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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Connecticut high school sports transgender policy violates civil rights of female athletes

54 replies

Lamahaha · 28/05/2020 17:34

www.clickondetroit.com/news/national/2020/05/28/connecticut-transgender-policy-found-to-violate-title-ix/

HARTFORD, Conn. – A Connecticut policy that allows transgender athletes to compete in girls sports violates the civil rights of female athletes, the U.S. Education Department's Office for Civil Rights has ruled.

The ruling, which was obtained Thursday by The Associated Press, comes in response to a complaint filed last year by several female track athletes, who argued that two transgender runners who were identified as male at birth had an unfair physical advantage.

Grin
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SarahTancredi · 28/05/2020 23:15

This part of the article/quotes puzzled me.

Connecticut law is clear and students who identify as female are to be recognized as female for all purposes – including high school sports,” the athletic conference said in a statement. “To do otherwise would not only be discriminatory but would deprive high school students of the meaningful opportunity to participate in educational activities, including inter-scholastic sports, based on sex-stereotyping and prejudice sought to be prevented by Title IX and Connecticut state law

Have they heard themselves? Sex stereotyping? Being born female is a stereotype? More so the growing the hair and wearing a skirt?

How do they say it with a straight face

FWRLurker · 29/05/2020 00:11

In bizarro World “sex stereotyping” means thinking someone is less of a woman because they are actually male.

InvisibleWomenMustBeRead · 29/05/2020 00:16

Great news although ridiculous that this is even considered great news given its basic biology & women to matter.

OldCrone · 29/05/2020 00:20

The whole article is absurd. This is how it starts:

Connecticut’s policy allowing transgender girls to compete as girls in high school sports violates the civil rights of athletes who have always identified as female...

What they mean is:

Connecticut’s policy allowing boys to compete as girls in high school sports violates the civil rights of female athletes...

Which makes it much clearer what is actually going on here. And surely nobody in their right mind would think that boys should be able to just say 'I identify as a girl' and immediately be allowed to switch to competing in the female category.

The male and female categories are there because male bodies are different from female bodies, not because male brains are different from female brains. So claiming ladybrain doesn't give you a free pass to switch categories.

SarahTancredi · 29/05/2020 00:25

In bizarro World “sex stereotyping” means thinking someone is less of a woman because they are actually male

But If its not all about stereotypes and indeed being born female is a stereotype then how is claiming to identify as female not admitting it's all about stereotypes because they are identifying as something that's a stereotype?

bettybeans · 29/05/2020 02:44

This is all backwards. They shouldn't be working to justify reasons to exclude TW from female sports, they should have been asked to find evidence to justify inclusion in the first place. You can't be excluded from something you don't and never did belong to.

The common belief that HRT turns males into females is just ridiculous and I will never understand how it gained so much traction. As with most things it comes down to "oh well, maybe so, but what about their feelings eh?" like it plugs the gap in robust rationale and physical form/strength isn't actually all that important in sport. It's mental.

These girls are brilliant though.

MrsNoah2020 · 29/05/2020 06:42

The common belief that HRT turns males into females is just ridiculous and I will never understand how it gained so much traction

Agree, but it is nowhere near as mad as the TRA argument that simply identifying as a woman turns you into one. That is - literally - magical thinking.

ShootsFruitAndLeaves · 29/05/2020 07:51

The actual 45 page letter is here

www.wnpr.org/sites/wnpr/files/202005/ciac__et_al__letter_of_impending_enforcement_action__final.pdf

One complainant student-athlete explained to OCR that no matter how hard she trained,
she felt that she could never be good enough to defeat Students A and B. She also stated that
female student-athletes were missing out on great opportunities to succeed and felt that female
student-athletes could be “completely eradicated from their own sports.” Another complainant
student-athlete explained to OCR that she felt that she could not fairly compete against Students
A and B, because they had a physical advantage over her. In this sense, they were denied the
opportunities that Connecticut male student-athletes had of being able to compete, on a level
playing field, for the benefits that flow from success in competitive athletics. OCR determined
that the participation of Students A and B in girls’ track events resulted in lost benefits and
opportunities for female student-athletes.

Glastonbury, Canton, and Danbury placed female student-athletes in athletic events
against male student-athletes, resulting in competitive disadvantages for female student-athletes.
The athletic events in which the female student-athletes competed were coeducational; female
student-athletes were denied the opportunity to compete in events that were exclusively female,
whereas male student-athletes were able to compete in events that were exclusively male.

