Excellent letter on Freedom of speech to appear in Harper's Mag

[Imnobody4]

harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate/
Signed by JKR, Margaret Atwood and Salman Rushdie among many others.
Are more people starting to say enough?

@BentBastard

The reason discussion is impossible is that people pick the "goodies" and the "baddies" and decide everything the goodie says is right and everything the baddie says is wrong.

What happened to agreeing with something's someone says but no others.

Why can't we agree and disagree with opinions rather than people (who have a range of views on a range of topics).

This. So much this.

The Guardian asked 4 writers to respond to the Harper's letter - two in favour of it (although one of those was a signatory in the first place), one sitting on the fence, and one opposing it.

Opposing it, Nesrine Malik wrote: It’s puzzling to me that a statement signed by a group of writers, thinkers and journalists, most whom have Ivy League or other prestigious credentials, would fail to at least establish a coherent definition of what it believes cancel culture is before seeming to condemn it.

Granted, many publications have paraphrased the letter as an attack on cancel culture - and it is. But the letter didn't use the term "cancel culture" at all. So why on earth should it be compelled to define it?

The Zoe Williams piece is pretty much unreadable. I have no idea what she's trying to say beyond, 'Please nobody quote me on this'.

in the sixties, big private businesses had called for the southern states of the US to end racial segregation, would that have been justified

Different issue. This is about the conflicting rights of two protected characteristics under equality law. It's a very political choice.

The Zoe Williams piece is pretty much unreadable. I have no idea what she's trying to say beyond, 'Please nobody quote me on this'

Ditto Nesrine Malik- except with "please quote me this"

@andyoldlabour

SunsetBeetch

"It might have triggered some more uncontrollable sobbing."

The feigned hysteria levels are only to be expected. It is just so embarrasing that adults (supposedly) act in this fashion.

Isn't it though. A friend of a friend, a 40-something mother of two, everyone supposedly "cis", posted on FB how the "hatred" posted by Rowling had her "throwing up most of the night and sobbing so hard she could not breathe". I mean, maybe see the GP?

Isn't it though. A friend of a friend, a 40-something mother of two, everyone supposedly "cis", posted on FB how the "hatred" posted by Rowling had her "throwing up most of the night and sobbing so hard she could not breathe". I mean, maybe see the GP?

I honestly don't understand how anyone can take behavior like that seriously. Like, what response other than "get a grip" could you possibly give?

I have to think it's just another sport at the virtue signalling olympics. Who feels the most for our trans sisters? I refuse to believe she actually vomited or sobbed.

This letter was mentioned in a local group I'm in. People said JK Rowling deserved what she got for being a terf and that she is the reason some young people have committed suicide. I said so she deserves rape and death threats and to have porn sent to her on twitter threads children were looking at, and that it's highly irresponsible to talk about suicide in this way. At least one person in the group has blocked me and I've been told my opinion doesn't matter.

My line on free speech in general is when it becomes a phsyical threat. So saying "I hate cucumbers" is fine by me. Saying "I am going to kill any cucumber that crosses my path" not fine. My thoughts on it are probably not as black and white as I've just made them sound, and that isn't set in stone but that's the main gist.

Isn't it though. A friend of a friend, a 40-something mother of two, everyone supposedly "cis", posted on FB how the "hatred" posted by Rowling had her "throwing up most of the night and sobbing so hard she could not breathe".

I'm sorry, I'd have to laugh. Creative writing class?

I have to think it's just another sport at the virtue signalling olympics. Who feels the most for our trans sisters? I refuse to believe she actually vomited or sobbed.

It’s like the eighteenth century cult of sensibility. That was disproportionately middle class women, as well.

Last time I sobbed and (almost) puked was when mum called to tell me that dad was terminal (completely out of the blue after a routine blood test).

If adults get that distraught over a perceived insult or hurty feelings then they really are too precious for this world and need help.

Sobpuking because someone said something you thought was mean on the internet seems like something that if genuine would suggest that medication might be helpful. Either that or no internet.

Serenity, .

It’s like the eighteenth century cult of sensibility. That was disproportionately middle class women, as well.

It does sound similar!

I don't know if I'm more disturbed by the idea of someone throwing up because of what JK Rowling said or by when I was told that I'd kill myself too if an author I looked up to contributed to my oppression.

Thank you - it 18 years best week and I can remember it as if it was yesterday.

Bleh - 18 years next week.

Last time I sobbed and (almost) puked was when mum called to tell me that dad was terminal (completely out of the blue after a routine blood test).

So sorry Serenity

Sobpuking because someone said something you thought was mean on the internet seems like something that if genuine would suggest that medication might be helpful. Either that or no internet.

I think putting their phone in a block of ice and waiting for it to thaw would do this person a world of good. And if the phone didn't make it, even better.

Leaving the gin alone might be a better cure for sobbing and puking.

@TheProdigalKittensReturn

Isn't it though. A friend of a friend, a 40-something mother of two, everyone supposedly "cis", posted on FB how the "hatred" posted by Rowling had her "throwing up most of the night and sobbing so hard she could not breathe". I mean, maybe see the GP?

I honestly don't understand how anyone can take behavior like that seriously. Like, what response other than "get a grip" could you possibly give?

I can't think of a time when I've ever behaved that way. Or seen any adult behave that way.

When I've seen people write that stuff my assumption generally has been that they are telling fibs. Maybe that's wrong though, there are people responding that way?

Aren't they? I've now seen someone on Twitter claim that JKR is 'suppressing [her own] trans feelings'.

This was a thing aimed at lesbians a while back. Now for straight women too!

They are after Frida Kahlo now on twitter...there won’t be anyone left. Well just the men.

Has anyone gently pointed out that you can't cancel someone who's already dead?

I don’t think they know or care.