sexist. This is honestly why the feminist movement in America is on its knees - no one really thinks women are oppressed.

Here's what Burr said:
"white women have...hijacked the woke movement....Generals around the world should be analyzing this... somehow, white women swung their Gucci booted feet over the fence of oppression and stuck themselves at the front of the line...I don't know how they did it. I've never heard so much complaining in my life from white women...
The nerve of you white women! Listen, I don’t want to speak ill of my bitches here. I dont, but let’s go back in history here, OK? You guys stood by us toxic white males through centuries of our crimes against humanity. You rolled around in the blood money, and occasionally, when you wanted to sneak off and hook up with a Black dude, if you got caught, you said it wasn’t consensual. Yeah! That’s what you did! That’s what you did! So, why don’t you shut up, sit down next to me, and take your talking to?"

Of course any woman who objects to this is being called a "Karen".

Some history: in 1993 Catharine MacKinnon published an article called 'from practice to theory or what is a white woman anyway?" In it, she argued that if women are truly oppressed by virtue of being women, then even that most pampered, effete, bon bon eating creature - the 'white woman' must be oppressed also. She revealed a deep assumption in American culture, namely that white women aren't actually oppressed - they are in fact the secret, evil behind the throne; whispering like Lady MacBeth into men's ears to make them oppress others.Black women are oppressed by virtue of being black, and poor women are oppressed by being poor, but rich white women aren't oppressed at all. Women aren't oppressed by virtue of being female, so feminism is a sham.

It's actually admirable how clear Burr is about all this, as he tells us 'bitches' to 'shut up' (nice abusive language by the way.) White women campaigning for their rights and freedom from oppression is framed as 'hijacking', illegitimate, taking something that doesn't belong to them.' 'Somehow' white women swung our Gucci boots (haha because we're also rich bitches!) over the fence of oppression. I really think that women in America are the only oppressed group that aren't allowed to acknowledge and fight against their oppression - their oppressed status is belittled and constantly cast into doubt.

This is coming from a man in a supposedly first world country that has no maternity leave. Abortion rights are precarious and highly contested. Women have to walk past hordes of shrieking crowds to have a D and C. Women cannot get contraceptives without first submitting to a once a year internal examination. American women have some of the worst maternal death rates in the developed world. Women's health care is expensive and not covered in standard insurance plans. Women do not have any kind of equality act to protect them. Three women are murdered by an intimate partner a day in the USA. Many states still allow child brides. 10 year old girls have been married off to older men in the USA in the 21st century. Women are raped and their rape kits lie untested and their rapists go free after two months in jail because 'he's a nice guy and he misses BBQ.' Women have been sexually assaulted and their abuser goes onto become a Supreme Court justice. Women. have been raped and their rapist goes onto to become president of the United States. Me Too showed that some of those Gucci wearing 'bitches' can be raped over and over again for years while Hollywood turns a blind eye. Bill Cosby drugged and raped multiple women, some of them white. Were these women lying about Cosby? If women aren't oppressed then why does it fucking feel like it?

And then he gives us a charming history lesson. Women 'stood by' while men committed atrocities and crimes against humanity. What's the first rule of misogyny again? Oh yes, that women are responsible for what men do. Men did the lynching and the enslaving and yet the blame, once again, is deflected onto 'white women'. And here's a real history lesson - women stood back and 'let' men do these things because women were property. They had no separate legal personality. They were essentially bought and sold into marriage contracts. Black people actually got the right to vote in America before women did. I think people forget that not so long ago women couldn't own property - not even small pieces of sentimental value. They had no legal existence of their own. Men owned their children and could stop a woman from ever seeing them again. Men could commit their wives to mental institutions for life if she became an annoyance. Marital rape was entirely legal.

The cruellest irony is that women are the original victims of male oppression, the ultimate test case, and yet men like Bill Burr have the absolute gall to turn around and say that actually women aren't really oppressed at all and all that evil shit that men did is actually women's fault. Because we 'let it happen', despite having an average life expectancy of 33 due to childbirth complications.