Accordingly, the districts’ participation in the athletic events sponsored by the CIAC denied
female student-athletes athletic opportunities that were provided to male student-athletes

On February 17, 2019, Parent 3 sent an email to the CIAC stating that the transgender policy
affected the outcome of the CIAC State Open Girls Indoor Track Championship held on February
16, 2019. Specifically, he stated that the performance of a transgender athlete “with all the
physiological and anatomical attributes of a male athlete” in the Championship had enabled
Bloomfield High School to win the team championship over Glastonbury

He further stated that at the New England Regional Indoor Track Championship, held on March
2, 2019, a biologically male athlete finished first in the 55-meter and 300-meter sprints and had
helped Bloomfield win first place over Glastonbury in the girls’ 4 x 400 meter relay.

Parent 3 stated that when Bloomfield’s girls’ 4 x 400 team recently
competed in the New Balance Nationals, it did so without the participation of its biologically male
athlete, and that this resulted in a slower time than Bloomfield’s team had achieved at the New
England championships, when the biologically male athlete had competed

During an interview with OCR, Student 1 stated that she and other female student-athletes with
whom she had spoken found it very difficult to go into a race knowing that no matter what they
do, they would never be good enough to win. In a video provided by the Complainant, Student 1
asserted that by permitting transgender athletes to participate in girls’ track competitions, she and
other athletes had lost opportunities to compete at track meets, to win titles, and to gain attention
from college coaches.

The Complainant asserted that, pursuant to the Revised Transgender Participation Policy and the
resulting participation of Students A and B, the CIAC denied Student 2 opportunities to advance
to higher levels of competition and/or win titles at events such as the 2017 Outdoor State Open
Championship, held on June 6, 2017; the New England Regional Championship, held on June 10,
2017; the Class S Indoor Championship held on February 10, 2018; the Outdoor State Open
Championship, held on June 4, 2018; the Class S Indoor Championship, held on February 7, 2019;
the Indoor State Open Championship, held on February 16, 2019; the Class S Outdoor
Championship, held on May 30, 2019; and the Outdoor State Open Championship, held on June
3, 2019.

Student 2’s mother (Parent 1) noted that some
biologically female track student-athletes had lost out on media recognition because the winner of
an event at the state championships gets the opportunity to be interviewed by reporters, while the
second and third place finishers do not. Specifically, Parent 1 stated that at the state championships
there is a bank of reporters waiting to interview the winners and the winners’ names are put in the
local papers, and that student-athletes typically do not receive any media recognition when they
come in second. Further, Student 2 stated that the participation of Student A, in particular, had an
impact on her ability to set class records for the CIAC Class S 100-meter and 200-meter races.

During school year 2017-2018, in the Indoor State Open Championships, Student B [trans] participated in the 55-meter dash. In the preliminary for the 55-meter dash, Student B
placed 2nd The top 8 finishers advanced to the finals;
however, ... Student B’s finish in the top 8 in the preliminary denied an
opportunity for the 9th place finisher to advance to the finals.

In the finals of
the 100-meter dash, Student A placed 1st, Student B placed 2nd; Student 2 placed 4th;
Page 19 of 45 – Case Nos. 01-19-4025, 01-19-1252, 01-20-1003, 01-20-1004, 01-20-1005, 01-
20-1006, and 01-20-1007
and Student 1 placed 6th. The top six finishers were awarded medals and advanced to
the New England Regional Championships, including Student 1 and Student 2;

During school year 2018-2019, in the Indoor Class S Statewide Championships,
Student A and Student B participated in the 55-meter dash. In the preliminary for the
55-meter dash, Student A placed 1st and Student B placed 2nd. The top 7 finishers
advanced to the finals, including Student 2 (who placed 3rd); however, Student A’s and
Student B’s finishes in the top 7 in the preliminary denied an opportunity for two female
student-athletes to advance to the finals. In the finals of the 55-meter dash, Student A
placed 1st, Student 2 placed 2nd, and Student B placed 3rd. The top 14 finishers
advanced to the State Open Championship. While all three student-athletes advanced
to the State Open Championship, Student A’s and Student B’s participation denied an
opportunity to two female student-athletes to participate in the State Open
Championship for the 55-meter dash.38

however, Student A’s and Student B’s finishes in 1st and 2nd place, respectively, denied
an opportunity for two female student-athletes to advance to the New England Regional
Championships, along with the benefit of receiving a medal for the Outdoor State Open
Championships.

and it continues detailing numerous occasions where girls were denied opportunities because of the presence of biological males.

In an email dated January 27, 2019, to School 1 administrators, Parent 3 alleged that Student A,
whom Parent 3 identified as a boy who identifies as a girl, was participating in track and creating
an unfair and unsafe environment in girls track. He provided, as an example, that during the 4 x
400 relay event on January 26, 2019, in the second leg, Student A “had physicality” with a runner
from Windsor, resulting in a significant lead for Bloomfield. The student-athlete running the last
leg of the relay for Windsor was unable to close the gap that Student A had created. He also
provided an example that at the Yale Invitational held on January 12, 2019, a student-athlete came
in second to Student A, despite having run a faster time than 182 other girls in the 300-meter sprint.

