“57% of women support self ID”

[ACatWhoBinds]

A YouGov poll, shown in this Huff Post article, reported that the majority of women support self ID for trans folk. I wondered what everyone’s opinion on it is. I know we probably don’t see eye to eye on this issue but I like to listen to views different to mine

@Billi77

I guess under 25s weren’t included in this survey

Why?

The under 25s are just as diverse in background and viewpoint as anyone else in the U.K. - anyone who thinks otherwise must be living in a bubble.

Although I suppose it’s possible that it’s harder to find an adequate cross section in the 18-25 year olds who complete you gov surveys, despite the weighting.

I've had conversations with people who insist that 'there will still be checks and stuff, self-ID doesn't mean you can just decide to say it'. Recently. People really don't all get what it means. Never mind the wider implications.

Did the OP ever come back?

Perhaps they didn't get the result they were hoping for.

Did anyone see the other Wings poll result from July 2020.

Penis News lies. That is all.

Ohh cool I didn’t realize Wings had done another factual straightforward poll. Nice to see.

As for the pink news one, I have to thank a past poster for linking to those in another thread...
m.youtube.com/watch?v=G0ZZJXw4MTA

Q: Should people be allowed to self ID?

A: Yes, of course!

Q: Should a male-bodied homosexual man with a penis (but who has self-ID'd as a woman and may or may not have a history of sexual assault) be allowed to share the female changing rooms with women and girls?

A: Yeah, no, fuck off.

People don't want to hurt other people's feelings, so much so that they're potentially putting themselves in what could be a very vulnerable situation. And their daughters.

They will be wanting to tick the 'right' box on the form, to be PC & inclusive, not actually thinking about the repercussions.

The repurcussions are not well known.

And they're so extreme that people think, that can't be right.

Ask if male rapists should be locked up in women's prisons. Is that right?

Should men be able to compete against women in sports as adults. Is that fair?

Should adult men change with girls of all ages in communal changing at eg sports clubs?

Should men who self id as women (rather than have a gra) be eligible for things carved out for women?
Show any standard person pip bounce, tell them they iD as female half the week and 'came out' after carving a very lucrative career as a man, and ask whether they should be earning accolades for women. Answer is no.

Ask whether 50% men and %50 % transwomen in parliament, on boards, etc etc counts as women having equal representation.

I mean the whole thing is ludicrous.

Most people have no idea what it means in practice.

And of course the question was worded to get the best result. I would say yes to that.

Ask if men should be able to self id into women's prisons, sports, etc. Most people will say wtf don't be silly of course not.

@LittleEntrepeneur

Q: Should people be allowed to self ID?

A: Yes, of course!

Q: Should a male-bodied homosexual man with a penis (but who has self-ID'd as a woman and may or may not have a history of sexual assault) be allowed to share the female changing rooms with women and girls?

A: Yeah, no, fuck off.

Sorry, I meant *Heterosexual, obvs.

Of course an issue is that a lot of people esp men don't like women much, deep down.

A lot of people think feminists have 'gone too far', are loonies etc. And of course most of the gender critical feminists are by definition gender non conforming. Saying no to this is not confirming to female socialisation/ role.

So when it's presented as extreme feminists don't like this. A lot of people think well they don't like men anyway, and they're really annoying going on about stuff, so ha take that loonies.

Also of course with the sport and tbh a lot of other stuff, men don't want us there in the first place. They don't want to see it on telly or have it in the papers. It takes away time that could be spent on proper sport. Keep women to Wimbledon and only show the pretty ones, job done.

Also it doesn't affect men at all.

There is an idea that when it affects 'their' women, mums wives daughters they might act.

But, it doesn't work like that. Society says it cares about the safety of women and girls, but it doesn't.

Rape is the worst! But oh well this specific case well seems like the poor fella shouldn't be penalised.

A woman has been raped in prison by a sex offender with a dick!
Well she has committed a crime so is a wrong 'un. And the prison service should stop all violence.

This woman was freaked out by some men in the unisex bogs!
Well why was she in there on her own? Everyone knows women should be accompanied. And tbh if she can't take a bit of banter she shouldn't go to places like that anyway

Etc etc etc

I really don't know how this will end up.

I do think the extreme activists have been overplaying their hand so massively that people are starting to notice in the UK though.

The misogyny is just too obvious.

Also it doesn't affect men at all.

And yet according to the stats posted by campervan men are even more against it than women. Presumably because they feel less of a need to 'be nice' even just on a survey. Plus they know full well what men are like and precisely what type of man will exploit self ID.

The men who want this - the painfully woke bearded allies - must, in reality, be a vanishingly small number of men just making a huge amount of noise ... and in doing so actually harming the cause they purport to hold so dear.
But of course, the fact that they will have made the old fashioned form of trans person's lives harder after all this is done won't actually affect them, any more than the current push to erode women's rights does. They can walk away from the disaster, before the dust even settles, and never look back at the destruction they caused.

What champions of light they are.

Fortunately - according to those stats NAMALT ... and who thought that could ever be used as a positive statement in a discussion on women's rights?

I think people should be able to dress, present and call themselves however they like, but they should use the services appropriate to their biological sex.

I think most people would agree with that, SingingKettle. But as yet, they don’t realise self-ID is about losing single-sex services.

Also it doesn't affect men at all.

It is affecting gay men, though, they are having their sexuality erased and being shamed for not wanting a sexual partner with a vagina.

They are at risk of being branded transphobic and facing disciplinaries at work, simply for asserting their own rights as written in the law, same as women are.

Which is a) pretty bloody regressive and b) reprehensible of Pink News, considering their founding purpose.

Gay men don’t have the additional safety aspects to deal with but they are wrestling with similar phenomenon around shifting language and losing their private spaces (which exist for different practical reasons to women’s spaces but both stem from being marginalised from using mainstream spaces, and in the case of gay men, from being criminalised for participating in consenting adult activity).

It is the key issue - most people think strangers can 'identify' as whatever the hell they want.

The problem arises when this 'identity', which is nothing but subjective, uncheckable whatever a person says, carries demands with it, packaged as 'rights'.