Diversity dolls suggestions

[SirenFox]

Hi everyone. This is my first time making a post so I hope I'm doing it right and don't break any rules. With this time on my hands during lockdown I'm thinking of making some more diverse/inclusive dolls. As a child especially for young girls I think it's super important to see themselves represented. I know Mattel tried to make some diverse barbies but I was wondering if there are any bases that haven't been covered. Do you have special daughter who you wish could see herself represented in dolls? Help me out with some suggestions. Ideas already:

• Different races and cultures
• Varied sizes and weights
• Wheelchair
• Hearing aid
• Amputee and/or prosthetic limb(s)
• Cystic fibrosis (potentially oxygen tank and tubes)
• Bald and short hair
• 'Excess' body/facial hair

I didn't feel that the 'Toys and Games' section was right for this and I feel that diversity and inclusivity is a feminist issue close to my heart. Let me know if you have any other thoughts about this or something that hasn't occurred to me, as you guys and your kids are the target audience after all. I am trying to do something kind so hopefully nobody finds this offensive.

Thanks in advance.

I would suggest trying the Multicultural Families section.

Dolls aren't just for girls you know. You are just reinforcing sexist stereotypes here.

Thank you @drspouse I will certainly be asking their advice when it comes to different races and cultures, I wouldn't want to make a faux-pas with traditional dress or anything.

Thanks for your feedback @Bercows, any dolls that I will make can be played with by any gender child.

@Bercows what a deliberately unkind and unnecessary post. Hope you’re feeling pleased with yourself

Dolls with insulin pumps would be good for kids with T1 diabetes

My baby has 2 little webbed toes 🙊 hehe

My daughter is white but with very dark thick curly hair and I can't find a doll that looks like her anywhere. Its either curly hair with black skin, or white skin with straight (usually blonde) hair. That might sound trivial but I experienced terrible bullying for having curly hair at school. I got racist abuse, had groups of girls try and pin me down and straighten my hair, one boy even tried to set fire to my hair with his lighter on the school bus! Everyone I knew had straight hair and I grew up absolutely hating my curls and spent hundreds of pounds and hours of my time trying to straighten them. Now in my 30s I've learned to love them but the curl has largely relaxed since having kids. I really regret not appreciating my tight ringlets when I had the chance. Now my daughter has the same kind of hair I had but all the books and toys out there about loving your curly hair are targeted at black children.

Bercows post was completely relevant to the topic and this board - nothing 'unkind' about it.

While the idea is well meant, there seems like a risk that some of this 'diversity' might in the products translate as 'accessories' ... would that actually be helpful?

I've not got much idea as my DD much preferred playing with her large collection of toy dogs (who had anthropomorphised roles in various imaginative play) rather than dolls. The physical form of the toys wasn't important, it was perhaps easier to superimpose her imagination on a toy which didn't look like a specific type of person IYSWIM?

Also I've noticed that any dolls with GNC aspects (short hair, boyish clothes etc) only have one of those things and the rest is hyper feminine to balance it out (I think maybe its apologetic). So a doll with very short hair will have lots of flowery clips in it or a pink frilly dress, a doll in board shorts and a t-shirt will have very long or overly styled hair etc. They can never just be fully GNC, there has to be some corresponding level of feminity.

@ErrolTheDragon it was unkind imo but we can disagree on that. She didn’t address the OP’s question but jumped on her use of the word daughter!
To be honest I didn’t realise this was in Feminism chat when I first replied so I wouldn’t have replied if I’d realised as I generally avoid this board!

My ds has a hidden disability and I wonder how that could be represented in a doll. Sunflower lanyard?

It's unkind to point out when sexist stereotypes are being reinforced? This is feminism chat, not AIBU. Sexist Stereotypes are what we fight against and many of us don't hold with any of the gender nonsense either. Yes, OP may be well-intentioned but the post comes across as sexist. Thanks Errol

@ByGrabtharsHammerWhatASavings have you tried a cabbage patch doll? I found exactly the right combo of skin colour and hair/eye shade to match my daughter. They do so many different combos. I have definitely seen a doll that matches what you want during my rummage on the shelves at Smyths to find the best match for us!

AFAIK people with cystic fibrosis often only need oxygen when they're in hospital and in a bad way - it's not exactly a nice time for them so I'm not sure a doll focused on that is going to be a winner.

They use nebulizers on a daily basis and take a shitload of drugs.

And I have a rare condition which made me have excess body and facial hair which means I was bullied horrifically through my whole childhood. I would not have wanted a doll that highlighted my most hated feature of myself when usually I tried to pretend that it didn't exist. I played with Disney Princess dolls, or barbies who did things I liked, like horse riding and dancing.

I expect I'll get told off for being negative but you need to do a lot of research with the people you're actually expecting to buy the dolls

Barbie has already covered most of what you are thinking OP- including a bald doll.

There isn't really a niche market to be had for diverse dolls as they are already out there- in short it wouldn't make good business sense to try and compete with the brands of off the shelf dolls, however you could explore making dolls to order ?