In an email dated February 17, 2019, to School 1 administrators and the CIAC Executive Director,
among others, Parent 3 asserted that the Revised Transgender Participation Policy directly affected
the outcome of School 1’s winning the 2018-2019 Indoor State Open Championship held on
February 16, 2019. Specifically, Parent 3 stated that School A2 earned the highest number of
points due to the participation of Student A, who earned 20 points for the team by herself. Parent
3 alleged that, but for Student A’s participation, School 1 would have won the state title.
Specifically, Parent 3 asserted that School A2 was only able to win because Student A placed first
in two separate events, earning School A2’s team 20 of its total 54 points.

Parent 4 further stated that
recognizing the transgender athletes’ results insulted the current cisgender athlete record holders

Parent 3 stated that at the New England
Regionals on March 2, 2019, a Bloomfield transgender athlete (Student A) placed first in the 55-
meter and 300-meter dash events. He also stated that by participating in the 4 x 400-meter relay
event, Student A provided Bloomfield with a .06 second lead over Glastonbury in the final results.

He then noted that at the New Balance National championships held over
March 8-10, 2019, Glastonbury’s 4 x 400 relay team came in 14th in the nation, while Bloomfield’s
came in 34th, running without Student A.

With respect to the three student-athletes on whose behalf the complaint was filed (Student 1,
Student 2, and Student 3), Student A’s and Student B’s 1st and 2nd place finishes, respectively, in
the preliminaries of the 2018-2019 Indoor State Open Championship for the 55-meter dash, denied
Student 1, who placed 8th, the opportunity of advancing to the finals in this event, since only the
top 7 finishers advanced to the finals. Student A’s and Student B’s participation in girls’
interscholastic track in the state of Connecticut, pursuant to the Revised Transgender Participation
Policy had the most significant impact on Student 2. Specifically, Student A’s 1st place finish, in
the finals of the 2018-2019 Outdoor Class S Statewide Championship for the 100-meter dash and
the 200-meter dash, denied Student 2, who placed 2nd in both events, the benefit of a 1st place
finish; and Student A’s and Student B’s 1st and 2nd place finishes, in the 2018-2019 Indoor State
Open Championship for the 55-meter dash, denied an opportunity for Student 2, who placed 3rd
,
to place 1st in the event and receive the benefit of a 1st place medal. Denying a female student a
chance to win a championship is inconsistent with Title IX’s mandate of equal opportunity for
both sexes.48

AnyOldPrion · 29/05/2020 08:16

Thanks Shoots.

While it is good news, the entire article is so steeped in Newspeak so as to make it almost impossible to understand. I long for the return of sensible English. I know there’s a good chance we’re on our way because this nonsense is so contrived it won’t last, but in the meantime it's both sickening and wearisome.

SocialConnection · 29/05/2020 08:20

<a class="break-all" href="https://thehill.com/changing-america/respect/equality/499960-us-rules-against-state-allowing-transgender-athletes-to?amp#click=t.co/HToDCzRpUM" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">thehill.com/changing-america/respect/equality/499960-us-rules-against-state-allowing-transgender-athletes-to?amp#click=t.co/HToDCzRpUM

Lamahaha · 29/05/2020 08:26

@AnyOldPrion

Thanks Shoots.

While it is good news, the entire article is so steeped in Newspeak so as to make it almost impossible to understand. I long for the return of sensible English. I know there’s a good chance we’re on our way because this nonsense is so contrived it won’t last, but in the meantime it's both sickening and wearisome.

Isn't it (sickening, wearisome)?

(The quote system is lovely, but is it possible to edit the quote? Like cut parts of it, highlight parts?)

All of the older people parroting these words actually grew up knowing that there are two sexes, and only changed their minds recently -- unlike the younger ones who have been hearing it perhaps for most of their lives.
It's extraordinary to hear (what one presumes to be) a mature judge saying that boys are actually girls and must be referred to as "she" in court. I mean, how long has he believed this, and does he really believe it? Usually the ideas we grew up with are so ingrained we can't change them overnight because of some new trend.

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TheWordWomanIsTaken · 29/05/2020 14:48

It's extraordinary to hear (what one presumes to be) a mature judge saying that boys are actually girls and must be referred to as "she" in court. I mean, how long has he believed this, and does he really believe it? Usually the ideas we grew up with are so ingrained we can't change them overnight because of some new trend

Interesting isn't it?
AGP?

RuffleCrow · 29/05/2020 14:53

Yes! Feeling very proud of those Connecticut girls right now. It's awful that there was no-one else willing to fight their battle with/for them though. As ever, females find themselves out on a limb challenging male power.

