Taking a break from it all

[CloudsCoveredTheSky]

I have repeaked so many times recently and now I just need to stop thinking about all the trans stuff for a while. The more I look into it, the more I realise how pointless taking a lot of these people seriously is.

You have:

Women who think we should all just "be kind" (death threats towards those we disagree with allowed of course)

Young people who spend way too much time online with no supervision - often in fandoms like Harry Potter and, oddly, kpop (do they think Korean men would, in any way, be interested in or support this stuff? It is one of the most sexually conservative countries in the developed world. They might wear make up, but the likelihood of them stepping up to defend ladydick is zero.)

People in general with low social skills who spend too much time online and just yelltype whatever comes into their heads because it has no consequences and they barely remember what they type from one minute to the next. There's no need to go out and make real life friends or interact with actual humans with all their imperfections because you can just chat online and block anyone the minute you feel uncomfortable.

I've noticed that none, literally none of my friends post pride or LGBT stuff anymore. My friends are all 30s to 40s and very left leaning. No one discusses the misogyny but no one has posted a thing about pride this year, not even my gay friends. I just think most people are sick of it, feel alienated, or support us but don't want a pile on.

I don't even know if these people are representative of the trans community as a whole. When I look at truscum stuff, they seem to hate both us and lgbtq+++++ people and yet they also don't truly believe they can change sex, so honestly, I have no problem with them at all. I don't care what anyone identifies as, as long as I am not compelled to play along or accept that "living as a woman" has any sort of real life meaning.

The more time I've spent on it, the more I realise that social media just doesn't work as an effective communication tool. Not if you actually want healthy discussion. There are not many people in real life who actually yell "SUCK MY LADYDICK" at people (none that I have met anyway.) It's all about clicks and advertising. The whole reddit ban thing has shown that, I think. And when you think about all the trans stuff on the BBC and the Guardian, why is it there? Because the woke click on it, we click on it, the alt right click on it to ogle what they see as freaks, people like my mum who couldn't give a shit about feminism click on it to moan that you can't say anything these days...it's really the perfect storm.

I think I will just avoid the media in general, social media in particular, while continuing to put pressure on my MP and giving money where I can, as well as supporting women and children in other ways (volunteering and supporting female friends). Honestly that just seems more effective than letting this stuff destroy my brain.

No disrespect to anyone who is continuing of course! I just feel exhausted by it all.

There are real life consequences to trans ideology - prisons, domestic violence and rape support services, sports etc.

But I agree that repetitive online arguments and immersing oneself in social media platforms like Twitter is unproductive. Take a break and focus on other things like hobbies. It's good to have a change of scenery so to speak. We all do that from time to time.

It's always good to take a break. I do quite often when it gets too much.

"There are real life consequences to trans ideology - prisons, domestic violence and rape support services, sports etc."

Yes, I think I addressed that.

That resonates with me, it’s a bit like poking a bruise reading all the nonsense and click bait. It’s actually quite frightening how many women are being shut down online for speaking the truth and it’s hard to remember that the internet isn’t the whole world.

I agree that practical, real-world actions and sensible, kind conversations with other humans are where this battle will be won, I’d leave the online screamers to their echo chambers and purity spirals, they have over reached and will destroy their own cause in the end.

On the kpop question, there was one person who publicly sympathized with and expressed support towards a specific transwoman (didn't say anything about the larger issues, it was a while back so things weren't at the current boiling point). He committed suicide last year. Being a progressive, gay friendly sort of person in Korea isn't easy and he got a lot of shit for being openly progressive (in this case I have nothing against the message he sent to the transwoman fan, it was just a general sort of keep your chin up and don't let family rejection and classmates who're mean to you get you down sort of thing). Note that I'm not saying being progressive is why this young man killed himself - it's an exceptionally nasty industry and it's a miracle and of the kids involved make it out with their mental health intact - but the public backlash any time he said anything non conservative can't have helped.

I think it's an example of the general thing where young people in fandoms assume the people they idolize agree with them and support the same causes they do. It's part of why the reaction to Rowling's very mild and measured comments has been so over the top. People are reacting as if they were betrayed by a friend or parent figure.

I agree, OP, it can all feel a bit overwhelming. I took a break from reading/engaging with all of this stuff for quite a few months and I've just come back to it. I'd not even mentioned it at home because I was worried about what my (lovely, lefty-liberal) DP would think. A couple of years ago, he followed Pink News on Twitter because he felt he was uneducated about LGBT issues, but then when the JKR stuff started happening, he suddenly piped up, 'I don't understand... women do have periods. How can it be hate speech to say that they don't?' I could've cried with relief

Take care, OP, this whole debate can be totally mentally draining.