@ByGrabtharsHammerWhatASavings - thanks for your feedback, it does not sound trivial at all and I'm so sorry to hear about your experiences!

@ErrolTheDragon - noted thank you. It is just as important to hear from parents of kids who would not be interested in such dolls. As a child my own favourite toys were shampoo bottles in the bath each with families and personalities and storylines, so I am totally with your DD on that one.

@CanICelebrate @Bercows maybe I should have been more mindful given the board I am using but it is my first time here. It tends to be more of a topic amongst AFAB folk that they did not feel represented by dolls and it was harmful, maybe AMAB folk do not voice their concerns about this topic as frequently if they have felt the same way. I admit I had young girls especially in mind for my dolls for that reason, and I do not think it's sexist to market certain items for certain demographics and directly ask the according target market. Parents of sons and NB children are not excluded from contributing though, and I would have appreciated input such as "my son loves dolls and wishes he could see more boy dolls".

Oh cool *Georgialondon" I hadn't looked at them. I'll take a look, thanks :) Should add for the op that my comments so far relate to rag dolls. I haven't looked into barbie-esque dolls as I personally find them a bit creepy! But my nice got one for her last birthday which was a doctor barbie who looked about a size 12,which I thought was cool. I actually think dolls are great toys as they're brilliant for social play, but obviously that kind of play needs to be valued for boys as much as for girls.

@LesleysChestnutBob thank you very much for your input, this is exactly what I was hoping to hear and from people with lived experiences. I have to admit I have been watching Bates Motel and there is a young lady with CF who carries around an oxygen tank with tubes at all times and that was on my mind. These are also just ideas to jog people's minds to other suggestions.

@FreeKitties thank you for your advice, I don't want to be too specific about the details but I will not be competing with barbies and my idea is very different

'Diversity' is so ... well, diverse, that I wonder if it would be more productive to focus on a specific aspect? A thought off the top of my head was that a lot of dolls and their accessories are too darned fiddly - barbie clothes which are so tight they're hard to get on for instance. I'm sure there are various ranges already which aren't as bad but that led me to wonder if there were dolls suitable for children with specific impairments - physical, sight etc. This type of thing would require serious research to get right - a doll for a visually impaired child would (I guess) have to have good tactile qualities - no hard plastic - perhaps responsive to touch (thinking of the furreal animal toys ... gentle touch rewarded) ... not a trivial matter of externalities?

Tbh I don't think dolls are particularly useful in teaching diversity (beyond representing different ethnicities) unless used in a setting with someone trained in play therapy.

I suppose what I'm getting at is that dolls are one dimensional and inanimate, a doll in a wheelchair or with only one leg isn't teaching anything without a background or a narrative etc... I think books are a much better resource because stories can provide context, nuance and build a picture of diversity much better.

I don't mean to be overly critical of your idea because perhaps for some they would be beneficial. Maybe a set with a doll and book about who she/he is beyond just the surface disability would work in conjunction with each other.

What can be harmful, OP, is the notion that 'gender' is 'assigned' at birth .... sex is observed, and then each child should be treated as an individual rather than being subjected to gender stereotypes such as girls playing with dolls and boys not. All children are 'non binary' - none inherently conforms completely to one or other sets of stereotypes.

Get away from the narrow 'AFAB' and 'NB' mindset if you can!

Wow Errol, never thought of it like that, what a sensible idea

@ErrolTheDragon I just used the phrases AMAB and AFAB so's not to offend anyone. It seems I cannot write anything without saying something wrong. I have heard stories of young teenagers who say themselves that they transitioned to be men because they didn't feel they could ever achieve the acceptable 'woman' role that society had shown was the only way. It wouldn't be true to say that this is an issue just for girls, as some of those girls are now transmen. That is a conversation for another time, but that's why I said I believe this doll representation issue affects AFAB folk more, or their issues about it are voiced more loudly and frequently.

I agree wholeheartedly with you that you should see your child as an individual and their sex/gender should have almost no bearing on the way you teach them to play with toys or otherwise. You should neither form an expectation to play a certain way because of their gender, or see the way they play and then conclude a gender from it.

It is not a mistake to say that the majority of parents that buy dolls are buying them for their daughters. Maybe that is a problem with society and the way we view gender or maybe it's something innate. My brother played with dolls and barbies with me but they were bought for me, sadly it may never have become apparent that those were his preferred toys if he had never had a sister with dolls. That's why I think it's understandable that I addressed parents of daughters in my post, we cannot deny the fact that they are the majority of doll-buyers by a large margin.

Bercows was being helpful, not unkind.

OP, I love your idea, and would have liked a doll that wore glasses.

But please, please don’t believe the nonsense about AMAB and AFAB. A baby’s sex is observed at birth, not assigned. All that can be ‘assigned’ is a restrictive and sexist gender stereotype. Thank god those were dying out in the late 20th century, but transactivists have brought them storming back.

My favourite toys, when i was a little girl, were any tools I could ‘borrow’ from my dad’s toolbox. My parents banned this, not to enforce a sexist stereotype, but to save me from sawing my fingers off.