RuffleCrow · 29/05/2020 14:56

And we can't rely on the guardian for anything but Genderwang

Ursula2001 · 30/05/2020 03:01

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

ShootsFruitAndLeaves · 30/05/2020 09:53

A crippled horse is not a greyhound, and does not belong in the same race.

Testosterone makes males permanently larger and stronger during puberty, while oestrogen makes females permanently shorter and with more fat to carry around.

SarahTancredi · 30/05/2020 10:24

Doesnt oestrogen in males also help keep the bone density. Womens levels fall in later life and can lead to osteoporosis. But when a man takes oestrogen in sure I read it actually helps maintain their bones so in fact offers an advantage not a hindrance

CaraDune · 30/05/2020 10:59

There was an excellent study from the Karolinska institute about a year ago, looking at testosterone/oestrogen and muscle strength. Basically, androgen blockers and oestrogen lower a male's strength relative to other men, but not to the same level as women (even to women on testosterone). The plot I'm thinking of was a box and whiskers plot (95% levels shown), so not only were there clear differences in the means for the four populations, there was very little overlap between the populations.

The study also found that the differences between men and women were about 10% in track events, rising to closer to 30% in events like powerlifting.

So when trans athletes say "I started hormone treatment and my strength just dropped off so now I'm like a woman" what they actually mean is "I'm noticeably less strong than I was before, and I conceptualise this as being like a woman", when in fact it isn't - they've lost nowhere near that much strength.

And in any case Yarwood and friend started out competing against girls with bodies which had been through male puberty and had at that stage been subjected to no hormone treatment whatsoever - I don't know what the state of their medical treatment is now, but when the issue first hit the news, they were to all intents and purposes in a biological sense fully male-bodied athletes, competing in women's races.

ITonyah · 30/05/2020 11:03

I hate it being called HRT in this instance.

It is NOT a replacement therapy.

CaraDune · 30/05/2020 11:05

@ITonyah

I hate it being called HRT in this instance.

It is NOT a replacement therapy.

Me too - that's why I try to be careful to refer to it as hormone treatment, not HRT, because as you say it's not replacing anything.
Winesalot · 01/06/2020 07:32

Watching Tennessee closely now too.

www.metroweekly.com/2020/05/amid-pandemic-tennessee-republicans-prioritize-anti-trans-legislation/

Lamahaha · 02/06/2020 09:40

I feel truly sorry for GC American women. This is an article posted on Forbes, a magazine I thought was respectable. It is horribly biased, even though it is not an opinion piece.

The headline reads: Betsy DeVos Tells Connecticut: Ban Transgender Athletes, Or Say Goodbye To Your Federal Funding which is incorrect -- these boys can still compete, as boys, they are not banned.

But the writer thinks they are girls. The first sentence begins: Allowing transgender girls to compete in school sports with girls who are not transgender is a violation of federal law... So, two types of girls, transgender and not-transgender. Envy < not envy.

The author is a young "Dawn Ennis Contributor
Diversity & Inclusion
I report on the fight for transgender equality and other LGBTQ issues."

Strangely, no pronouns added, how very unwoke!

I could pick this whole article apart but I won't, I just wanted to rant here. I wonder if she (yes, assuming gender there!) has ever asked herself why trans "boys" don't compete with "non trans boys"?

www.forbes.com/sites/dawnstaceyennis/2020/05/29/betsy-devos-tells-connecticut-ban-transgender-athletes-or-say-goodbye-to-your-federal-funding/?fbclid=IwAR227bIEJw1LLoQFFMwYwmah_vHcYavsUSr-sY5DvKgX8BtWjCDkYxLlNos#6db5f5f21793

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EverylittleAlps · 02/06/2020 10:00

Dawn 'I am the only female listed as a graduate of my all-boys Catholic high school' Ennis.

Dawn 'I have inherited the best job in the world, of being a mom to my kids, who they call “dad” Ennis.

andyoldlabour · 02/06/2020 10:16

MrsNoah2020
"Agree, but it is nowhere near as mad as the TRA argument that simply identifying as a woman turns you into one. That is - literally - magical thinking."

Whilst we know it is mad, it would seem that all of the Labour leadership and deputy leadership candidates refused to recognise the problem.
It was also the case with the IOC in 2015, when the entire committee was persuaded by a deeply flawed study, provided to them by transwoman Joanna Harper, which set out why transgender athletes lost all their strength and speed once they had transitioned.

Lamahaha · 02/06/2020 10:36

@EverylittleAlps

Dawn 'I am the only female listed as a graduate of my all-boys Catholic high school' Ennis.

Dawn 'I have inherited the best job in the world, of being a mom to my kids, who they call “dad” Ennis.

Well that explains a lot.
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