Baroness Nicholson 'cancelled' by Booker board

[BaronessSnippyPantsofCroneArmy]

They will not rest until every disobedient woman is purged from society.

www.thebookseller.com/news/booker-prize-nicholson-barr-1207926

"Thinking something and it being the truth are two entirely separate things..."

Two examples of how women's rights have been eroded recently.

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/19/charities-report-rise-in-maltese-requests-for-abortion-pills-during-lockdown

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52899248

You don't need to actively discriminate against women to reduce equality. You just need to assume that men are the default humans. You can't fight for women's rights if you can't talk about sex.

Sorry poppyfileds! yes. I didn't mean to @ you either!

@KayakingOnDown

They are on very shaky ground if they indulge in trial by twitter and don't allow for the possibility that people might have changed their minds.

We are all on very shaky ground as this is the way society seems to operate now.

'And then they came for the writers.'

Yes. This is the Brave New open, questioning World of the Robespierre faction.

www.spectator.co.uk/article/a-simple-solution-to-the-jk-rowling-trans-row

@merrymouse

Someone with homophobic and transphobic views has no place as a public figure head.

She is not transphobic. It is not clear whether her views on same sex marriage have changed, but even if they haven't, they are in line with the teachings of the Church of England which is the established Church in England. You should be aware that religion is a protected characteristic.

'Equality' might not be as straightforward as you think it is.

The queen is the supreme governor of the Church of England, and presumably upholds their teachings. Combine that with being a woman, will she be next to be accused of being transphobic? What worries me is that 20 or 30 years ago there were people campaigning for gay marriage. Had they been silenced in this way marriage equality would never have been achieved. Tolerance should not be a one way street.

teaandtoast123

I have pointed out to people more than once that without freedom of speech many of their dearly held beliefs would not have been embraced. They just look at you like a deer in the headlights.

*They are on very shaky ground if they indulge in trial by twitter and don't allow for the possibility that people might have changed their minds.

We are all on very shaky ground as this is the way society seems to operate now. *

Ain’t that the truth. Our silly kids who are writing all sorts of nonsense right now on social media platforms will have to stand by their 15 year old opinions in 20 years time when the wrong thinkers of tomorrow are pillored. It’s almost sci fi!!

It's disappointing, how few authors come out as GC. We could do with a few more big names. I understand the mid-list and debut authors not wanting to speak up; publishing staff tend to be young and you really never know how woke they are. Cancelled and declined books could be the ruin of us.

In the meantime, here's an author on Twitter promoting a book that looks interesting, about the damage done to transitioning girls. Of course, it's published by a conservative small publisher. A mainstream publisher wouldn't touch something like this.

twitter.com/AbigailShrier/status/1230222085345042433

Damian Barr has just tweeted:
"I've unlocked so I can thank everybody who has done their bit to get the right thing done. I will not be 'politely debating' my right to marry or the right of transpeople to exist because that is not a debate & there's nothing polite about it. Otherwise, normal service resumed."

Many apparently otherwise intelligent people are liking and congratulating him for this staggering piece of gaslighty misinformation (the fecking 'right to exist' bollocks again...) and lauding the victory of 'courage and love' that resulted in Baroness Nicholson's removal.

Of course, any women 'politely debating' their right to name and definite themselves can get to fuck. That's not open to debate either, it seems - changes in the law and language will simply be imposed by the wokerati. So progressive and brave.

The truly frightening thing is that people have bought into this because of the dishonest reporting and misrepresentation. People I just know would pause and look deeper if the facts were laid out without such monstrous bias.

[quote Lamahaha]It's disappointing, how few authors come out as GC. We could do with a few more big names. I understand the mid-list and debut authors not wanting to speak up; publishing staff tend to be young and you really never know how woke they are. Cancelled and declined books could be the ruin of us.

In the meantime, here's an author on Twitter promoting a book that looks interesting, about the damage done to transitioning girls. Of course, it's published by a conservative small publisher. A mainstream publisher wouldn't touch something like this.

twitter.com/AbigailShrier/status/1230222085345042433[/quote]
Not only that, Amazon are refusing to allow her publisher to buy adverts for the book. The Amazon equivalent of YouTube demonetizing a channel, in terms of the impact on her sales.

@CaraDune

You know, I'm about done with this fight.

When I look at the huge list of young women authors merrily giving away their rights, the women on Porth Rugby Team, or Kent Women's Cricket team, the Lisa Nandys of this world saying they see nothing wrong with putting male rapists with intact penises into women's prisons...

I have no skin in this game any more. I'm middle aged. My only child is male - he'll be fine. My sporting days are long past. I'm vanishingly unlikely to end up in prison.

Younger women - you want to live in this world? Fine. Crack on. I'm sure you'll still love it once you get old enough that biology comes back to bite you, or you find yourselves facing a rugby team whose entire front row is 6'3" transwomen.

I tried, I really tried on your behalf. But sometimes there's no helping people.

I feel exactly the same, I’m afraid I’m just done now, this is all very timely for me after a conversation recently with a friend, a normal family woman with daughters who told me that biology and science change and that 2 plus 2 does equal 5 if it’s taught in schools, I felt utterly defeated. I also have no skin in the game, I’m a middle aged woman with no daughters, I have tried and tried to defend women’s rights but I’m done now I can’t do it anymore, my mental health is suffering from it all, we can’t win, it’s just too powerful.

my right to marry or the right of transpeople to exist because that is not a debate & there's nothing polite about it. Otherwise, normal service resumed.

