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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Kirsty Wark documentary about Alex Salmond sexual assault case

62 replies

Shedbuilder · 20/08/2020 21:21

Kirsty Wark takes a close look at the Alex Salmond trial this spring in which he was accused by 9 women of sexual assault and he walked away scot-free.

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000lwld/the-trial-of-alex-salmond

I'm not Scottish, didn't know enough about it to have an informed opinion, but it stinks — and Nicola Sturgeon appears to be implicated. Why, you have to ask, has this been hidden away ay 11pm on a Monday night? It should have been on BBC1 at 9pm midweek.

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m000lwld/the-trial-of-alex-salmond

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 22/08/2020 10:43

Here is a detailed account of the court case.

www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2020/03/your-man-finally-in-the-public-gallery-the-alex-salmond-trial-day-7/

Some parts are redacted as the journalist (Murray) is pending a contempt of court hearing. Some people describe Murray as a conspiracy theorist.

Just leaving relevant articles here for those who wish to read.

ArabellaScott · 22/08/2020 10:49

'No one "runs" for First Minister' - thanks for clarification. Recent rule change by NEC has effectively excluded Cherry from standing[?] for FM.

Members of the NEC include Alyn Smith, Rhiannon Spear, etc.

DidoLamenting · 22/08/2020 10:51

@ArabellaScott

'No one "runs" for First Minister' - thanks for clarification. Recent rule change by NEC has effectively excluded Cherry from standing[?] for FM.

Members of the NEC include Alyn Smith, Rhiannon Spear, etc.

They wanted to stop her standing for a Holyrood seat whilst hanging on to her Westminster seat.
ArabellaScott · 22/08/2020 11:08

That's right. Which had been standard practise previously.

DidoLamenting · 22/08/2020 11:29

@ArabellaScott

That's right. Which had been standard practise previously.
So what? Personally I think making candidates choose which house they want to sit in isn't unreasonable.

Cherry was hollering for Salmon to be brought back into the party as soon as the verdict was known. Whilst he was not convicted by his and his QC's own admission his conduct towards women was extremely questionable.

I don't know how the proclaimed feminist Cherry squares that nor how her supporters on here square it.

BlackForestCake · 22/08/2020 12:13

We have been through this. The NEC were demanding that MPs resign their Westminster seats before even being selected as a candidate for a Holyrood seat. There is no precedent for that.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 22/08/2020 12:19

So what? Personally I think making candidates choose which house they want to sit in isn't unreasonable.

I agree. Sitting MPs/MSPs shouldn't be able to just switch parliaments at significant cost and this rule should have been in place from the start.

However, I don't think it's fair for this rule to apply to currently sitting MP/MSPs - it should only apply to new ones IMO.

BlackForestCake · 22/08/2020 12:27

Just as an aside: it is still possible for the trial to be a corrupt stitch-up, even if you believe the complainants.

The complainants have all been granted anonymity, but allegedly both Dani Garavelli’s article and Wark’s programme allow at least one of them to be identifed. Neither are being prosecuted, but pro-Salmond journalists Mark Hirst and Craig Murray, who have not identifed the complainants, are being prosecuted.

There is a lot more to this story than there appears to be.

CrunchyNutNC · 22/08/2020 12:31

If you really hate the SNP, you should look into this trial a bit more closely.

Why only if you hate the SNP?

fascinated · 23/08/2020 00:32

@ArabellaScott

'This case has done damage to sexual assault cases'. Yep. It should never have been brought to court.

The initial enquiry was thrown out and Salmond awarded costs of £500k. Then he is absolved in court and it is shown very clearly that some of the allegations were impossible, that is to say, completely made up. I'm not sure what else is needed to show that this is a politically motivated case.

Joanna Cherry is a supporter of Salmond, btw. Note the recent change in rules to stop her from running for FM.

The incompetence is staggering. Couldn’t they have at least got their allegations to be internally consistent?

But then again, the complete farce of the Equality Impact Assessments done for the SPS, for instance, is also staggering incompetence, and yet it is par for the course.

It’s incredible.

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 24/08/2020 04:14

@BlackForestCake

I identified one of the complainants thanks to a journalistic article published months before the trial. My suspicion was confirmed thanks to Dani Garavelli's article in the aftermath. How on earth Craig Murray is being held in contempt while these 'mainstream' journalists are not is beyond me. I've had long-standing concerns about Craig Murray's mental health, but I can't see anything on his blog that could be said to risk identifying the complainants without acknowledging that prior articles were even more intransigent in that regard.

The thing that baffles me about all of this is how on earth Leslie Evans has remained in post throughout, and at the very least not been placed on gardening leave pending the outcome of these enquiries. She, more than anyone, is responsible for the utterly farcical manner in which the initial enquiries into this were handled. The degree of blatant poor practice suggests that either she is utterly incompetent, or that along with several others (who I can't name, otherwise I'd expect this post to be deleted) actively engaged in a plot to 'nail' Salmond.

The laughable thing about it, is that if the allegations of conspiracy are true, and this was a plot by a pro-Sturgeon sect to bring down Salmond, then in the course of their scheming they have inadvertently dragged the First Minister into in in a manner that either a) makes her look utterly naive, or b) entirely complicit. Either way, I think she's in hot water if it emerges that the initial internal SG handling of this was anything other than just a colossally incompetent shambles right from the very start. I hope for her sake that this is one of those occasions that fits the narrative of "never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity".

My personal opinion on this is that Evans is simply incompetent, but she was taken advantage of by the first of the complainants, and thanks to the original failings of the procedure and due to poor practice, the thing grew arms and legs driven by someone with a grudge until it became this monster consisting of 14 serious criminal charges. I think Salmond is undoubtedly a sleaze, but I think the root of why he was never convicted of a single criminal act lies firmly and squarely with the individuals who were responsible for the conception, introduction, and facilitation of a laughably inadequate new set of procedures, who then went about handling the internal investigation in a completely cack-handed and amateurish manner.

I do think at least some of the allegations against Salmond, possibly the vast majority of them, are absolutely true, but the women involved have, first of all, been led up the garden path, then horribly let down by the people they entrusted to act on their behalf.

ArabellaScott · 24/08/2020 07:53

"never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity"

It's a poor state of affairs when this is the best we can hope for.

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