Sorry, that should've been, 'how can it be hate speech to say that they do?', duh. Sorry.

Anyone who needs a break should take one. It's a relay, no one woman has to do it all by herself!

@SpartacusAutisticus

I said I had no issue with others using it if they find it useful.

@theprodigalkitten Yes, that was a sad case. He was genuinely talented and said some insightful and thoughtful things. I think he had suffered depression for most of his adult life also. Korea is not a country where stepping out of line socially is easy. I'm sure he had a hard time.

I thought similar about the reaction to Rowling. Yes because she's a woman but also because people assumed she was on "their side" which is, I guess, understandable in young people who haven't developed critical thinking skills yet. It's the people in their 40s and over that worry me, how can they care so deeply what a celebrity thinks?

@MrsPhyllisTyne my husband is not from an English speaking country and he's just baffled. I showed him the Emily Ratajkowski video where she is rubbing spaghetti all over her naked body because feminism and he burst out laughing. He thought it was a joke, and wouldn't believe me that this is what empowerment means in the west these days.

The "men have periods too" stuff, I haven't even mentioned to him, I think his brain would explode.

@CloudsCoveredTheSky, that's really interesting - is the TRA scene not as prevalent or just not 'a thing' in other parts of the world? I don't know enough about it in an international sense.

I've not seen the spaghetti thing but I've found hyper-sexualised campaigns like PETA's really concerning for years. Animal rights, yes, absolutely, but naked women lying in meat trays, etc? Also topless/naked photoshoots being seen as 'empowering', like you say. I'm with your husband, it just baffles me.

As irritating as the fandom stuff is it does kind of make sense from young people, cognitive development not done till about 25 and all that. Not saying that that behavior isn't a serious problem that we need to deal with, but it makes sense. Full grown adults acting that way is odder.

@spartacus I wasn't announcing, I was discussing. I barely post on here so no one would care.

@MrsPhyllisTyne no tra stuff where we are at least. I think it's really a European/US thing.

@TheProdigalKittensReturn I think a lot of parents would be shocked at the shit their kids are looking at online. A Harry Potter fandom sounds lovely in theory.

I am new to this. I first became concerned when I became aware of the Women and Equalities Commission survey last year, which I completed (at the last minute). Since then I have been looking for a good space to watch this discussions, which I found here. I am grateful to all of you for the links and the debate. I am sorry it gets weary for some of you but I guess this happens. For an old sort like me, having watched the progress (sometimes) of women's rights, this is another area that has grabbed my interest (71 and still looking for challenges😊 )

Welcome, highhame! We have at least one regular who I know of who's around your age.

I am trying to stay off social media and do 'real' things instead. So I've contacted my dad's school about their incorrect Equalities policy and been donating every spare penny to GC causes. I still need to go onto social media a bit to know the latest news, but I'm trying to limit it. Yesterday I had a full-blown panic attack after reading something on twitter. Feel like I'm losing my mind.

ladydick

And you’re not transphobic, OP, definitely not, right?

This is exactly why I don’t engage on this echo chamber board.

Have a lovely day everyone!

I agree OP. Focusing on your real- life community is far better, and I'm hoping most posters here do that as well.

is the TRA scene not as prevalent or just not 'a thing' in other parts of the world? I don't know enough about it in an international sense.

So far as I can tell, it's a big thing in the main English -speaking countries - US, Canada, Australia, NZ, UK - but also fairly prevalent in Germany and Scandinavia.

But it may be even more prevalent than that. Recently on Twitter I noticed a Turkish LGBT activist - a gay man - and half his tweets seemed to be about trans stuff. You could tell from the pictures and from the use of the English word 'trans' in the middle of his Turkish-language tweets.

I think I've also seen stuff from Spanish-speaking countries.

I engage in the debate in the real world. Apart from MN, I don't do social media - not Twatter, Fakebook, Insta or anything else. My real concern is the prevalence and effect of TRA misogyny and gynephobia in the real world.

@SoooExtra

ladydick

And you’re not transphobic, OP, definitely not, right?

This is exactly why I don’t engage on this echo chamber board.

Have a lovely day everyone!

The OP was using it in context of the things women have yelled at them online - usually accompanied by rape threats.

We didn't coin the term.

It is the cognitive dissonance that gets me. I see it in the people here who post that they believe women should give up our words for progress. And they absolutely refuse to consider the legal implications for the future.

I often wonder if I am missing something as I am always keen to learn so I continually ask for how to tackle this (what caveats and how will these work) and all I hear crickets and tumbleweed.