Nobody has debated either.

Of course, any women 'politely debating' their right to name and definite themselves can get to fuck.

I think Damian Barr neither knows nor cares why women might need to be able to talk about sex.

Ironically, I suspect most posters on FWR would disagree with Baroness Nicholson's bill that aimed to reduce the legal limit for abortions to 12 weeks. However, I can't disagree with her if I can't talk about sex, and there will never be a point when women can stop talking about abortions, because it will always be a service that can be taken away.

I’m a middle aged woman with no daughters,

You have son(s)? You might have granddaughters one day!

I have one daughter and two granddaughter and for them I must fight on. Also another one on the way, could be another girl.
But I get that some people are just so exhausted they want to give up. It's two steps forward, one back sometimes.

Not only that, Amazon are refusing to allow her publisher to buy adverts for the book. The Amazon equivalent of YouTube demonetizing a channel, in terms of the impact on her sales.

Awful! Hopefully it will sell through word of mouth.

@CaraDune

You know, I'm about done with this fight.

When I look at the huge list of young women authors merrily giving away their rights, the women on Porth Rugby Team, or Kent Women's Cricket team, the Lisa Nandys of this world saying they see nothing wrong with putting male rapists with intact penises into women's prisons...

I have no skin in this game any more. I'm middle aged. My only child is male - he'll be fine. My sporting days are long past. I'm vanishingly unlikely to end up in prison.

Younger women - you want to live in this world? Fine. Crack on. I'm sure you'll still love it once you get old enough that biology comes back to bite you, or you find yourselves facing a rugby team whose entire front row is 6'3" transwomen.

I tried, I really tried on your behalf. But sometimes there's no helping people.

I agree with this. Sometimes I think that maybe it needs to play out and let the wokesters see what they've lost when they grow up. They can then fight for their rights again. But I have a granddaughter and pretty much all the women in my family are gender critical (except my near 30 year old niece We have to remember that no-one in the real world supports this bollocks. And keep highlighting it and supporting those that are brave enough and able to speak out. And remember that even a year ago we could not have had this level of debate or dissent.

Sometimes I think that maybe it needs to play out and let the wokesters see what they've lost when they grow up

I have daughters and I sometimes reach this point. They are so wilfully blinkered on this, so resolute in their refusal to listen and think*. It's almost as if they're scared to find out things that will make them question the wisdom of their tribe.

And at that point I have to mentally shrug and know that I've tried, and leave them to it.

(*That said, there are signs that the ground is shifting. Small signs, but reasons for optimism.)

THB even if they weren't GC I'd be happy to have people coming out and supporting freedom of thought/speech/democratic political process.

Lamahaha no sons either but I do worry for my young nieces, there is only so much I can take though I’m afraid, I’m David throwing the stones but they never hit the target no matter how hard I try and I’ve no stones left anymore.

You can be out of the ‘game’ but your gender critical views will still be yours, there’s no getting away from it. Just look after yourself and let them eat themselves which they will eventually. That purity spiral is starting to spin faster and faster and the snake will start to eat it’s own tail once they’ve silenced all dissenting voices.

Hypocrites and weasels.

Someone pointed out on twitter that Kenneth Baker (who introduced Section 28 as part of the Thatcher cabinet) was a Booker prize trustee until two years ago.

He didn't get hounded out.

I suppose I just had a vision of finally getting a bit of a pushback going, but doing so in the knowledge that 4 years from now if Starmer keeps playing things the way he is, we'll have a Labour government (which in many, many respects will be a good thing, but will be a fucking disaster for women's rights), then it will be full steam ahead on the legislative front - "gender" will replace "sex" in the EA, we'll have self ID, and probably explicit legislation (like they have in New York City) making misgendering a criminal offence.

I'm not done! Things like this just fire me up! My Dad taught me to stand up to bullies and damn right I will. I form my own views, I don't let others form them for me.

Someone pointed out on twitter that Kenneth Baker (who introduced Section 28 as part of the Thatcher cabinet) was a Booker prize trustee until two years ago.

He didn't get hounded out.

Which illustrates why women are never really 'done' with this nonsense.

@CaraDune

I suppose I just had a vision of finally getting a bit of a pushback going, but doing so in the knowledge that 4 years from now if Starmer keeps playing things the way he is, we'll have a Labour government (which in many, many respects will be a good thing, but will be a fucking disaster for women's rights), then it will be full steam ahead on the legislative front - "gender" will replace "sex" in the EA, we'll have self ID, and probably explicit legislation (like they have in New York City) making misgendering a criminal offence.

That may well happen and the pendulum will swing again.

I was watching a very interesting program last night called A House through Time and he was discussing a house in Bristol which was owned by a wealthy slave trader and charting all its residents. The politics of the era was fascinating snd proved to me that even in the 18th century the politics was weirdly not much difference. The wealthy right wing faction earning their wealth through other peoples misery. The left wing liberals, the underclass. Nothing really changes. It just comes in waves.

If you need a break, take it.

I'm not done. Plenty of us here to take up the slack for a bit. Plenty more coming.