Please open an anonymous YouTube account so you can post this thoroughly excellent riposte under the clip of this routine. What a wanker!
HelloToMyKitty · 13/10/2020 14:24

When audiences don't laugh it can simply be because they don't find it funny, rather than something more complicated

It’s fair enough. It definitely won’t be to everyone’s taste and I don’t think he read the audience. Also, it really seemed like the material on SNL needed some more polish, like he hadn’t worked it too much.

I love his Netflix specials but was fairly disappointed in the material he had that night.

Wanderingstars4238 · 13/10/2020 16:01

Bill Burr is a hopeless pig. I quit excusing him when I heard his podcast where he's being serious. He's a proud misogynist.
My impression is that he doesn't care about Black people's problems because of his wife's race. He's disrespected her plenty, and made her look very bad in public.
He's one of those insecure types that gets all his confidence from men approving of him, and women getting fed up with him. Makes him feel like an alpha, I guess.

I've been in a rage at him before, as well as two Black male you tubers Aba and Preach, who are gaining popularity and think just like him.
They also attack white women a lot.
Looks like the thing to do now nowadays is for black and white men to form a narcissistic bond by uniting against women. American men have to be hurting someone or putting some group down, or they don't know know who they are anymore.

DrDavidBanner · 13/10/2020 19:11

For some reason over lockdwn when I was stuck at home and falling into youtube rabbitholes I kept getting recommended Aba and Preach, I had block their videos I found them really disturbing.

It worrys me this increasing and easy access to casual misogyny.

BlackWaveComing · 13/10/2020 21:07

@Childrenofthestones

I don't know if its relevant to his train of though but he's married to a black woman.
Irrelevant.

His Black wife is not cover for his misogyny.

I spent 25 yrs with a black man; I've been told innumerable times that it means nothing in terms of my privilege, and raising mixed race kids gives me zero insight into anything.

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gender.

kattyboomboom · 14/10/2020 05:35

In it, she argued that if women are truly oppressed by virtue of being women, then even that most pampered, effete, bon bon eating creature - the 'white woman' must be oppressed also.

I think the issue is that it's a different story for different groups of women, which is a nuance that disappears when you only use 'men' and 'women'.

I think a lot of people believe that white women are second only to white men, which means they are almost at the top of the tree.

kattyboomboom · 14/10/2020 05:38

I've been told innumerable times that it means nothing in terms of my privilege, and raising mixed race kids gives me zero insight into anything.

I disagree with whoever said that. My friend is married to a black guy and often tells me of the disapproving looks she gets from white middle class women when she goes shopping with her clearly mixed race children. It gives insight into the inherent racism that many people in our society have.

turnitonagain · 14/10/2020 06:14

Having seen the clip I think his point is that white women have been complicit in racism and they don’t get an “out” because sexism also exists.

It’s not true for all but there are some white women who have tried to centre themselves in the struggles facing black and immigrants in America, which is wrong. If they really were concerned about sexism they’d at least try to amplify the voices of black women in regards to the racial discussion. Not suck all of the oxygen out of the room themselves.

His delivery I didn’t like though.

SusannaSpider · 14/10/2020 07:42

Surprised to find people here supporting this mysogynist crap and since when does being married to a POC excuse you from spouting your hatred of women, he needs to be called out on his misogyny, as that is what it is. It's neither satire nor funny. The pp claiming white women hijacked the #metoo movement... so should they just have stood down and kept their mouths shut? Like men have expected them to do for centuries.

SusannaSpider · 14/10/2020 07:48

Having seen the clip I think his point is that white women have been complicit in racism and they don’t get an “out” because sexism also exists.

And men don't get to be mysogynists just because some white racist women exist.
Tbh, I can't stomach this argument coming from a white man...Is he not centering himself in the struggles of black people?

turnitonagain · 14/10/2020 07:57

Susanna any comment on my second paragraph? (Or the last saying I didn’t like the performance...)

2Rebecca · 14/10/2020 08:45

I find it weird and racist the way people like him divide the world in to black and white as though people only come in 2 colours and only white people can be racist. Where do Japan and China fit in to his rule, or Uganda expelling its Indian ethnic people or the conflicts between people of Pacific Island and Indian origin in Fiji which saw the Indians discriminated against?
I've never heard of this guy but his "my bitches" language is aggressive, nasty and demeaning

SusannaSpider · 14/10/2020 09:42

Susanna any comment on my second paragraph? (Or the last saying I didn’t like the performance...)

Not liking his delivery should really go without saying.

I will apologise though as I read your second paragraph and compiled it in my head with the pp who mentioned the #metoo movement and appropriation by Alyssa Milano.(Which is untrue and has been denied by Tarana Burke). And my hackles were already up at the suggestion that these women should have kept quiet.

I just find these arguments so divisive. All women are oppressed, black or white. Of course black women are also oppressed because of their colour, of course this should be addressed, but we should all stand together on women's rights.
This is what MRA want - divide and conquer, women tearing each other down.

kattyboomboom · 15/10/2020 03:01

I think class analysis can at times have it's uses, but a lot of white liberals completely over egg the pudding with their blaming of all and sundry on the straight white male, without considering that each and every one of them was fathered by a straight white male.

They effectively highlight the privilege they were born into as offspring of this elite group and then wonder why nobody takes their subsequent cries of oppression seriously! 🤷‍♀️

kattyboomboom · 15/10/2020 03:18

Also, it's white men/men in general who have painted themselves as the biggest victims in the world and it has always been this way.

Oh, come on. This just isn't true. 😂 Bill Burr is a bit of a nob who fishes for a reaction, but men in general don't play the victim much. If we're to argue that they do, then this is at complete odds with the 'boys don't cry' element of toxic masculinity which tells suffering men to 'man up'.

Suicide is the biggest killer of men and yet they talk about it less than feminists talk about manspreading.

turnitonagain · 15/10/2020 03:38

In the American context it is important to note that white women have used racism and sexism to oppress black men. Burr makes the point crudely but remember the woman in Central Park who called the police fake crying saying “an African American man is trying to assault me.” That was this year! The Emmett Till case from the 1960s is well known also - a white woman claimed a black boy had whistled at her and he was killed by a white mob. She later admitted that she’d made it up.

So while not trying to be divisive, you can see why many black women just don’t trust white women when it comes to working together on issues of oppression. Because they see those white women acting nervous around their black sons and husbands. It’s just not resolved yet in America.

So yeah I don’t like how Bill Burr delivered the monologue at all - why say “my bitches” for example! - but somewhere in the word jumble there’s a solid point.

kattyboomboom · 16/10/2020 02:06

I agree he has a point but expresses it badly, in a manner that pushes many people away who might otherwise agree with him.

Men have IMO been much worse than women as they were usually the most active proponents of racism, driving the slave trade etc, but women were also complicit and I find it frustrating that many will try and avoid acknowledging this by drawing attention to the men.

I remember reading about how white women used to tear black women away from their newborns to be wet nurses (God knows what happened to their babies) and it was sobering reading. Many slave accounts mention that the 'woman of the house' was more feared by female slaves than the men.

PurpleHoodie · 16/10/2020 08:33

Saturday Night Live is shit. Has been for years.

Cailleach1 · 16/10/2020 08:46

Well, he calls women 'bitches'. Women are women, whatever colour their skin is. And this man just calls us 'bitches'.

QuentinWinters · 16/10/2020 09:37

I think a lot of people believe that white women are second only to white men, which means they are almost at the top of the tree.
Yes this. And a weird view that its some kind of ladder and white women are on a high rung.
Its true I'm never going to be randomly beaten up by a man who takes exception to my existence, like gay men or black men are by racists and homophobes.
But i have been sexually assaulted more times than I care to count,which I doubt is the case for black and gay men.
I prefer to see various kinds of oppression/disadvantage as a venn diagram. None of the circles are more important than any other,and they all overlap.
The fact this guy feels so confident recording this shit proves how embedded misogyny is. Its just invisible to him.

QuentinWinters · 16/10/2020 09:39

I remember reading about how white women used to tear black women away from their newborns to be wet nurses (God knows what happened to their babies)
That happened here too, but it was to Serfs in the middle ages who were white.
Black female slaves were regularly raped a forced to bear white slave owners children, but yeah, obviously the women were much worse than the men Hmm